| Author | Message | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 311 Registered: 1-2003 |
Here in the UK, "spring has sprung". Well that's how I think the phrase goes anyway... What that means, is that my basses need their set-up reviewing. I run them low, as I'm sure the people in this Club have gathered over the time I've been a regular in here. I know what you might be thinking - "here we go, Rog slagging off the neck of the DW once again". I'm going to surprise you - the graphite necks on the Stealth and the Buzzard have moved the same amount as the Alembic. No problems with that, I've set them up again. However... ...the frets have started to protrude outside of the bounds of the neck on the DW - both at the top and bottom of the neck, to equal amounts. It wasn't like this a week ago - I'm stunned. I lemon oiled the fretboard about six weeks ago, that's the second time it's been done in 11 months since I've owned it, so I don't think it's that that is causing the problem. I enlisted Jacqueline's opinion - she can't play a note. Her quote - "Has this just become expensive art, you can't play it like that. You're not going to sell it are you? Don't do that.". I'm after guidance here and any quotes of "this is normal with Alembic" won't be tolerated because I've owned a shed-load of fretted basses from various manufacturers over the years and none of them have ever had a fret problem like this. Help - what next? I know that when you buy a thoroughbred that there are going to be problems, but this fret problem seems to be fundamental to me?! Not happy!! Roger | ||
| the_mule
Senior Member Username: the_mule Post Number: 453 Registered: 1-2004 |
From the online owners manual under 'Fingerboard Care'... "You may notice that the first time the humidity takes a big swing that the fret edges may protrude over the edge of the fingerboard. These can be easily filed flush and you will probably only have to do this once. You can get a service sheet from us if you'd like to do this job yourself." I won't say that "this is normal with Alembic" but according to the text above it isn't unusual with a NEW Alembic. Nevertheless I can understand your not being happy about this. I hope you will work it out somehow, it it presented like a DIY-job, although I doubt if I'd have the guts to actually do it myself. Good luck! Wilfred | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 312 Registered: 1-2003 |
Oh my God!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks for your help Wilfred and by no means are the following comments directed at you...but do I really have to work on the DW myself? "Service Sheets" have never been required for other fretted basses that I have owned or currently owned! I have to ask this - would anyone in here wish to "do this job yourself" on a bass that cost the thick end of - errr well - it cost a lot. POA if you really want to know. Not happy, not happy at all. If TVR told me I had to work on my own car after 12 months because the humidity had changed, I'd laugh in their face. Now where is the Ferrari brochure.....? Oh yes - I already have it - it's spelt Status Graphite! Alembic - expensive art indeed... | ||
| the_mule
Senior Member Username: the_mule Post Number: 454 Registered: 1-2004 |
Have you contacted Alembic about this already? Like I already said: "I doubt if I'd have the guts to actually do it myself". Concerning your bass, of which I happen to know the selling price and with that fabulous inlay in mind: "I wouldn't do it myself unless there was a gun pointed at my head". Apparently it takes some time for wood to realise that it's not a tree anymore, and that a change of seasons shouldn't influence a bass. A new bass, like a new car, usually needs some extra service in the first few months of its life. I'm sure that with a Morgan (another fine English sportscar) the wooden chassis might cause similar problems with doors not closing properly sometimes! Don't get me wrong, I completely understand and feel your anger and disappointment, but if what the online user manual says about this phenomenon is true, a local luthier should be able to fix the problem in a matter of minutes. Certainly worth a try, isn't it? Wilfred | ||
| jacko
Intermediate Member Username: jacko Post Number: 132 Registered: 10-2002 |
Roger. I've had the same problem with my epic for the best part of 8 years and never had the guts to file the frets myself. i guess I'm pretty well used to the feel now although if you do end up filing them yourself let me know how you get on as it's something I ought to get done. graeme | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 800 Registered: 3-2004 |
I think Roger's point is that one spends enough on the instrument that one shouldn't have to spend further money on setup or trust a "local luthier" to be filing around the neck of a brand new super-bass. I suppose that this could be a service provided by the dealer from whom the instrument was purchased, but not all dealers are capable of the work. Really, though, I think it's the surprise factor that got him more than the change itself. If this were more common knowledge and anticipated as part of what you get when you buy a brand new Alembic, then I don't think it would have been as big a deal. At least it won't be for me now that I am aware of it. If mine needs it, I will acquire the Alembic-recommended file or files and do it myself, very slowly. Hopefully the instrument will spend enough time at the factory to have already gone through this change and come out perfect. If not, New England weather will let me know in due time. -Bob (looking out at 8" of fresh snow and watching more continue to fall) | ||
| malthumb
Advanced Member Username: malthumb Post Number: 307 Registered: 5-2002 |
Actually, it's probably not fair to say that this is a quirk of Alembic basses. My understanding from people I've talked to in numerous settings, is that this is a quirk of ebony fretboards. New ebony fretboards on new basses can (but don't always) experience some shrinkage. Both Bass Northwest and GGuitars (where I eventually ordered my bass from)explained to me that they would keep my new bass isolated in a temperature controlled room for a few days to try to identify whether it would experience fretboard shrinkage. Then they could file the frets and be done with it. They both indicated that IF this occurs, it occurs once. As it turned out, I had Alembic ship my bass directly to me instead of GGuitars and I watched like a hawk for any sign of shrinkage. Didn't happen. Been almost 5 years now. One of the two stores expressed the opinion that if it didn't occur in the first 12 - 18 months, it probably would not ever. Peace, James | ||
| dannobasso
Advanced Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 225 Registered: 3-2004 |
I just did a DIY fret file on 5 of my 10 babies. I couldn't wairt for a file from Mica. I went down to Sears and bought a needle file set with six small files in it. I got the directions from Mica (available as a download) and went to town. If you take your time you can be pleased with the results. No more scratches and chaffing of my important finger! There was a time when I would not do work on my Alembics. Frig dat now! I do all my own adjustments and frankly I don't trust the Neanderthals in the North Jersey area. I now keep the file set in with my bag 'o' tools just in case. Trust in yourself you must, feel the force Luke, there is no try.......DO! Danno | ||
| jacko
Intermediate Member Username: jacko Post Number: 133 Registered: 10-2002 |
How about sharing your technique with us danno? graeme | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 801 Registered: 3-2004 |
This sounds like a good topic to cover in the new "must read" section of the boards. The fact that it occurs, what size file to use, and any other details about how to resolve it. | ||
| essencetimestwo
Member Username: essencetimestwo Post Number: 71 Registered: 8-2003 |
I had to do it on the 1987 Spoiler I just got. Frets out on both sides, OUCH! It only took five minutes with a set of small files I was given by a friend. Much better now. I am getting braver about making my own adjustments too. Granted, this was only a $1000.00 Alembic. Keep in mind though that it was made by the same people in the same place as a DW. I live close to SR but this bass came from ultra dry TX. The great thing about Alembics is that they are so easy to work on. On another popular thread people are talking about the pros and cons of maple fingerboards. Imagine if this were happening with a Fender finished maple fingerboard. Rogertv I am sure that Mica and gang would be more than willing to do what it takes to make you happy. Heck, I had to bring my new GMC pickup back after the first 1000 miles so they could tighten the bolts. | ||
| s_wood
Intermediate Member Username: s_wood Post Number: 120 Registered: 5-2002 |
Malthumb has it exactly right. Fingerboard shrinkage is a quirk of ebony fingerboards, and there's really nothing that Alembic or anyone else can do to prevent it. If it happens (and it doesn't always) it will happen only once. Any good luthier can file the frets is a few minutes (I've always been too scared to do it myself!) | ||
| dannobasso
Advanced Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 226 Registered: 3-2004 |
Embrace your fear members! The techniqueis simple. Perhaps the download for directions is on the site somewhere. Mica sent it to me. Maybe the moderators can post it in the FAQ section? There are basicly 2 directions to file. One is the side of the fretboard where the fret protrudes. I move the file perpendicular to the fret, A good file will make quick work of it in a few passes. Go lightly at first to test your technique. When you get a tiny bit of ebony dust, check by a feel of your finger. Alembic directs that you do this with the strings off and the neck relieved of tension. Next, I follow the curve of the end of the fret and file LIGHTLY from the top of the fret edge over and down to the egde of the fretboard. I experimented with a small round edge needle file for this second pass so I could concentrate on the fret as much as possible and not take that much material from the ebony. It worked for me. Also the money I saved gets sent to Santa Rosa for my latest baby! Embrace your inner luthier. Well, maybe not that, but embrace your inner fret scraper anyway. Danno | ||
| keith_h
New Username: keith_h Post Number: 9 Registered: 2-2005 |
I have had this situation with both of my Alembics purchased since last August. Both necks shrunk as the result of very low humidity in my house due to the furnace. I took them to a local luthier to have the fret ends filed and was charged $25. Not a signifigant amount of money considering the cost on the instruments. Since having the ends filed I have not had any more problems. I have seen this on one of my other non-Alembic basses but since it has a bound neck there are no sharp protrusions, just bumps. Keith | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 313 Registered: 1-2003 |
Unfortunately, I haven't had a job since December and there isn't any sign of one arriving soon. So I can do without incurring any cost with this little problem, however small that cost may be. As it's too uncomfortable to play as it stands, I think I'll remove the batteries from it and put it in its case, and worry about it at some point in the future... | ||
| dfung60
Member Username: dfung60 Post Number: 72 Registered: 5-2002 |
Roger - Sorry to hear about the job situation on top of the DW situation. Your frustration is understandable, but as many have posted here, this isn't a manufacturing defect - it's just a byproduct of natural materials. Ebony is used in the fingerboard because it's dense, hard, and has a high internal oil content. No matter how long you season/dry the wood before working with it, the act of carving it into your fingerboard exposes a new surface and that new surface will be more subject to shrinkage and environmental sensitivity than the blank it came from. Alembic is careful to properly maintain optimal humidity in their shop but unless you live in Hawaii or the Phillipines, winter for you or I will be much, much drier. That dry environment causes the fingerboard to shrink, exposing the fret ends. The surface of the tangs of the frets keep the fret ends from pulling back in when the humidity increases during the warmer months. So, you really can expect this to be a one-time fix. All that said, I would highly recommend you take it to a professional luthier for the fix, despite the good results people report here. First of all, smoothing fret ends will be a no-brainer for anybody qualified. They will have the proper tools and experience. For example, nobody here mentioned masking the fingerboard edges and surface, which I believe would be normal practice for a pro to prevent scratches from stray strokes (hey, you're going to have 48 edges to take down). This is less of a big deal than for fret levelling where the fret tops are in play, but your instrument will allow the rare opportunity for a simple slip to cause literally thousands of dollars of damage - don't let it happen. There's another reason that you may not really want to think about too much. If you make an error and round off the fret end too much (or irregularly among those 48 fret ends), then this may require replacement of one or more frets. This is already slightly pricey with your garden variety Fender. With a full neck inlay and an LED strip running down the edge of the neck, the simple act of pulling the frets is now a major, major undertaking, and you'll find that many good luthiers will refuse to do the work outright or only at a very great cost. I have a graphite-necked Series II, just oval inlays, but side LEDs (and no truss rod). When I recently wanted to have a relief adjustment, a number of highly qualified luthiers in SF were unwilling to work on it, on the chance that the relief change I needed was going to require a full refret. I was able to get the work done by my favorite tech after I convinced him to take a good look at it and convince himself that it would only involve milling the frets rather than refretting. It had always had marginal relief from when I picked it up new from the factory in 1987, but it was only a few years ago that I decided to actually get it fixed. Part of having a "sports car" is that an oil change that would cost $59 on your Honda will cost $600 on your Ferrari. On some levels that really sucks; on the other hand, you *do* get to drive a Ferrari. In this case, I suspect that Alembic would probably fix the problem if you could get it in their hands, and that it will probably cost more to ship it to them and back than a local repairman would charge to address the problem. Best of luck, David Fung | ||
| bob
Advanced Member Username: bob Post Number: 379 Registered: 11-2002 |
Roger, I'm also sorry to hear about your problem (that should be plural, counting your job), but encourage you to take a few deep breaths and try to get past it. Aren't you the one who donated a month's worth of beer money to tsunami relief? My guess is you could find a qualified person to get you playing again for less than that. The DW doesn't belong in a case, with no batteries. Ebony shrinks. It's not anyone's fault. I don't even have frets, but I have a shrinkage problem with my neck laminates. I had the bass for a few months, and then suddenly - over the course of about two weeks, with no obvious weather change (and less than two hours south of Santa Rosa) the neck lams shrunk. Mica said my case was a bit unusual, because normally it becomes obvious on the flat portion going through the body, whereas on mine that remained almost perfectly smooth, but I suddenly had all these ridges in the neck. As for the timing, I know my neck was built much earlier, so most likely I was in the range of 12-15 months. It was really surprising just how suddenly it happened. I too had a moment of thinking, geez, I spent all this money on a fancy custom bass and now my satin neck feels like it has grooves in it??? But then I noticed that once I put that aside and just played, I didn't notice it at all... Yes, one day I will drive up there and get it smoothed out (I'd do frets myself, but not neck shaping), but there is really no rush in my case. Sharp protrusions are a much more urgent problem, but as others have explained it really isn't a big deal to take care of and should be a one time thing. David makes a good point, that someone with the right experience will be able to do the job easily, and avoid the stupid mistakes that first-timers might make, like forgetting to mask and then slipping (especially if feeling a bit aggravated by the whole thing...). If you have someone local, whom you trust (really trust) and feel is competent, perhaps you might consider loaning them your bass for a week in exchange for the work? After all, it's just going to be sitting in the case anyway, right? Just a thought. -Bob (Message edited by bob on March 14, 2005) | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 314 Registered: 1-2003 |
I appreciate everyone's comments here, thanks for your input and support folks. It *** is *** the surprise factor that has both annoyed and disappointed me with this problem. If I'd known that this could happen, when it did I'd be saying 'Oh right - it's happened - now what?' as opposed to 'what on earth is going on here????'. Jacqueline works for the company who insure the DW, so I'm in the fortunate position of being able to get sound and trusted facts when it comes to insurance. It is only insured whilst it is in the house - to take it out (i.e. to a luthier to be fixed because I'm not sure I want to tackle this myself) is going to add a payment of £50 (pro rata for the rest of its insruance year) to take it out of the house. Not to mention the cost of the work, let alone finding someone to do it. It's money I can't afford, not at the moment. So I'm a little between a rock and a hard place at the moment...I either do it myself or it has to wait. Rog | ||
| drjenney
Junior Username: drjenney Post Number: 13 Registered: 11-2004 |
Rog, Collectors of antique furniture have a similar problem. It's only in the last 50 years or so that we have lived in homes w/such very low humidity. While nice for us humans, it can be brutal on solid wood products of all kinds. Hot and dry air is the worst of all possible cases. So, first consider turning the humidity up in your house a bit. All your furniture will thank you. Do it a little at a time so you can get used to it. Second, add a guitar humidifier to your Alembic case. Keep the bass in its case and make sure the humidifier has water in it. Both of these suggestions will lessen [not eliminate] your fret protrusions. Third, turn up the AC [or at least keep the bass in a cool location]. Metal frets can expand 5% or so in length in extremely hot conditions. Doesn't seem like much, but if that 5% is what cuts your finger… Each of these suggestions will only make a little bit of difference, but it may be enough that you won't have to file the frets. I had a similar problem with my first Alembic years ago. Simply adding a guitar humidifier was enough to keep my fingers free of blood. :-). I eventually worked up the courage to file the fret ends that last little bit. It was a snap. Felt foolish for waiting so long. Don't remember if it was stated here already, but file the fret end parallel to the ebony's grain: that's up and down the fretboard. Even light scatches will show up clearly if you sand across the grain. I prefer a round or half-rounded file, because I can rotate it back and forth, touching only the fret. If you've got the courage to do this last part first, leaving only the tiniest bit of fret left, the other steps above will bring it flush. Enjoy your bass. Dr. J | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 518 Registered: 6-2002 |
Roger, No offence intended, but it sounds a little as if you're trying to make yourself fall out of love with the DW - kind of like a "brace before impact" move in case you need to sell. That is a really tough situation. I can see how the added insurance payment is the proverbial last drop - but what is £50 on a 10K+ instrument? If you'll pardon the lame excuse for a piece of advice, but if you need to cut costs there's probably other luxury expenses that you can more easily live without. | ||
| borisspyder
New Username: borisspyder Post Number: 3 Registered: 10-2004 |
And that's why I play a Buzzard 1 & Buzzard 2 exclusively these days...anyway I have the same problem on the $180 Ibanez I leave in the office to mess around with...when its dry in the winter the frets pop out, when the weather warms up they settle back in...maybe dryness of the winter air is the problem, it may fix itself in the spring if you can't afford to do anything with it now. BTW: My Buzzards are older, no truss rods at all. The necks do move a touch, but they tend to correct themselves based on the season, a little more bow in the summer, less in the winter. I never adjust my Buzzard 1 because it was owned by John Entwistle & I want to keep his set up. Good luck with the Alembic, enjoy your Status basses. | ||
| drjenney
Junior Username: drjenney Post Number: 14 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hold the phone! Just looking through my Stewart-MacDonald catalogue (www.stewmac.com). They have a very nice fret end dressing file (US$12.36) and 0.10 inch stainless steel fretboard guards (6 for $US9.25) to protect the ebony while you do it [use them on thefret end while you file]. Should make the job safe, easy and cheap. | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 315 Registered: 1-2003 |
Hmmm, interesting suggestions and thoughts here... To Adriaan - no offence taken, but I'm not out of love with it and selling it is most definitely not going to happen. I don't need to realise the asset and wouldn't want to realise the asset. It's just that I've pretty much cut back on everything I can cut back on, and now this potential expenditure crops up that I really don't need. I'll wait and see what the instructions look like once Mica answers my request, then I might have to invest in the equipment as suggested by Dr. J - and then get my brave head on! | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 1483 Registered: 5-2002 |
Here is the link to the above mentioned service sheet. The service sheet is now referenced in the FAQ section; and a link to this very informative thread is now in the Must Reads section. | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 2351 Registered: 6-2000 |
Hi Roger, I received your email from Sunday, you should see a response in your inbox now. I'll also recap here for the readers of this thread. Today we added a Fret Edges page to the FAQ. In it, you'll find a link to the service sheet referenced. I'll add that the job is quite easy, and is exactly how we do it here. The first time I filed fret edges, I was 19 years old on a trip to Germany. All I had was the file (no instruction sheet), and I performed several of these procedures without incident. Many of the shop onwers were wary of a teenage girl armed with a tool pointed at their expensive inventory. I plan on expanding the FAQ for the fret edges sometime soon with pictures. One thing not on the service sheet is that a drop of lemon oil on the edge of the board after filing will restore the original look. Did you receieve the one-sheet "Care and Adjustment of your Alembic Bass" when you received your instrument along with the warranty card? On a side note regarding your insurance, Roger: is the bass really not insured if you take it out to a gig? Or is that allowed because it's under your supervision? | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 316 Registered: 1-2003 |
For everyone's information, now that I've received the instructions from Mica, I've decided to do the fret edge filing job myself. I don't want to leave the DW unplayable and I can at least afford a fret file - and one thing I have plenty of is time to spend on it! I did receive a booklet called "Care and Adjustment of your Alembic bass" - I looked in that on saturday but I completely missed the paragraph that mentioned about the potential problem with the fretboard - I was looking for a heading I think as I didn't want to sit and read the whole thing at the time. On the subject of insurance - it's not insured once it leaves the house. But as it hasn't left the house since it first arrived here as I still haven't got back into a band, it's not a problem at the moment. When it does need to go out, it's going to cost a fair amount of money to insure it due to the value of it! | ||
| s_wood
Intermediate Member Username: s_wood Post Number: 124 Registered: 5-2002 |
Roger: Make sure that you cover the fingerboard with masking tape before you start! That's what the pros do to protect the lacquer on the neck just below the edge of the board. Here's a good picture of how to do that: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/skgs/sk/Images/fc5.jpg Good luck! | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 318 Registered: 1-2003 |
Oooo yes, nice - thanks for the tip! | ||
| jacko
Intermediate Member Username: jacko Post Number: 135 Registered: 10-2002 |
Just a thought - wouldn't that layer of masking tape stop you filing all the way down to the fingerboard, thus leaving the tang protruding, albeit only a thousandth of an inch or so? If it's to protect the finish on the neck, why not run the masking tape lengthways just above the maple - ebony join? graeme | ||
| s_wood
Intermediate Member Username: s_wood Post Number: 125 Registered: 5-2002 |
The tape shouldn't cover the fret wire. Lay it parellel to the frets, and then use a second piece to cover the little bit of neck that appears below the fret you are filing. Am I explaining myself clearly? | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 319 Registered: 1-2003 |
Makes perfect sense to me. As this whole problem with the DW started last weekend and still seems to be underway, at what point should I use the files on it that I've just bought? ASAP or should I leave it another few days / couple of weeks until it really settles down? | ||
| bigbadbill
Intermediate Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 166 Registered: 10-2003 |
Roger, best of luck. Haven't had it happen to mine luckily, but I feel your pain! Best of luck with getting a new job too! BTW, I was VERY surprised to hear that the Status necks moved too... Borisspyder(cool name!), congrats on owning one of John's basses! 2 questions though; what sort of action did John use??? I know it's low, but how low is low??? I was recently having a discussion with someone about this very subject. If the bass you own is set up as per John's spec, it seems like you're the perfect person to answer the question! Do you have specs? And the other is what is the Buzzard 2 like? (I assume you mean the bolt-on). I'm thinking of possibly getting a Status in the future and it's a model that interests me (if I could afford a Buzzard 1 I have a feeling I'd be ordering another Alembic instead, although I haven't played one so it's probably not fair to comment, and as I CAN'T afford one it's a moot point anyway). | ||
| bigbadbill
Intermediate Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 167 Registered: 10-2003 |
BTW Rog, wasn't there a thread on your Buzzard recently? I only scanned it briefly and meant to come back to it, but I can't seem to find it. Probably been archived I guess... | ||
| s_wood
Intermediate Member Username: s_wood Post Number: 126 Registered: 5-2002 |
I would go ahead and do it now...the thought of an Alembic sitting around unplayed makes me sad. Seriously, the problem probably won't crop up again. I've seen it on more than a few Alembics over the years, but I can't recall ever seeing it twice on the same bass. So, if ebony boards are prone to shrinkage, why does Alembic use them? Well, Mica or Val can speak with much more authority on this, but to me ebony sounds better than rosewood, and rosewood is much more prone to cracking as it ages. | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 320 Registered: 1-2003 |
bigbadbill - it's here... http://alembic.com/club/messages/449/16250.html?1108260912 (Miscellaneous / Archive Thru 21 February / True Love...) Incidentally, Rob Green at Status did tell me that the necks would move a little, probably in spring and again in the autumn. That's exactly what they've done. The movement wouldn't be noticeable apart from the fact I run these basses as low as they will go - any lower, and it is physically impossible for the strings to vibrate. Same with the DW. | ||
| bigbadbill
Intermediate Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 168 Registered: 10-2003 |
Rog, good man, both for the link (many thanks!) and the action! That's how I like mine (I have had SO much grief off some luthiers over this -"oh it won't work that low" - and yet amazingly (NOT!) my Triple O arrived from the Alembic factory perfectly set up, low, low, LOW. Nice to know SOME people know what they're doing.... | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 321 Registered: 1-2003 |
Just for the record, I've measured the action on the DW, the Stealth (both at 24th fret) and the Buzzard (at the 26th fret for this one). They're all set-up identically, the necks are virtually flat. The actions are all 0.7mm (0.0275"). A friend of mine came over recently, he plays some guitar and I now understand why he stood there and demanded that I play them - I think he thought that they shouldn't play. Mind you, when I saw the way his guitar was set up, I could understand his point of view as the strings on his guitar were - ahem - somewhat higher! I think they'd all probably go a touch lower, but I am talking A TOUCH! | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 322 Registered: 1-2003 |
I've just remembered a story Rob Green told me about the day John came in to collect his first Buzzard. Rob said he'd set the bass up as low as he felt comfortable with it, so that there were no squeaks and rattles. John took one look at it and said "It'll go MUCH lower than THAT!". At which point he took the allen keys to it, and Rob said he himself was sitting there thinking "There is no way this will play - it's impossible". He said it took John about 20 minutes, and he said he was SO relieved when John fired it up and it played perfectly! I'd love to know the measurements from BorisSpyder's Buzzard!!!!!!!!!! Well this thread has certainly metamorphosed into a whole world of information eh? I'm sure a lot of people have learnt a lot of things from this lot, I know I certainly have... | ||
| bigbadbill
Intermediate Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 169 Registered: 10-2003 |
Ha!That's fabulous!!!Is that on the E or G? If that's the E, that's even lower than I normally have it - in fact it's marginally lower than my G which is around 1mm (I knew I wasn't TOTALLY mad....maybe just a bit)! My Triple O came from Alembic around 1.5 mm at the 24th with a flat neck, I've got an old Rick 4000 which is possibly marginally lower (not at the 24th as it hasn't got one obviously), a '72 4001 and '91 4001CS which are similar, possibly a tad higher, and a Warwick Dolphin which is currently around 2mm at the 26th, but which I'm still tinkering with. I LOVE the story about John. What an absolute star. Actually a friend of mine who has a Status has sent it for electronics tweaks a couple of times and every time it's come back set up pretty high; I haven't been able to play it at all. I don't reckon it's likely John had his action any lower than you though Rog, although I suppose you never know.....I too hope BorisSpyder can give specs, that would be incredible. BTW, one day you'll have to take your basses to Chris May at Overwater; lovely guy and extremely knowledgeable, but he'd faint at your action! He prefers it on the high side...I think I give him nightmares! BTW, how does your Stealth sound compared to your Buzzard? (Haven't had chance to read the thread yet as just been booking some rehearsals); I will do now though! Am probably signing off for the evening after that, but will check back tomorrow. | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 323 Registered: 1-2003 |
Those measurements apply to all four strings - in fact, if anything, the G and the D are slightly lower. If you go to the Miscellaneous section, you will see a thread entitled 'A bit of comparison fun...' - there you can listen to both my Status basses and the DW. The samples don't tell you what is what, so you'll have to guess :-) If you want to e-mail me off the Club, BigBadBill, I'll happily talk to you about them all. | ||
| borisspyder
New Username: borisspyder Post Number: 5 Registered: 10-2004 |
I'll try to answer all questions but first... As an advisory board member of the John Entwistle Foundation, I wanted you all to know that we are having a fund raising push to launch the pilot program for "Check Out Music" at the Atlanta Public Library. This program is to give children the opportunity to learn to play an instrument through the library system. Go to www.johnentwistle.org for details. I'll be happy to measure the action on John's bass for you, it's pretty low, but yours may be lower! The Buzzard 2 is a great instrument. A little warmer sounding on the same settings than the 1 since it has a wood body, but tone shaping is so flexible I can make them sound almost identical. Other than the body all hardware & electronics are the same on the two instruments. The buzzard 2 is now my "daily driver" for rehearsals, gigs, practicing, etc. I pick up John's axe once a week or so just to get the vibe...I don't take it out of the house much. I really love the Status Buzzards. They're totally bullet proof, sound fantastic and once you get used to the long 26 fret neck and minimal fetboard radius they're amazing to play. | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 327 Registered: 1-2003 |
Well - the filing deed is done and the DW is back to full health. It took me about 2.5 hours in total. Holding that file doesn't half focus the mind I can tell you! The temptation is to have a large brandy before starting work to steady the nerves but I managed to resist! Thanks for everyon'e input to this over the last few days! Cheers, Rog | ||
| bigbadbill
Intermediate Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 171 Registered: 10-2003 |
Congrats Rog! I hope I never have to do the same job, but good on you for taking the bit (file?) between your teeth (although I think I'd definitely have needed the stiff drink!). BTW, you have mail.... Borisspyder, thanks for the info on the Buzzard 2, that's another one for me to consider, although I suspect it may be a tad heavy (back problems unfortunately). But hopefully I'll get to try one. And I look forward to hearing John's spec, although I can't imagine anyone would have lower action than Roger.... | ||
| borisspyder
New Username: borisspyder Post Number: 6 Registered: 10-2004 |
I've owned a Warwick buzzard..THAT'S heavy, 12+ pounds or so. The Buzzard 2 feels about the same as my Fender P bass special maybe due to the light graphite neck. I can play it comfortably for hours with a thin guitar strap. | ||
| jacko
Intermediate Member Username: jacko Post Number: 137 Registered: 10-2002 |
Way to go roger. Time for that (very) large brandy now. graeme | ||
| effclef
Advanced Member Username: effclef Post Number: 300 Registered: 1-2004 |
Roger, good job! I hope your job situation improves soon, but at least you can be happy playing that beautiful bass again, while you wait. EffClef | ||
| dwmark
New Username: dwmark Post Number: 5 Registered: 1-2005 |
Thanks from me in advance. After following this one, I noticed that the frets on my Epic 6 have sprouted (I might have ignored the nicks on my hands until Summer, when the frets would have unsprouted--probably would have taken a couple of years before I figured it out). One problem--I DON'T DRINK BRANDY (will vodka work?). | ||
| lbpesq
Advanced Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 372 Registered: 7-2004 |
Roger: If you are going to keep a Dragon, you have to expect to clip its nails. I'm glad the operation was a success and the patient recovered. Next time, try a good single malt scotch. Bill, tgo | ||
| essencetimestwo
Member Username: essencetimestwo Post Number: 78 Registered: 8-2003 |
Congratulations on the fix. It wasn't that hard was it. Just the thought of taking any sharp tool to a bass that valuable would make me puke. Not the Jim Beam Black that I have grown a taste for. Smooth and rich American bourbon whiskey without the price to match. Try it someitme if you can find it. | ||
| 88persuader
Intermediate Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 113 Registered: 5-2004 |
Wow talk about a long chain! ;-) Well I'll put in my two cents. I JUST had the same problem with my SC Standard .... the ebony shrunk a little and the frets got sharp. While changing my strings this evening I decided to do the filing job. I couldn't find a proper file so (get this) for the heck of it I pulled out my finger nail clippers and used it's file to very lightly filed one fret. To my shock and delite it did the job without harming the wood of the neck at all. So I dress the frets on the whole bass using a mini finger nail file! It came out perfect with not so much as a mark on the neck! Believe it or not I'd suggest trying this if your frets are a little "sharp" because of neck shrinkage. A regular metal finger nail file isn't that rough but apparently was rough enough to take care of the problem I had ... maybe it'll work for you? | ||
| 88persuader
Intermediate Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 114 Registered: 5-2004 |
Well i tried something a little ... different! Tonight while changing strings on my SC Standard I decided to file down the ends of my frets because like most of you the eboney had shrunk a little and the fret ends had gotten sharp. Well I couldn't find my files so before giving up and deciding to do it later ... for a laugh i pulled out my finger nail clippers which has a small nail file attached. I very carefully filed one fret with the nail file only to find out it did a fantastic job ... and didn't leave so much as a mark on the neck! (And it was easy!) So I went ahead and did the entire bass (filing) with the fingernail file attached to a cheap finger nail clipper. It only took around 20 minutes, it didn't leave so much as a mark on the wood of the neck and now my frets are as smooth as the day I 1st got my bass new. After doing it I think I'll do it that way if or when every i need to do it on other basses I have. A REAL file can harm the wood easily if you're not careful but the fingernail file is not that rough ... frankly I'm surprised it worked at all ... but it did! Just goes to show ya ... sometimes thinking out of the box is a good thing! ;-) | ||
| 88persuader
Intermediate Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 115 Registered: 5-2004 |
Sorry about the "kind of" double post ... I thought I lost the 1st one so i wrote it again. |
