| Author | Message | ||
| another10percent
New Username: another10percent Post Number: 1 Registered: 12-2006 |
I was sorry to see that once again prices will rise on Alembics. 10% increase starting in 2007 6% this past January January 2005 a 15% increase. That was said to be the first one in 20 months.The amount of the raise 20 months before was not listed in the message. I am not sitting in Alembic's shoes and sure do appreciate their work. But with an increase in pricing of 31% over 3 plus years along with the company restricting the discounts offered by their resellers, makes it easy to understand why a great new instrument dealer is selling off his new inventory as used but unplayed on eBay. The cost of inventory for an instrument that doesn't sell quickly is quite large. Its amazing that on top of the cost of the instruments, the cost of activators, rack equipment and who knows what else is going up too. I love Alembic, I really do. I just have been priced out and that is sadder than they will ever know. I wonder how many of Alembic's buyers have had a raise on pace with Alembics costs. Again I know that this is a business...but do they care about the folks who buy their guitars? The guitars depreciate at a wicked pace when they come out of the showroom. I'ts a sad day. To think that a set of humbucker pickups are going to be over $935.00 list makes me wonder when the Alembic club will charge a fee to join. Probably the most screwed up thing is that the price of the 30 year old unsold kits are for sale as if they were new. I guess they will go up again since they have sat around for another year. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1085 Registered: 9-2002 |
Well, 10 . . . I can most assuredly tell you that ALEMBIC CERTAINLY cares about its customers. They have shown me and many others on this post a certain graciousness way past anything most of us have ever seen any where else. If Ed Roman wants to dump his pieces off on EBay as I saw earlier today, if one of them suits you , GET IT, seems like quite the deal on the ones I saw. Ed says Dingwalls are superior instruments . . . puh-leeze, Ed, stay out of the lacquer thinner, OK? Dw's are nice instruments with a unique fret system . . . but they're not ALEMBIC. Handbuilt instruments, especially the so-called 'boutique bases' always depreciate fast. I'm glad they do, as I made quite a buy on mine. The vintage market is tilted to the usual suspects, yet lots of great instrumnts fall outside the half-dozen brand names. But I think this depreciation isn't nearly as crazy as paying 2o grand for a 60s Jazz Bass, or 200 grand for a 50s Les Paul. 'But they appreciate, they're INVESTMENTS!' OK, so is that LP gonna be worth a MILLION dollars in 10 years? I don't think so. Incidentally, my last Musician's Friend catalog is full of Custom Shop LP Customs for five or six grand: That certainly makes ALEMBIC a bargain to my mind. Regards their price increase: I always say their business is none of my business. The very best ALWAYS costs more, no matter what kind of product. You'll never buy a new Ferrari in the same price range as a new Vette. Nothing feels, sounds, looks, or is built as well as an ALEMBIC, and they're built by some of the nicest people in the world. Either you can step up to the plate, or you can swing away. People vote with their wallets. It's up to you. But, what's it worth to own a legend? J o e y (Message edited by bigredbass on December 07, 2006) | ||
| 5stringho
New Username: 5stringho Post Number: 8 Registered: 11-2006 |
Well, Shucks. Another 10 percent. I still want a Series 1 or 2. Guess the old '89 Mercury Topaz is just gonna have to make it another couple of years!! PRIORITIES!!!!!! Mike | ||
| bigbadbill
Advanced Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 271 Registered: 10-2003 |
Joey, whilst I agree wholeheartedly that Alembic are the best, not everyone has got that sort of money in the first place. As posted elsewhere, I was considering an Essence, as an addition to my Triple O. I was unprepared for the Essence costing the same as my Triple O did 3 years ago. £3650? That's almost double in dollars. I'm generally looked at as some sort of nut by my musician friends because of the amount I've spent on my guitars; far more than I can really afford to be honest. It's also caused grief in my relationships. It took me 20 years to step up to the plate for my Triple O, and that wasn't because I didn't want to spend the money, it was because I couldn't afford to, simple as that. For me, it was ultimately worth it, but it has taken me 3 years to pay for my Triple O. And unless I find something used (or sell my TO), it's looking like I'll never be able to afford another Alembic. There are few other people I know who can realistically afford to put that kind of money into a guitar; any guitar. I don't have kids, I don't drive so don't own or run a car (and I am a little obsessed!). If I did, there's no way I would've been able to afford one in the first place. That Essence is between a third and a quarter of the average annual income of most of the people I know, which puts it out of the reach of most. As for a Series, I don't know anyone at all who can afford one. I wish I could. With regards to the car analogy, I guess it's a good one; using that analogy, if I did drive, it would be a used Toyota, because that's all I could afford. | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1822 Registered: 7-2004 |
another10%: Your info isn't quite accurate about the kit guitars. AFAIK Alembic is NOT selling the kits. Rather, they are taking some of the old kits and building the guitars themselves, with upgrades and mods, and then selling them. Admittedly, this stuff ain't cheap, but neither is the cost of living in the San Francisco Bay and outlying areas. Alembics are expensive and I feel lucky to own Alembics. I got great deals on two used instruments, a '76 Series I and an '83 Electrum. I saved up for a special 50th b-day present to myself and commissioned a Custom Further 2 years ago (it should be finished soon, I hope). The Further is pricey, but even with mods and multiple inlays, it will still cost about half the price or less of the new Fender Strat Clapton Blackie. For only $20,000 you too can own a BRAND NEW black Strat with the same dings, worn out spots, and cigarette burns as the guitar on which Layla was recorded. BOY HOWDY!!!! Now that's insane. Bill, the guitar one (Message edited by lbpesq on December 07, 2006) | ||
| ampeglb100
Member Username: ampeglb100 Post Number: 92 Registered: 11-2004 |
In my opinion you should only conider ordering a new Alembic if you absolutely, without a doubt, know exactly what you want and can't find that bass (whatever it is) used. I look at ordering a new Alembic, whatever model, as a lifetime investment that I will never sell. Anything short of that I think you are setting yourself up for a lot of disappointment and frustration as far as your pocketbook is concerned. You shouldn't even be worried about the resale value of a new Alembic because if you are going to drop $4000, $6000, $12,000...!!! you ought to be buying the most close to perfect bass, for you, that you can. If you aren't 110% sure about that or if you can't afford it then hunt down a used one and buy, sell trade to your hearts content. If they have to raise prices to maintain their level of professionalism then so be it - I would rather them retain their integrity then water it down for the masses, but ultimately you the buyer (or really, we the buyers) have control over what we choose to buy. | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1158 Registered: 6-2002 |
Not sure how much of the increase might be to do with simple inflation. So you could buy a Series I for 2,000 USD in 1975. Now check something else that costs 12,000 USD today, and see how much it cost back in 1975. Other than that, I'm afraid the custom Alembic of my dreams keeps slipping away further and further. And it's not even a Further to begin with. :-( | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 4589 Registered: 5-2002 |
I have no idea, and I probably shouldn't even comment, but .. One thing that occured to me is labor cost. I imagine that labor cost is a significant component of the overall cost of each instrument. And off the top of my head, two aspects of labor cost immediately come to mind. The first is health care cost. I have no idea what this company does in relation to health care costs, but generally health care costs can be a significant amount of total labor costs, and the rate of increase in health care costs is significantly more that that of the rate of inflation. The second factor that occurs to me regarding labor is the cost of keeping very highly skilled artisans. If you're making the best crafted instruments, you probably need the best craftsmen. My guess is that the increase in labor costs associated with keeping highly skilled craftmen are much greater than the average annual increase in inflation. Just some thoughts; I really have no idea, and for all I know they got rid of all the really good people and hired some folks off the Fender assembly lines to build the Series basses for 2007. | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1159 Registered: 6-2002 |
Dave, that can't be true. Surely they moved the whole production to Fender's Mexican facilities. Which as we all know are building better instruments than Fender's own Custom Shop. Whose latest ploy has been to ask obscene amounts of money for damaging instruments before delivery, on demand. | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 410 Registered: 3-2004 |
This same old discussion comes up each time their is an increase. There will always be increases. If you can buy one , buy one. If you can't, wait or buy something else. Cost of living goes up, you want to be able to meet that cost and you need to get it from somewhere. Your employers give increases. Do you complain? My union is always whining about getting more money and it really bothers me. If I want more than they are offering then I will move on. If a business owner wants to make more money he (or she) has to work harder and get more business. The craftsman who work for Alembic need to pay their bills. The owners need to pay their bills, but they see a responsibility to treat their employees as individuals who deserve a living wage. I sacrificed a lot for my instruments because I wanted them. It was worth it to me. My friends don't understand it but then I don't understand that a person who chooses to smoke cigarettes, pot and drink in bars will complain that they have no money. I chose my priorities, they chose theirs. If this company sees a need to increase its prices that is their business. If I chose to order another instrument, that's my business. If I can swing it, then I'll do it again. If I can't I'll either find a way or do without. Our thread starter is not a devotee. Those here who are get it and understand. I don't buy Alembics as an investment. I buy them as wonderful tools to make my music with. Picking up on the auto notion, I would love to get a new Vette or Magnum but I can't afford it and stay solvent. So until I can I'll stick with my van and play my Alembics. (plus I can't fit my rig in the vette). | ||
| southpaw
Member Username: southpaw Post Number: 96 Registered: 12-2004 |
Just my 2 cents... Like many peoople in the Corporte world, I have not had a raise in 3 years but everything around me has increased. I know Alembic is very concious of the increases and they are not doing it out of greed. I chatted with Susan a couple of years ago regarding cost and I think the biggest culprit is the State of California. California hits businesses with some outrageous cost & taxes. Other businesses have said the same thing (think Santa Ana). I believe in 2004 California raised the Workman Comp cost by 400%! My suggestion to Susan & Alembic; Move the company to Nevada, Oregon or Washington. Still American made but reduced expenses. California is so ungodly expensive, the janitor needs to make six figures for basic shelter, imagine what the artisans at Alembic need to make because of the cost of living in California. No one is more heartbroken about the increases than I am, my dream of a Dragon Wing is gone, unfortunately for working class bums like me, $6000 of disposable income on a bass will never happen. I have met the gang at Alembic, they are hard working, good people; there are no Mercedes and lobster lunches happening. | ||
| jseitang
Intermediate Member Username: jseitang Post Number: 189 Registered: 6-2002 |
but i think alembic should stay in california. its what really makes it special... its in the air. i long for the day i return to the golden state. stay gold! | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1823 Registered: 7-2004 |
MOVE OUT OF CALIFORNIA!!!!!! HERESY!!!!!!! Alembic IS California - California IS Alembic. And, MOST importantly, Alembic is only 1 hour from my doorstep! As for those Mercedes and lobster lunches, I love the taste of a good blackened cajun 450SL on focaccia with sun-dried tomato pesto and some langostino on the side! Yum yum! Bill, tgo | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 73 Registered: 8-2005 |
Yes the state of California is certainly a factor. It is the most expensive state in the country to do business in - for any business. Our laws and regs are tighter than anywhere. In addition it's also very expensive to live here compared to most other places so I'm sure that has an affect on the labor price too. Another huge factor is the price of oil. Petrolium is in EVERYTHING. It's in the paints, the glues, delivery costs rise with fuel, etc. I don't like the increase either. It certainly doesn't help my pocket. Another part of the problem is that nothing else sounds like an Alembic - there are no substitutes. But I find a lot of times the people complaining about their prices own 5 Sadowskys, 2 MTDs, 3 Zons, 2 Ken Smiths, 6 Fender Jazzs, a couple MMs, a Lakland or two... and on. Not that everyone here falls into that category, but what's the difference if one person has $50,000 in instruments and owns 20 and another has the same value and owns 3? Anyway I went a little off topic I guess.... Yeah prices suck! Let's have a half off your order December special! :D Dave | ||
| southpaw
Member Username: southpaw Post Number: 97 Registered: 12-2004 |
Bill, I don't think Alembic set up shop in Santa Rosa to be close to your home, but I could be wrong! My point is that an Alembic is special because of the people and craftsmanship, no matter where Alembic is located the instruments will still be tops. Here in Illinois we have seen the top surgeons move their practices over the state lines to Wisconsin & Indiana because of the massive malpractice insurance in Illinois. They are still top surgeons, just with less overhead. I wonder if Governor Arnold plays guitar? Maybe he can help reduce cost... By the way, how do you cook a 450SL? Sounds dangerous, but count me in for lunch. | ||
| bigbadbill
Advanced Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 272 Registered: 10-2003 |
Quote - "Your employers give increases. Do you complain? My union is always whining about getting more money and it really bothers me. If I want more than they are offering then I will move on". Firstly, you could offer more support to people who are trying to do their best for you. And yes, I do complain, and I know there are others out there who are far worse off than me. Secondly, and with all due respect, it must be great to able to move on just like that. Where I am, there's nothing to move on to, short of seasonal work, which pays even less. I work for the biggest employer in the area, and they know they have us over a barrel. Sure I could retrain, but I'd have to take time out of my job to do that, and rather ironically can't afford to do that and still keep up the mortgage payments. Alembics cost what they do, just as Ferraris do. Some lucky people will be able to afford them, or at least be able to justify to themselves being able to afford them. But they are indeed a luxury, and many people don't have a choice when it comes to luxuries, when they've mortgages to pay and mouths to feed. This is in no way meant to reflect on Alembic, but is most definitely aimed at those who think everyone has a choice as to whether or not they can buy one. | ||
| davr35
Junior Username: davr35 Post Number: 46 Registered: 12-2004 |
Alembic has the right to charge what they do for it's product. Just as we have the right to complain about what they charge. The fact is as great as they are they have always been overpriced. I for one can not and most likely will not be able to afford a new one so I'm sticking to the used market. Though the used market is getting overpriced as well. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 901 Registered: 10-2003 |
My Series 1.5 was roughly $3600.00 new back in 1981. Even then and at that price I couldn't imagine how they possibly made a nickle off of the sale. A year earlier I bought a big-ass Chevy 3/4 ton 4x4 pickup for just under $8k new. Alembic's prices haven't gone up as much as Detroit's in the intervening years. Keep in mind also that the Santa Rosa area isn't exactly the cheapest place in the world to live... John | ||
| flaxattack
Senior Member Username: flaxattack Post Number: 1284 Registered: 4-2004 |
i dont get it..... everytime alembic raises their price there is this bullshit outcry from club members everyone is entitled to make a living you me and them want an alembic? pay the price, buy a used one buy a fender or move on geez louise | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1161 Registered: 6-2002 |
Not sure if any of this perceived anger is supposed to be emanating from me. If it is, then that is a misconception. I would love to order one at the dealer discount price in dollars. But I live in Europe, and the best on offer seems to be the MSRP in dollars, paid 1-on-1 in euros. That's 30% more, as the exchange rate is 1.30 USD to the euro. You can't blame the dealer - I don't think it's much cheaper when buying in the US yourself, as you have to pay import duties anyway. | ||
| bigbadbill
Advanced Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 273 Registered: 10-2003 |
Jeff, I certainly wasn't posting as a "bullshit outcry". As I said, my comments aren't supposed reflect on Alembic. My point is that there are many who simply can't afford one, however much they want one. There seems to be an undercurrent of "hey, if you're not willing to pay the price then go find something else". The point is, it's not about being willing to pay the price for some, they just can't, they haven't got the money, in the same way that most of us could never even dream of owning a Ferrari, no matter how much we might want one. Alembic have every right to charge what they want, there's no argument there. Adriaan, I agree. Maybe it's worse in Europe (I'm in the UK); as you say, a dealer price here works out at retail$, which I'm sure is considerably more than the actual cost in the US. | ||
| speicky
Intermediate Member Username: speicky Post Number: 178 Registered: 3-2005 |
please consider that you have to pay the value added tax here in the European Community, and that is significantly higher than in the States, I guess... it's something from 15% to well over 20%, depending on the member country. I wasn't aware when I bought Peggy last year. I paid free of customs and taxes to G-Guitars, CT, and a friend brought her over here to Zurich, Switzerland. I picked her up there, and when trying to enter German territory again, I learned the hard way that you have to pay VAT (and customs) on any good that is being imported to the EC, regardless of private person or company, regardless of where you paid or archieved ownership of the good in question. In Germany, we have a "very special governmental December special", because VAT goes up from 16% to 19%, taking effect on 01-01-2007. Christian | ||
| speicky
Intermediate Member Username: speicky Post Number: 179 Registered: 3-2005 |
... not only on ALEMBIC imports, of course ;-) | ||
| keith_h
Senior Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 622 Registered: 2-2005 |
The EU VAT is one reason I get so upset every time I hear folks complain about tax rates here in the US. I try to tell them that our overall tax rates are quite low compared to the rest of the industrial world and that we should be thankful for that. Instead I watch as our infrastructure goes to pot (not to be confused with the consumable herb) and our children are indebted to the hilt by more tax cuts. Well time to get off of my soap box and cook dinner. Keith | ||
| jbybj
Junior Username: jbybj Post Number: 33 Registered: 6-2006 |
Rich people always get the better stuff, as long as they have the taste and good sense to know whats better. Are we upset because Alembic raised the prices, or because we are not rich? It's all about priorities people. If you can't afford one, or choose not to make it a priority, then just be happy without it. Jeez, everyone reading this, whether you have an Alembic or not, has music in your life. That alone puts you on a higher plain than most. Life is rich, sex is free, be happy you lucky bastards. | ||
| tom_z
Senior Member Username: tom_z Post Number: 477 Registered: 7-2004 |
Well said James! Peace Tom | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 902 Registered: 10-2003 |
Sex is FREE?! :0 | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 961 Registered: 2-2006 |
It ain't even free when your married John. LOL | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1829 Registered: 7-2004 |
Heck, when you're married it's more expensive! As a wise man once told me, unless you're born into wealth, there are only two ways to get rich. You can either work for it, or marry it. And if you marry it, boy, are you going to work for it! LOL Bill, tgo | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 230 Registered: 5-2004 |
Well here's my 2 cents. I LOVE Alembic basses. THAT BEING SAID I sold 2 of my 3 Alembics because being a mid income American I couldn't justify owning three basses that together were worth over $9000 street price. Plus I was afraid to damage them on gigs. I'm a working musician playing bars and functions the truth is I almost never use my Alembic out anymore because I think it's too expensive to RISK having some drunk knock it off the stand or stealing it during breaks. If my SC got damaged or stolen I'd die and wouldn't be able to justify the money needed to replace it so I now only use it at home 90% of the time! I guess my point is Alembics are the best IMO but also IMO (And I'm sorry Alembic) they already cost too much. Increasing the price even a little just puts the instrument out of reach for more players and the higher the price goes up the less value you get for your hard earned dollar. Example ... A $2000 new SC Standard would be a steal, a $6000 new SC Standard is FAR less of a value. | ||
| lg71
Advanced Member Username: lg71 Post Number: 321 Registered: 3-2006 |
Guys, get a grip with yourself - will you! Alembic is NOT for the poor, it's like Rolex and Ferrari... You only have two options if you are broke and want to make money; One is to invest in my latest *Gigolo Kit (see photo).  The second option is to get yourself a Harness on eBay, like I did, and stick it were you know... (on a cheaper Bass I meant, don't make me sound rude!) *you get 10% off if you provide a photo of your Wife or Girlfriend naked when you place your order. (a 2 pages booklet with instructions is provided with the Gigolo Kit) (Message edited by lg71 on December 07, 2006) | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 231 Registered: 5-2004 |
You're right, Alembics are not for the poor. My point was reduced value. The more you pay for a product the less bang for the buck you get. Even a person who buys a Ferrari can reach a point where the car is not worth the price of admission. Oh I included a nude photo of my Ex-wife ... they charged me an extra 10% :-) | ||
| lg71
Advanced Member Username: lg71 Post Number: 322 Registered: 3-2006 |
I can tell you what happened! It's like you just said, it applies for everything... Your Ex-Wife must have been so gorgeous, they assumed that you were loaded!!! That's the problem you see. Always consult with Doc. LG-Spot before making decision like that. | ||
| lg71
Advanced Member Username: lg71 Post Number: 323 Registered: 3-2006 |
Forgot to say, it's all psychological and proven, in these situations you have to remember, if the wife is "ugly", it's a bonus, they will feel so sorry for you, that they will probably let you have it for free!!! lol But the "wise" LG says, don't worry what people say, beauty is in eye of the beholder... Edited to ask if you have any photo? (Message edited by LG71 on December 07, 2006) | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 232 Registered: 5-2004 |
lol ... no don't want to be kicked off the forum! :-) | ||
| lg71
Advanced Member Username: lg71 Post Number: 324 Registered: 3-2006 |
Oh no, no-one will tell you off - for such a generous contribution  | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 667 Registered: 6-2002 |
Price rises are a fact of life these days. One of the downsides for me is that it is fast putting the top of the range (Series) instruments & customs way out my price bracket. Also generally there does not seem to be many newer series models appearing for sale on ebay or even here, I guess the latest price hike may cause them to become even rarer and command a higher second hand prices. I guess it will also affect the availability of the other models on the used market as it is now much harder to afford the upgrade through the ranks. I appreciate prices have to rise, but the selfish side of me just wishes they could have waited till I could afford a series bass even with the current Pound to Dollar exchange rate. It's only money... so............... Keep on playing like a mother-plucker, what price excellence...? :-) hahaha | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 233 Registered: 5-2004 |
The thing is, on a serious note ... when we people who already own and LOVE Alembics stop buying them because they've been priced out of our range how good could that be for the Alembic company's future? Of course that's their business not mine. All I know is I sold two of my three Alembics because I could no longer justify the expense. I never plan to sell my SC standard but I also unfortunately never see myself buying another Alembic because I can't aford the luxury and every time the prices go up it becomes more sure my SC will remain my only Alembic. :-( | ||
| bigbadbill
Advanced Member Username: bigbadbill Post Number: 274 Registered: 10-2003 |
On a less serious note, if I ever win the lottery I've got a list of basses as long as my arm that I want made... | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Junior Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 33 Registered: 10-2006 |
I wish I was in position to be upset by the price incease. I've been thinking that I should expand my resumé from World's Worst Guitar Player to include World's Worst Bassist as well, to which end I've been trying to persuade the youngest kid ( a far better player than I ever was or ever will be) to sell me his Yamaha RB360 & Ampeg B50, while simultaniously attempting to get his mom to approve the $100 price. Given my grad-student status, it's an uphill battle. Yes, I do have an absolutely insane custom mapped out in my head, which just got a little further away. But what is 10% of totally out of reach? The question, I fear, is and shall remain moot. Peter | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 904 Registered: 10-2003 |
Alembic basses have ALWAYS been very pricey, and have always been in the hands of a lucky few who were able to pony-up the bucks to have one made. As I posted earlier in this thread, I paid not quite half for my Series 1.5 bass as I paid for a big new 4-wheel-drive truck back in the day. I neglected to include that with my employee discount at a music store that $3600.00 was just about cost for the bass, and I am guessing that retail on it would have been nearer to $5500.00. A similar truck today would cost me at least $29,120.00 (plus Tax, Title and Destination charges) according to the Chevrolet website. A near equivalent to 811952 Series I bass in cocobolo is $15050.00 according to the quote generator. So adjusted for inflation, Alembic instruments would still seem to be about as expensive as they've always been. No more, no less... Nothing to see here. Move along... ;) John | ||
| lg71
Advanced Member Username: lg71 Post Number: 328 Registered: 3-2006 |
You should get an Alembic Baseball Cap, it makes you feel kinda good you know... same sensation as when you were a Ferrari Baseball Cap... I wore mine today, and felt good, everyone was watching me! I was the Boss for 5 minutes... Even teenage girls were looking, they thought I was some kind of Rapper... Get yourself one if you want to be in Vogue proper, you will surely not meet someone wearing one at every street corner! OK, I get payed 10% for every cap sold - but keep this for yourself... Oh, then I met Jaco Pastorius and James Jamerson in the park, we had a joint and we played a Trio, I had my LGMK1 with me. It was quite a show! Everyone turned up, Marvin Gaye, Bob Marley, James Dean, Bruce Lee, too many to name... | ||
| byoung
Senior Member Username: byoung Post Number: 438 Registered: 12-2004 |
I already invited Susan, Ron and crew up to Seattle. I'm assuming they didn't bite, since the factory still seems to be on Wiljan Court. Bradley | ||
| oujeebass
Member Username: oujeebass Post Number: 90 Registered: 10-2002 |
$2000 in 1975 USD is equal to @$7500 USD today. http://www.aier.org/research/col.php As far as Alembic hats, I am their best customer. I have my second one coming in the mail ,as we speak. I think Mica even recognizes my name. They also have the best guitar polish in the world. (Message edited by oujeebass on December 08, 2006) | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 907 Registered: 10-2003 |
Once I ordered an Alembic brochure, just to see what they were offering and to have some pictures to drool over. When it came, Mica had written me a personal note with some questions about my specific bass! I don't doubt for a minute that Mica recognizes your name, as they whole lot of them seem to pay attention too all their customers, even the one's who haven't bought anything from them for 20 years. Time for me to get a hat I guess... ;) John | ||
| 5stringho
New Username: 5stringho Post Number: 9 Registered: 11-2006 |
Another 10%. Guess we'll just have to save a little more or play a few more gigs. It took me over a year to pay for my Excel 5, but I don't regret it for a minute or a dollar of it. I think I've dropped my sights a "little " from a Series 1 or 2 to a MK or Stanley Standard, and it may take me 2-3 years and selling some of my other Basses to get one, but eventually, I'll get what I want. If you quit smoking or cut back on the alcohol (or other libations!) it's AMAZING how much money you can put back!!! Good luck, gentlemen!! Mike | ||
| honkylips
Junior Username: honkylips Post Number: 31 Registered: 8-2005 |
After pondering this 10% increase for a few days, I've stumbled onto a solution. Alembic needs to outsource the manufacturing of these things to China or Taiwan, somewhere with dirt-cheap labor costs. They can slap the same old Alembic logo on the headstock and sell them at a more reasonable cost. In fact, if I did my math right it appears they may be able to lower prices a bit. That way we can all buy several Alembics. Because really, who can get by with just one? C'mon people. Be happy that Alembic hasn't made build costs and pricing their number one priority. They have always been an elite instrument (and never at a bargain price), and I hope that in my lifetime they stay that way. Kudos to Alembic for doing whatever they need to do to keep quality the top priority. | ||
| jsaylor
Member Username: jsaylor Post Number: 72 Registered: 11-2006 |
Its inflation...and personal greed. Don't take greed too harshly, because it's simple, they want more money for their products. If you don't like the prices, simply don't purchase from Alembic anymore. If enough people don't buy from them, Alembic will be forced to reduce prices. Thats how capitalism works. Supply and demand. (Message edited by jsaylor on December 19, 2006) | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 4646 Registered: 5-2002 |
Jordan wrote, "if enough people don't buy from them, Alembic will be forced to reduce prices. Thats how capitalism works. Supply and demand". I don't think that is necessarily the only outcome. For instance one of the businesses that I work with hasn't been getting enough sales in its particular market. So last month the owners sold the business. In this particular case it made more economic sense to sell the business than to lower prices. Sometimes business owners elect, as Craig humorously alluded to, and as many people in the American Midwest have experienced, to cut costs by moving their operations to areas with lower labor and/or materials costs. Some layoff workers and reduce output. Some try to maintain margins by cutting quality. And of course some owners find themselves in a position where it's in their best interest to just shut the doors and retire. Another option for some companies that want to retain their employees and maintain their level of quality is to change their product mix; if demand for a certain product is reduced, they may retrain their employees and start making a different product for which demand is rising. Labor costs are not always a directly variable cost in the same way that materials often are. Some labor costs are indirect and some are not variable. Thus a company may have a reduction in sales but it might not necessarily be able to reduce its labor costs. Supply and demand isn't always as simple as one might expect. Sometimes lowering prices isn't the best choice for a business owner; sometimes it's not even a viable choice. And by the same token, for a particular business, given its fixed and variable costs and its direct and indirect costs, sometimes increasing supply isn't the best choice either. Often there is a point where a small increase in production will require a significant increase in labor costs, resulting in a higher per unit cost. So no, it is not always necessarily the case that a reduction in demand will result only in a reduction in prices. A reduction in demand can result in a reduction in supply. And a reduction in supply can result in .. higher prices. Now I am not suggesting any of the above pertains to any particular business in Santa Rosa. I'm only addressing Jordan's general statement that reduced demand will force a reduction in prices. That wasn't what I was taught in business school and it hasn't been my experience in dealing with my clients and it hasn't been my observation of the business world in general. However, it may indeed be the case that in Jordan's experience, in businesses that he may be involved in, reduced demand has always resulted in reduced prices; and given such an experience it would be understandable that one might conclude that such a correlation might pertain to all businesses in general. But I just don't think it's an accurate assumption. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1092 Registered: 9-2002 |
I was doing adjustments on my ALEMBIC the other day. I had the back off, playing with the trim pots to fine tune the mix of the new FATBOYS I recently updated into the BigRedBass. Let's see: They made the pickups. In the cavity were not just pots, but pots with little PC boards and who knows what else, all with ALEMBIC part numbers. Custom made plug-in leads for the FATBOYS. No foil, silver paint. No wood screws, machine screws with inserts. Put the back cover back on, turned the bass over. They fabricated the tailpiece, the bridge, the adjustable nut. FIRST-class wood and wood working and finish. In other words, they fabricated most everything on this axe. Aside from raw wood, basic electronic parts and wire, they fabricated (and in some cases, invented) most everything I was looking at. OK, the keys were off-the-shelf Gotoh (save for the engraved A's which I'm sure Gotoh does at assembly). And I'm sure there is not another SPOILER exactly like mine. I'm sure there's only a small percentage of their output where the wood/finish/electronic build recipe would qaulify as a 'production run'. Otherwise, they're all one-offs in detail. This is NOT cheap. I could line up any number of supposedly competitive, handbuilt basses, and while their woodworking may be proprietarily unique, how many of them have off-the-shelf electronics and the bulk of their small parts list (knobs, nuts, bridges, etc.) all came from StewMac or AllParts? In fact, remove the Barts/EMGs and their accompanying circuits, then the Gotoh or HipShot bridges, keys, etc, and you're left with just the woodwork. This is just fine, but it's just NOT the sophisticated level of build that you get by building virtually everything under the same roof to a common esthetic. Plus, NOBODY has Ron's ears. They've never been cheap, they never will be cheap, because you can't do this on the cheap. There are other axes, but there is no other ALEMBIC. J o e y | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 256 Registered: 9-2005 |
It's NOT greed Jordan. Not that greed, in and of itself, is a bad thing (although many people who have postured as "philosophers" have by and large succeeded in getting people to accept the "package deal" that "greed" involves screwing other people inherently... but that's a separate issue). I've been out to the factory, and personally met and talked to the fine folks at Alembic. As far as can be ascertained, they live a fairly modest existence. I see the reason for the price increase as simply being costs they have to pay themselves, and therefore must pass on to their customers. This isn't any fun... but it's reality. Other members have already pointed out that Alembic is located in one of the costliest areas of the country to live in. Frankly, I'd never consider living in California because of the ridiculously mismanaged "government" of the state; but again, that's a separate issue. They DO choose to live there... and they have to deal with the "government" and taxes, and reality. It sucks. But I don't think they're raising the price for any other reason than they deem it necessary to meet their obligations/requirements of survival/maintaining their existence. It DOES suck, to be sure. But, as far as I'm concerned, they're doing what they need to do. Alembics have alway been expensive. But... it's all relative. In my opinion, they are a bargain, because -expensive though they be- what you get for you're money FAR surpasses other available options/alternatives. I've played a lot of nice basses. But I can honestly tell you, right now, that if, somehow, a rich stranger decided to buy me 3 basses... they'd all be Alembics. Because they're the best. Because nothing else comes close. I had to save for QUITE some time to buy my first "stock" Alembic; then, when I decided to buy my second/1st custom, I had to save even longer... and it took me several years to pay off. I don't regret it. Because it was worth it. In fact, I recently found out they actually LOST money on my custom (which I feel bad about). In fact, they actually threw in a couple VERY NICE extras to placate me over delays in construction -which were due to them underestimating the costs of the very elaborate features of my custom. At one point Susan had offered to give me a superfilter to placate me. I'm sure glad I didn't accept. I had some intuitive sense that they were doing the best they could; and -considering they lost money on my bass- I'd feel like a real heel if these people has lost even MORE money on me. I really want them to make some money on me with my next/current custom... because they deserve it. I KNOW from my own experience that priority number #1 for Alembic is to make their customers the best instruments possible for their customers WITHOUT COMPROMISE. Period. We had some heated moments during the construction of my 1st custom (due to MY impatience, justified or not). At no point did money enter into their equation. They placed the highest value on customer satisfaction. They showed this in their actions. They never SAID it; they didn't need to. They SHOWED it... in everything they did. They built me the best bass possible for the quoted price (FAR MORE, to be sure). This is NOT the same as "getting people the lowest possible price." It just isn't. There is ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT in my mind that they are raising prices for only one reason: they need to... to maintain their standards, and to meet their needs. Yes, it sucks... it really does. I wish they didn't have to raise their prices. I wish I could have afforded to get the extended fingerboard I wanted WITHOUT sacrificing other options; I wish I could have got gold hardware; I wish I could have got a Series instrument; I wish I could have got custom electronics. I really do. I also wish everyone was honest and rational, and that there was world peace, and our cats had wings and could do the dishes. But reality ain't so. I know that I'll be getting the best instrument money can buy -for my next custom. Even though they haven't even built it yet, I can see it like it's in front of me... I have total confidence. And it'll take me a while to pay off, in all likelyhood. But, expensive though it be, it WILL be worth it. I'll confirm this in several months when I get the bass. Are Alembics expensive? Sure. Always have been. Most likely, always will be. I don't see any way they could do what they do, otherwise. But really, for what you get they're a bargain... ALEMBIC AREN'T "EXPENSIVE"... they're PRICELESS!!! Mark/the "8 String King" | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 420 Registered: 3-2004 |
Ah the magical lure of the Alembic!I called today about an inlay question. As always, the relationship and concern for customers is first and foremost. (even for those who are a complete pain in the lower lumbar region) As my delightful conversation with Mica came to a close, the seed was planted. An hour or so later I emailed her with an idea for a lined fretless Excel 5, ebony board, rouge guts, bridgeblock, red led's and black finish. She stayed late and sent me back a price. I'm going for it! December special baby! Led's! It's not an ultra custom series but I know that it will be an exceptional piece. (also good that I'm selling off a thunderbird and a 4003 to defray the cost!) End result is these amazing artisans have my continued and full support. (btwAnyone want a Dean brian bromberg B2 5 or Ripper for a good price? ) | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 778 Registered: 11-2002 |
Oh dear, Jordan, you seem to have stuck your foot in your mouth yet again. Fortunately, people here seem to be quite patient and even encouraging with you. To your credit, I believe that is largely because you have shown yourself to be open-minded, willing to consider new ideas, and even change your opinion. Dave covered the economics lesson much better than I could have, so I'll take a stab at the other piece. You said, it's "personal greed...they want more money for their products." You stated this as fact, but I would politely suggest it is nothing more than uninformed speculation on your part (politely, si?). For instance, have you: - Visited Alembic in person several times? - Had lengthy, and often personal, phone conversations with Mica, Susan, Mary, Val, etc.? - Had a long history of experience with their instruments, including most importantly the process of building a custom to your specifications, over the course of 18 months or so? I don't want to make too big a deal about it, but like Mark, I also know that Alembic lost money on my custom, even though I ended up paying considerably more than they asked. (Hey, maybe the price increase is my fault!) I have just a very simple suggestion to make. Perhaps the next time you make a statement like this, you might preface it with something like "I think maybe...". You are certainly entitled to your opinion and conjecture, but unless you can back it up with hard facts - which I submit would be impossible in this case - it's usually better to play it safe and leave yourself an easy out. As best I can tell, there is absolutely nothing in the world these people would prefer to do than to build fantastic instruments, and somehow keep together a dedicated (small) group of artisans to do so. I can believe they need to raise prices to do so, but "I happen to strongly believe, based on knowing these people personally" that it's about survival, not greed. -Bob | ||
| jsaylor
Member Username: jsaylor Post Number: 73 Registered: 11-2006 |
Bob, This is just something I have observed. I thought posting this it would be taken as a personal opinion, seeing as that makes the most sense. They raise their prices every year, at the same time. They might be giving themselves a raise, but also rightnow, we have the worse inflation we have had in years. Mark, This isn't about how much you save up for a bass, rather how their increasing their already expensive prices. I do believe that this will reduce their sales. This little exclusive group on here might not care, and or effect their purchasing, but alot of other musicians won't take kindly to this issue, and might make them go to another company. Alembics aren't for everyone, although they are very nice instruments from a visual perspective (I have yet to play one). Some people I have talked to have owned some, but said their just not for them. The ones that like them it probably won't affect them. Dave, Supply and demand is a core principal of our economy. I will use and example. Coats. During the summer there is a surplus of coats, and noone wants them, so the prices lower so the company can sell off existing stock. Lets not start this into a quality issue. Alembics are high quality instruments, as are every boutique instrument maker. | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 257 Registered: 9-2005 |
Jordan, I don't have time right now to say anything other than this one thing, and then split for work. I take issue with some of what you've said here and on other threads, and I can't go any further on it now. But I would also like to say that I respect your maintaining a civilized demeanor while expressing your thoughts. This is a virtue I must acknowledge -especially in light of some recent uncharacteristic nonsense on this site. Peace, brother(s)!!! P.S. I also think you do a better-than-average job of presenting your thoughts in a simple/minimized, straightfoward way. This is good because, logically/epistemologically, it gives you the "razor" to prove your point/advance your argument when/to the extent it's true/valid... and, conversely, it exposes the incorrect assumptions/errors when such are made. This is also a virtue. More later... | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1197 Registered: 6-2002 |
Jordan, You can't really blame Alembic for raising their prices, and in the same breath complain about inflation. Inflation means that prices are going up because the value of the currency is going down - not the other way around. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1013 Registered: 2-2006 |
Jordan, I agree with you on one point, "Alembics aren't for everyone..", this statement is very true. I disagree on another statement though, "Alembics are high quality instruments, as are every boutique instrument maker". Not all boutique instrument makers are high quality. I will not name drop but I have played poor quality "boutique" instruments. | ||
| apdavis
Member Username: apdavis Post Number: 67 Registered: 5-2004 |
Mark, You would wish for cats with wings? My cats are enough trouble already, wing equipped cats would take it to a completely different level! | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 936 Registered: 10-2003 |
I believe (and may well be way off base here) that initially the Distillate and other non-series models which followed after were built to satisfy a shifting demand in the market. Series basses were still the cat's 455, but other builders (B.C. Rich, etcetera) were using active electronics and filling the gap (somewhat) between Series instruments and Fender/Gibson/etcetera "old technology" instruments. The Spoiler sold for something like $1200 or $1300 in '82, the Distillate for something like $1800 and a Series bass was something on the order of $3500 for a *basic* 4 string. Note that the most recent (I think) new Alembic bass, the Excel, is also the least expensive model. I think we'll see more of this sort of thing if the economy continues to tighten. John | ||
| jsaylor
Member Username: jsaylor Post Number: 74 Registered: 11-2006 |
Olie, Boutique Means high-quality and elegant. If it wasn't high quality, then it wouldn't be boutique. I'm not refering to any small shop, because smaller shops like Wish bass have been rated quite poorly, while others are extremely high quality such as Conklin, Ken Lawrence, Alembic, Carl Tompson, Ritter and countless others. Even some newer guys can make good basses. Look at Jean Baudins Hidious Claw(I love that bass), that was mainly made by a guy who is just geting started. Now I know this is a rather biast forum, but you can't argue that no other companys are as high quality as Alembic, because thats a matter of opinion. Thats where I though you were going. Adriaan, Yes, inflation is caused by increasing prices lowering the value of the currency. We (america) are experiancing the worse inflation we have had in years. Luckly, Alembic isn't in Europe, because the current exchange rate is $1 EUR to $2 USD. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1014 Registered: 2-2006 |
I agree that there ARE other companys that are as high quality as Alembic, I wouldn't dare say Alembic is "THE BEST" for everybody. They are the best for me, but not for all. I have had and and still do have other basses that I think are just as good quality as Alembic, just not the my favorite. | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1198 Registered: 6-2002 |
Jordan, I do not have an economics degree, but AFAIK you have your definition backwards. Either that, or you're confusing (monetary) inflation with "price inflation". Also, as has been put forward by others, the cost of keeping the business running has been going up and up, especially in CA. This cost increase is leading to a price increase, and has nothing per se to do with inflation of any kind (although of course the monetary inflation contributes directly to the increase in business costs, dollar-for-dollar). The current exchange rate is that for 1 EUR you will get about 1.30 USD - the rate is probably different when going from USD to EUR. | ||
| alembic_hawaii
New Username: alembic_hawaii Post Number: 3 Registered: 10-2006 |
Dear friends, This is my take. As a plumbing contractor I would say that I have almost the same amount of money invested in tools as what I make a year using them. If one purchased an Alembic for $6,000, that amount plus the investment of an amp and the usual equipment it would take to be a professional bass player to me seems like a minimal investment to make a living. On the other hand if one is purchasing an Alembic for the sole purpose of hobby then their is no comparison as to the cost of it. I don't think that an Alembic should be in the class of affordability just for one's hobby sake. These beautiful works of Art are just that. And the ones producing them are artisans. They deserve top dollar for their efforts. I hope that Alembic keeps up their high standard and doesn't succumb to the competitive level of mass production like the other manufacturers has. I have waited 30 years to finally purchase the bass of my dreams and now it is about to happen. Some of my friends have said "why spend so much on a bass when you can get one that sounds just as good for less?". Well, I sit here almost daily and tune into this site just to druel over the sites of these beautiful works of art. I cannot wait to hold my new Series II custom named "Mele Aloha". Some like Harleys, some like Ferrari's, and some like Alembic's. God bless Alembic for their fine family values and quality workmanship. Aloha, Paul | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1016 Registered: 2-2006 |
Very well put Paul. Alembic = Kilohana! | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 781 Registered: 11-2002 |
"They raise their prices every year, at the same time" That depends on when you start counting. This may offer a more complete perspective. | ||
| alembic_hawaii
New Username: alembic_hawaii Post Number: 4 Registered: 10-2006 |
Now my blood is starting to boil more after reading more of the threads. Folks, the first Alembic that I could finally afford, (which is still the best bass I have ever had or heard except for other Alembics)is my single pick-up Excel which I have had for about 8 years now. This bass cost me about $1,800 then. I could have played that bass professionally and made a fortune off of it in itself without even ever haviing to purchase another bass in my lifetime. After reading some of these posts from people who don't appreciate quality I am starting to feel sorry that Alembic even has such an affordable bass with such a good sound. It's to bad that they don't just keep there price up to what they are really worth. The sound that I get from my excel far exceeds any sound out of basses of other manufacturers that cost $4,000 plus. But in fact I shouldn't even be comparing them because none of those even sound as good as my Excel. I know that the satisfaction that I get from my Excel to this day far exceeds anything from my Carvin which cost the same amount. It's like comparing cardboard to Gold. The God given talents that are put into Alembics are not up for value differentiating. The way I look at Alembics is if you have to ask how much it is then YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT!!! Please take your price complaints to the Warwick or Carvin Forums. Leave this forum for the discussion of talent and innovation. I am going to play my Excel right now just for a RUSH! That's what Alembic does for me. | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1910 Registered: 7-2004 |
Jordan: I don't know nearly as much about basses as many around here do, but I do know a thing or two about guitars having played for the better part of 40 years and currently in possesion of nearly 50 guitars of all types. I have NEVER EVER seen another guitar that equals an Alembic in build quality. Period. (If you know of one PLEASE tell me). I have some very nice instruments including a 1961 Strat, 1970 ES335, several Daions (IMHO the finest production line guitar ever constructed), PRS, Hofner, Bond, National, Fernandes Alembic copy, Aria Pro II Alembic copy, Phiga, Godin, Doug Irwin, and others. I go 2x a year to the World Guitar Show (both days) where I am always on the lookout for unusual quality instruments. In my experience, when it comes to guitars, not only does nothing beat Alembic, but nothing even comes close. As for the price increase, I am always amused when I hear rock 'n roll musicians complain about the cost of guitars and basses. Just go ask the cellist in the symphony orchestra how much they paid for their axe. Compared to the classical world, Alembics are fairly inexpensive! Bill, tgo | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 56 Registered: 10-2006 |
Too true, Bill. In my former capacity as recording crew supervisor for the NIU School of Music, I once heard the violinist for the Vermeer Quartet lament that a malfunctioning $3 rosin cake could render his $1,000,000 fiddle unplayable. Makes a custom Series seem a lot more doable, no? Peter | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 258 Registered: 9-2005 |
quote: "Mark, You would wish for cats with wings? My cats are enough trouble already, wing equipped cats would take it to a completely different level!" ... Okay... maybe I didn't think that one through... Ollie, not to argue, but just out of sincere curiousity, what companies do you regard as equal to Alembic? I'd like to check 'em out. I've seen a FEW individual, specific instruments that are of comparable build/feel quality. I'm not aware of any company that consistenly equals Alembic, and would be interested in checking them out -just for my own education, and being informed. I've NEVER seen/heard any other electric bass with electronics even close to Alembics... within the context of my knowledge, the Europa/Rogue electronics are substantially superior in cleaness/reproduction of sound than anyone elses' electronics. And the Series seem to be in a class by themselves. Just curious. | ||
| hifiguy
Member Username: hifiguy Post Number: 55 Registered: 10-2006 |
So many have said it so well, particularly Mark (8-string King) alembic_hawaii and bob, but it bears yet more repetition. An Alembic bass is an expression of the sonic and artistic limits of the possible at various price points. The cutting edge is _always_ expensive. Alembic has few if any economies of scale and makes virtually everything in house. Exotic woods are rare and expensive; they will not be getting any cheaper. Hand craftsmanship by artisans is expensive. The company could probably make more money if it built one offs for museums/collectors and selling them for $50,000 like Jens Ritter does. Not that there's anything wrong with what Ritter does, but Alembic has always focused on putting their extraordinary instruments into the hands of musicians who use Alembic's expression to express themselves. I am in no position to afford another Alembic at this point, but I cherish the one I own. If my house was on fire the two things I'd run in to rescue are my Alembic and my cat. If and when my finances once again get in order, my baby will be getting a custom sister or two or three. The electronics point is for me the fatal argument against "there are other equally good basses." Any instrument with off the rack Barts or such cannot be compared to an Alembic, period. The electronics in my Signature can do things that no conventional electronics can do. A 10% increase is what is needed for Alembic to continue doing what it does. So be it. They do what they do better than anyone else in the world. I'm sure Stradivari and Guarneri heard the same griping, but thankfully it didn't stop them. Paul | ||
| zappahead
Intermediate Member Username: zappahead Post Number: 138 Registered: 10-2002 |
I actually dont see much difference in the base prices of Alembics when you compare them to a lot of the other "boutique" guitar companies. Where Alembic 's prices differ is in the options. They do have the most expensive options I have seen anywhere. Im sure somewhere they are higher, but I aint seen it. That being said, if you choose to forgo a lot of the expensive options you probably get as much or more since their base wood options are pretty nice. As far as companies who are on par with Alembic I would put Giffen's stuff with anyones, Gustavvson's are interesting and if word of mouth is to be trusted they are making the best of the best at the moment. Its different with guitars though, Alembic's are a different beast and thats what I like about them. Just about everyone else is doing their spin on the same old thing, Alembic stands out on their own. Alembics prices are steep but really, comparatively they are just at the top of the scale. I would only consider their prices over the top if they were on a plateau of their own and they arent. Plenty of people are charging this much. I also cant see why Bass players can complain, on ebay Alembics are a fantastic deal. You frequently see even unique custom jobs for a song. Guitar players have to wait and pick through baritones and orions and the rare series 1 from the 70s that you have trouble trusting. | ||
| richbass939
Senior Member Username: richbass939 Post Number: 775 Registered: 11-2004 |
Personally, naive or not, I trust the Wickershams to do the right thing. If they wanted to make a pile of money without regard for the good Alembic name or the current or distant-future owners they would have artificially pumped up the value of the brand name and sold the company to the highest bidder long ago. They could have an Alembic-Squire or Alembic-Metro line that is made by the best artisans 35 cents per hour can buy. If they were mainly interested in how much money they could make, there are better ways of going about it. I'm sure they are good enough at business to figure out how to make a financial killing if that is what they wanted to do. Instead they choose to keep moving along at much the same production pace they have had for years. They probably choose to live in California because they like it there. If they didn't, then they would be somewhere else. I don't want them to move someplace where they wouldn't be as happy so that new guitars and basses would cost a little bit less. They have come up with outstanding innovations in electric instruments and have built a great company over the last 35 - 40 years. They have the best customer service I have ever seen. Several people in the company (including Mica) have spent a total of 30 - 45 minutes talking with me about my instruments and things that would help me be a more satisfied Alembic owner. I'm sure they knew I would not be ordering a new instrument and it didn't matter. (Good luck getting someone at a relatively high level in Fender Corp. to spend half an hour talking about the seven-year-old Jazz bass you just bought on e-bay.) When I registered my first Alembic and requested a build record, Mica also sent me a bag of tools that I didn't even ask for. This isn't how one runs a company whose focus is strictly on the bottom line. I hope that they have made a lot of money building Alembics. I think they have earned it. I'm happy that the integrity with which the Wickershams have built their products and their business remains intact. Rich | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1915 Registered: 7-2004 |
Why does Alembic do business the way it does? For the same reason the Grateful Dead didn't put out albums full of 3 minute 1-4-5 songs proclaiming "Oh Baby, I love you". Bill, tgo | ||
| tbrannon
Advanced Member Username: tbrannon Post Number: 268 Registered: 11-2004 |
Well put Rich~ I sat here for a few minutes after reading the latest additions to this thread and was trying to come up with some way of expressing how much I appreciate Alembic. I found that it wasn't an easy task, but that's never stopped me before I like Alembic. That's it. I didn't say that I like Alembic basses or that I like Alembic preamps. I like Alembic. I like the products, I like the service, I like the attitude and I like the fact that they don't compromise on quality. I feel lucky to own a used Rogue. I never thought I'd be able to afford an Alembic, but now that I've got one you can be sure that I'll be putting aside money for the day when I can afford to call Alembic and order my own custom. It'll be expensive, but worth every penny. | ||
| terryc
Member Username: terryc Post Number: 92 Registered: 11-2004 |
Sod the money, you may be dead tomorrow, life is for living, whether it be basses, cars or spending money on the person you love, you came into the world with nothing and you leave with nothing. Alembic basses are the best in the world and that is what you are paying for, besides you cannot help feeling good when some other bass players asks you what bass you have and you reply 'Alembic'. The look on their faces is worth every penny!!! | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 244 Registered: 5-2004 |
Honestly ... most pro bass players on my circuit have never heard of Alembics. They are working class stiffs and know what they see ... the mid range basses you normally see at the Guitar Center. Not the hand made basses most people don't buy or can't aford. When they see and hear my Alembic they drool for sure but the name does nothing for most of them. Of course after I TELL them about Alembics and they see and if they're lucky play my Alembic the realize what they've been missing. I have a modulus 5 string fretless and that actually get's more looks and ohhhs and ahhhs then my Stanley Clark ... because most of them have heard of Modulus and more pro rock bass players (like Flea and the guy in The Dave Matthews Band) endorce them. Personally I love my Modulus but it's not an Alembic ... but for them, in their minds it's a high end bass they're aquanted with. AND every now and then you see one at your local every day music store. So I guess my point is in my experience Alembics are so rare in general to the average bass player most don't even know about them. Not only are we Alembic owners rare but in my experience most bass players don't even know about Alembics. If they all knew about them and wanted one the wait for an Alembic would be measured in years, not months. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1019 Registered: 2-2006 |
Well Bill, guess I won't be sending you that Sonny & Cher CD for Christmas..um..oh.. I mean uh Hanukah. LOL | ||
| inthelows
Advanced Member Username: inthelows Post Number: 215 Registered: 11-2006 |
Well I'm still saving up for my next Alembic. Whatever the cost will be it will be worth it to me! In the end that's what matters most. Is it worth it to you? It will take a little longer but I've learned I can wait. My (10% of) two cents. NLP | ||
| 82daion
Junior Username: 82daion Post Number: 16 Registered: 5-2005 |
As a possible Alembic owner, it's the service and purpose of the company as well as the instruments it produces that have kept me considering one since I first started playing bass. I may not be able to afford a custom at the moment, but, should I get an Alembic, I'm looking forward to having the support of the company and this community-I haven't seen a more unified group of owners and players on the Internet. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1094 Registered: 9-2002 |
We can't help that . . . they've taken us in like family. I can NOT think of anybody I'd rather spend my money with, not to mention the axes are just the best. How often can you buy a legend? J o e y | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 263 Registered: 9-2005 |
I think another significant thing that most of us know, but that deserves occaisional repeating... it that an Alembic neck-thru comes standard with several significant CUSTOM options at NO EXTRA CHARGE: most importantly, you can choose your scale length and fingerboard dimensions... they build a bass CUSTOM... JUST RIGHT... for YOU. Built into the quote, no additional charge. Also, you get a choice of several very attractive standard woods... and I'm pretty sure there's more than 1 "no extra charge" body wood choice as well. And they don't charge extra for fretless and/or lefty. I understand that lot's of us -myself included- like to have more than a few options on our dream basses. This adds up, of course. Nonetheless, the point remains that one can get a VERY VERY nice albeit relatively modest CUSTOM ALEMBIC for a good deal. If you get an Essense bass with no options other than standard, and add the right "special of the month" you've got yourself an awesome bass. If you can upgrade just a little to a Rogue, you get even more, and a Europa is even a little more. These 3 Alembic models are all AWESOME... each a little more than the previous. Oh, I also forgot to remind us that you usually have at least a couple body types to choose from at no extra charge. Anyway, any one of these 3 Alembic models can be a unique and awesome CUSTOM ALEMBIC bass that would give a great account of itself in the bass world. Add in the right special, it get's even more awesome. And you can always minimize, and pick just 1, or maybe 2 essential features, and pay the price. MY next/second custom is middle of the road pricey, higher than many other Alembics, but lower than many others, to be sure. Initially, the first thing I looked at was what it would be to get a replacement for the stolen Elan with Europa electronics I'd had. Well, excluding the Quilted Maple top I'd had, a replacement -a standard 6-String Europa- was $7900. Knock off 25% dealer discount and add in the right special of the month, you've got a totally killer custom bass for a little under 6 grand. If you're only talking 4 or 5 strings, it's less, and a Essense with an added Q switch is a very competitive bass -in terms of quality to price ratio, and also compared to other brands of basses -no contest! So even with the price increase, let's remember that the standard price is really 75% of the price, plus you get several wood and body choices at no extra charge, and a monthly special to sweeten things up. For that, you get A LOT of bass... (or guitar... don't want to overlook the fine guitars, no sir/ma'aam!). And you can always choose to upgrade JUST A LITTLE... pick a little thing or two, or one big thing, if you have to. There is of course no doubt that if you get a top of the line custom Series II with a Triple Omega Stinger body and Ziricote BTC on both sides with laser LEDs and Ebony laminates and added individual bass and treble switches... it sure wouldn't be cheap. But while the "ultimate have-every/all big and small details I want bass" is most surely VERY EXPENSIVE, the bass that the rest of us non-rich schmucks can afford if we work really hard, save, and pay it off isn't too hideous. | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 89 Registered: 8-2005 |
Good points 8SK. For example, I have an Essence 4 which is stock by Alembic standards. It has a birds-eye/quilt maple top (no charge) and it looks killer! They did it with a purpleheart accent and maple pinstripe. Abalone inlays are the only upgrade. It sounds and looks killer and the price was comparable to most other high end/boutique type basses. Of course I got a good deal because it was a 2004 bass, but even at current rates - a very nice one can be had for probably around $4,000. Some people pay that much for jazz bass clones. I will probably add a Q switch eventually but all spending is now on hold due to my custom. :D | ||
| jsaylor
Member Username: jsaylor Post Number: 75 Registered: 11-2006 |
Well I had nothing to do today seeing as I am on Christmas break, so I decided to stop on in. It seems we brought up the quality issue again. Price increase isn't due to the high quality, rather to maintain high quality. I'm also seeing custom options being mentioned as a price increase. I don't think that has anything to do with it. If that was the case, then individual prices for certian types of wood would rise, not all prices in general. I still do believe it is due to inflation that the prices are going up. For example, back in the 70's I believe a Series 2 was $4k. Their now $16k. I guess we should all be lucky their still is a family owned busness in this industry filled with giant guitar corporations, so Alembic has to do what it has to do to survive. Unfortunatly, with this price increase, im now even further from my custom Alembic. Edit: And I hope you all have a great Christmas. (Message edited by jsaylor on December 23, 2006) | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 424 Registered: 3-2004 |
All the more incentive to work harder, save more dilligently, plan more effectively and make your dream come true. If that is indeed what you really want, you will find a way to make it happen. Just ordered my fretless, took advantage of the special and deepened my relationship with this company and I feel.......................good! Have a blessed holiday and prosperous new year, Danno | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 265 Registered: 9-2005 |
Congrats, Danno! Whatcha gettin? | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 425 Registered: 3-2004 |
Excel 5 lined fretless, maple top, ebony board, sustain block, Europa guts, black finish w red led's. It is a mere fraction of many of the customs of late but it is do-able. Let us all have a wonderful year! | ||
| 5stringho
Junior Username: 5stringho Post Number: 46 Registered: 11-2006 |
Congrats on your new Excel!! Keep us posted on it's progress. Merry Christmas to you!!! The'Ho.... | ||
| inthelows
Advanced Member Username: inthelows Post Number: 238 Registered: 11-2006 |
This has been a great thread to read. All of the comments and points given have only made me realize only more of just how fortunate I am, and to be thankful and appreciative of what I've got. Of all the lines written, terryc's "The look on their faces is worth every penny!!!" to me says it all! Thanks to Alembic, thanks to all of you who make this forum so intresting. Have a safe and happy holiday. NLP |
