| Author | Message | ||
| jetbass79
Junior Username: jetbass79 Post Number: 26 Registered: 2-2005 |
I plugged my new Alembic into an SVT Classic at work through a 6x10 cabinet and it sounded so huge (as to be expected). And in reality the SVT I used has been used...festivals...various backlines you name it so this one has a tendancy to overdrive more easily than the one that I own. My question is, would using an F1X as a preamp to slave the SVT Classic I own increase the clarity and therefore make the Alembic sound more like it's "supposed" to? Bear in mind, it sounds really fat, but that amp was definitely made for passive Fender style instruments that don't have a natural fatness to them. I have done experiments with using a solid state Trace Elliot head as a preamp through the Ampeg tube power amp with more clarity until the Trace Elliot stopped working. It just wouldn't turn on anymore and I said to hell with it. Any ideas? Would an F2B be better? I could never part with the SVT Classic since it sounds so good with my old Fenders. I think augmenting it with a more hi fi preamp would do a lot. I'm using a 4x10 cabinet which I have had for 8 years and I know that really needs to go bye bye even though it doesn't sound bad at all. | ||
| jseitang
Member Username: jseitang Post Number: 55 Registered: 6-2002 |
you know ive been wondering about this for a while. im going to get a hiwatt 200 head, and i was going to do the same. any ideas mica? val? i know david gilmour from pink floyd does something similar. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 1737 Registered: 5-2002 |
I'm thinking somebody here in the club has done just that; but I don't recall who. | ||
| sfnic
Junior Username: sfnic Post Number: 31 Registered: 3-2005 |
Seeing as the original idea behind the F-2B was to provide a "Fender-style" preamp to drive a Mac 3500 tube power amp... Running the F-2B's baby brother into an SVT slave merely follows the same design intention. You get the cleanliness of the tube pre-amp coupled with the relative cleanliness of the SVT power stage. It's about as close to the original Alembic audio intention as you can get without tracking down and rebuilding some incredibly heavy vintage equipment. (Mac 3500s were originally designed to drive the shaker tables used by the military to test tanks by trying to vibrate them to pieces. 1200 watts into 1/4 ohm loads, running full power for 4-5 days continuously...) Anyway, it'll definitely be cleaner and clearer than running the bass straight into the SVT preamp; the SVT's overload points are such that an Alembic bass will generally drive it to at least a small amount of distortion. (Personally, I often like a bit of overdrive on an Alembic bass; it gets back to the "classic" Jack Casady sound. But there are tons of times when I just want as clean a signal path as possible.) So, the short answer is "yes." An FX1 into the power stage of an SVT will give you as much clarity as is possible with an all-tube setup. You could get more clarity with an SF1 or 2 driving a top-end power amp, but you'd probably lose a bit of punch. nic | ||
| jetbass79
Junior Username: jetbass79 Post Number: 34 Registered: 2-2005 |
My bass sounds great with the way I have it running now: master all the way up and the gain at about 11 o'clock, but I would like to have access to more modern sounds than the SVT's preamp offers. I will have to go and buy an F1X. Thank you for the insight. | ||
| jseitang
Member Username: jseitang Post Number: 57 Registered: 6-2002 |
can anyone tell me how to set this up with a hiwatt head and a f2b? | ||
| bassdr
Junior Username: bassdr Post Number: 21 Registered: 10-2004 |
Here's another fly in this ointment- I run Flame Koa Essence into my F-1X into a Crown XLS 402. The incredible F-1X pushing an exceptionally clean power amp. My tone is very related to how I play and load the F-1X. Works for me. Michael | ||
| sfnic
Junior Username: sfnic Post Number: 33 Registered: 3-2005 |
Jimmy - It depends on which Hiwatt you have. Ideally, you need a model that provides a line input to the power amp section. In which case, you'd simply connect the output from the F-2B to the Line In on the Hiwatt. For Hiwatts that don't provide that insertion point, you have two choices: 1> Have a Line In jack installed. It's not difficult; any decent amp technician will know where to inject the signal and how to protect the input from any power supply voltages. But it does mean drilling a hole in the chassis, somewhere, so add the jack. So it is "invasive" surgery, in the sense that it might hurt the "vintage" value of the amp slightly. (I wouldn't worry about it unless the amp Blue Books for over about $2500.) 2> Run the F-2B into the lowest gain input jack available on the Hiwatt, then keep ALL the volume controls in the signal path (both F-2B and Hiwatt) fairly low. Except the last volume control on the Hiwatt, which will set your overall volume. The idea is to prevent the F-2B from overdriving the front end of the Hiwatt, and then to prevent the Hiwatt's first preamp stage from overdriving the second. By carefully setting volume controls, you should be able to get the maximum clean signal through to the Hiwatt's power amp driver stage, which is where the Line In jack mentioned above would be connected. Now, it may not be possible to keep the F-2B from overdriving the Hiwatt. Most of the older all-tube Hiwatts have pretty sensitive first-stage preamps that overdrive fairly easily. Which is why guitarists like them so much, of course. I modified one by installing an Alembic Stratoblaster FET preamp directly at the input (powered off the tube heater supply) and brought the gain trimpot out on a front-panel "Overdrive" control. It was the best sounding overdrive I've ever heard (and the waveform presented to the 3rd amp stage was incredible: all even-ordered harmonics; zero odd-ordered harmonics, and a great "stair-stepped" waveform that simply wouldn't clip), but it was the result of the Hiwatt's sensitivity. Boosting the guitar signal through the 'Blaster by even 2db overdrove the first tube stage. An F-2B provides somewhat more gain that 2db, unless you really keep it under control. If you simply can't keep the F-2B from overdriving the Hiwatt, you might need to add an in-line volume control in between the two, to act as a Master Volume for the F-2B. That was a fairly common trick we'd use whenever we had to "stack" preamp stages. Like, when you run the output from one channel of the F-2B into the input of the second. Or when running the F-2B into a guitar-level pedal effect. Making an in-line volume control is easy: use a decent quality 1Meg pot, connect one end to an input jack, the other to ground, and the wiper to an output jack. Mount the works in a small steel box. Plug the F-2B into the input; plug the output into the Hiwatt. Set the Hiwatt for the cleanest sound you can get, then use the new In-Line Volume control to turn down the output from the F-2B until it no longer overdrives the Hiwatt. nic | ||
| jseitang
Member Username: jseitang Post Number: 60 Registered: 6-2002 |
i plan to use a hiwatt dr 201 200 watter or a dr 103. both would either be a reissue or hylight era hiwatt. don't hiwatts have slave outputs in the back? so io guess you're saying to plug it in from the front of the amp? | ||
| jseitang
Member Username: jseitang Post Number: 61 Registered: 6-2002 |
however i do like that clean alembic tone with a little overdriven grit. | ||
| sfnic
Junior Username: sfnic Post Number: 36 Registered: 3-2005 |
Damn, I can't remember if the DRs have line out/line ins. |
