| Author | Message | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 80 Registered: 6-2007 |
When performing in front of a live audience, do people expect a bass solo from your music more so with an Alembic than another bass? It’s funny, because I sometimes play, with a FJ-P with the same identical bass line, and people almost never focus on my bass actions or sounds, and fewer distractions. However, when I strap on my Series I, they can't take their eyes off the bass. This adds more pressure of course, to playing to their expectations or is it just my perceptions? Be honest  | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 1220 Registered: 10-2003 |
If you're in a room full of bassists, then yes, they expect a solo. Any other audience and it's pretty much all in your head! ;) John | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 81 Registered: 6-2007 |
I would think bass player expect a solo regardless of the bass I would choose. But I would perceive this more so, with the alembic. True? The problem I think with most bass solo's, most are more "clee'shay" fillers. The bass was never really designed to be the lead instrument. But over the years, with so many colorful players, the bass playing "definitions" has expanded so much, increased people's perceptions, and thu are expecting more "sound candy" for their ears. Righ?(Please comment here...) However, I agree with you, it's a "mind thing" too. I play a funk/jazz style. It might be in my mind, to think people who listen to funk/jazz bass riffs, to some degree, are more demanding of a bass groove. Good comment, thanks. | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1837 Registered: 3-2004 |
I'm afraid that the majority of the population, musician or not, has no idea what an Alembic is. As such, they can have no expectation as a result of someone playing one. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1628 Registered: 2-2006 |
Generally speaking most people, even the majority of “musicians” have NO IDEA of what an Alembic is? (At least that’s what I’ve experienced; example-how mean people know that an REO Speed Wagon was a real car made back in the 50’s). And most people that are in the audience are there for 1 of 3 reasons; to dance, pick up chicks/dudes or to drink, the later being the most dominate reason. So I see three scenarios; 1. It’s early in the night and the crowd is interested in “each other” in which case a bass solo will probably be a disaster. 2. It’s late in the night and the crowd is interested in “each other” but have had plenty to drink in which case a bass solo might go over OK. 3. It doesn’t matter what time it is, early or late in the gig, and you have someone that sees your Alembic and knows what it is, at which point not only will they expect a Bass solo but will probably request one. Scenario one: Play the solo as long as they can dance to it. Scenario two: Play the solo and make sure they recognize the solo. i.e. Slow Ride, Brick House, Shaky Ground, Money…… Scenario three: Play the solo, BUT you’d better make the strings melt off that sucker! You don’t want to be remembered as the cat that played a white collar musical instrument but should’ve been on the “Blue Collar Comedy Tour”! (even though you didn’t get-er-done) Olie | ||
| mele_aloha
Advanced Member Username: mele_aloha Post Number: 294 Registered: 1-2007 |
Hi hendi, Ya know, I'm surprisesd that someone hasn't already mentioned what I am about to. But it is something that I have been taught or brought awareness to about Alembic, and especially the Series basses with their "Open" sound. I would be willing to bet that the "presence" or Clarity of the Series has an effect on the audience that other basses don't have. That cleanliness of sound cuts through like a knife even if you are toned down they can more clearly hear your Alembic than most basses. Of course this is aside from the looks which is what they immediately focus on when they hear that sound. Anybody care to expound with way more knowledge than me? P | ||
| flaxattack
Senior Member Username: flaxattack Post Number: 1769 Registered: 4-2004 |
paul is dead on, its not like i need to take a solo alembics are so clean and so unlike other basses that it is noticeable right away. i have done open mic nights and have had bass players and regular musicians come up and ask- is that an alembic- man it sounds good,so clean, as far as solos are concerned, mine starts with the first note and ends with the last- lol thats the beauty of playing dead tunes. i get to play lead bass. so ripping the opening of shakedown or taking the lead out of china cat or eyes, its all the same to me. we are after all- THE ANCHORS! | ||
| flaxattack
Senior Member Username: flaxattack Post Number: 1770 Registered: 4-2004 |
AND YES I CAN SIT IN THE POCKET.... HURTS LIKE HELL-LMAO- but i actually get off on a low d and let it ring | ||
| 5stringho
Intermediate Member Username: 5stringho Post Number: 160 Registered: 11-2006 |
People in this area don't know what an Alembic is, you know, "Olympic? Who make's that, Fender?" Rarely does anyone ask to hear a Bass solo, except for my drunk Bassist buddies. I'm almost glad, as I can't play a solo anyway:[....so, I just try to stay in the pocket, groove, and hope the little hotties get up and shake that booty, the fellers buy them more drinks, and the Club Owner is happy and pays us well!! But, I do get to sorta rip on "War Pigs"! Have fun! Mike, Tho (Message edited by 5stringho on November 16, 2007) | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 82 Registered: 6-2007 |
No question about the clear sound. I was turned on to the Dixie Dregs back in the early 80's and I listened to a few cuts and BAM it hit me, I heard the alembic bass sound! Grant it, I never seen the members gear prior, then I see a Cat name Andy West with a Fat Ass long scale Alembic. In side my soul, I was laughing because "you know, what you know, when you know..." and it was the clean sound with that slight echo hum. That clean sound is having that first sip of coffee... no, I mean a double expresso at star-bucks! It wakes your ass up! DAMMMM!!! | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 665 Registered: 3-2004 |
I would pose that anyone is a gear head would expect something impressive if the bass and rig is high end. Any bass player in the know would recognize the quality of the instrument even if the brand is not familar to them. "Man if he has enough money for that, He must be good!" Folks may not know the brand but I'm often told how cool they look and how great they sound. I don't have the opportunity to play solos in my band. Just intros and lay down the foundation and drive the band. Now that we're a 4pc as opposed to a 5pc, my sound has more of a role than before. Wish I could work the synth pedal into it like back in the day! | ||
| benson_murrensun
Junior Username: benson_murrensun Post Number: 14 Registered: 5-2007 |
I think that a typical audience has no idea what an Alembic is, or even that one type of bass guitar sounds significantly different than another type of bass guitar. What they do know is, are they familiar with the tune?, and does it have an undeniable groove?. Many instruments can make a pleasing sound; as players we know that one type of bass guitar may have a different sound than another type. In this Alembic club, we probably have the opinion that Alembics sound better than most others. But this is subjective. When I first started playing I wanted to get "the good tone." I bought a lot of gear, and, basically confused my ears/mind, while filling up my house with a lot of stuff I couldn't possibly use, just because I don't have the time to spend messin' with all of it. I have come to the following two conclusions: 1 - good tone can be defined as tone that inspires ME (to play more and to play better), and 2 - at least half of what makes tone good is in the hands of the player and not in the instrument/rig. It's like circular reasoning: the better I get, the better I sound, so the better I get, etc. | ||
| keurosix
Advanced Member Username: keurosix Post Number: 208 Registered: 10-2005 |
I must agree with the general concensus that Bassists would want to hear a solo, and everyone else may not care, but would definately hear a big difference in the clarity of the bass being an Alembic. It's been that way for me with my past gigs. To expound on what Danno brings up: Have you ever seen a Lamborghini driven by a simple lug-nut weaving in and out of traffic, nearly missing everything in his path? Probably not. If he has half a brain to earn the dough to buy the car and insure it, he'll most likely equate a dollars-per-mile mentality and drive it rather sensibly. Now to the Alembic owner. When I got my first Series 1, my Ampeg SVT didn't sound good to me anymore. I worked up a tri-amped component rig that did it some justice (long retired - my back thanks me!) My playing went from a "7" (on a 1~10 scale) to a "9" (always room for improvement!) and my playing got very tasty. No flashy stuff for me. Just solid in-the-pocket playing with tight fills that followed the drummer. If a solo was required, I would build it up by starting simple and adding to it so that I never got out of hand. I was ever conscious of keeping the groove. In a way, I justified the pride and resposibility of Alembic ownership in my playing. It's made me a better player and musician. Kris | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 83 Registered: 6-2007 |
I think wood is magic. It has so much energy and warmth. Its like looking at beautiful woman, in a crowd of people. She stands out, and for a moment, everything is alright in this very troubled world. If you play the right notes, she will sing for you and others. This how I feel when I strap on my shorty. | ||
| keurosix
Advanced Member Username: keurosix Post Number: 211 Registered: 10-2005 |
Ohh, Hal, you ARE talking about yer Alembic? LOL! | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 84 Registered: 6-2007 |
Yeah. My shorty is my Series "one" "short scale/small body" bass. This is an Alembic Site, is it not? Hope my vibes are understood and age appropriate. | ||
| pauldo
Junior Username: pauldo Post Number: 27 Registered: 6-2006 |
5stringho - oh but you can play a solo! Sometimes you just keep playing the 'groove'while eveyone else sits back. ta da! it's a solo AND it keeps their butts movin'. Sometimes a solo comes my way and the first 4 bars are the 'normal' bass parts - then I just start adding (or subtracting) notes and all of a sudden it is this creative, greasy, groovy solo! | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 85 Registered: 6-2007 |
Yeah, and its cool when this happens and the band is strong enough to keep the grove (the bottom) to give you this freedom. Keyboards really are essential in a band, to provide this open door. Power treo's (bass, lead and drums) are more trickey, and in this case, it requires a more quiet groove solo for the bass to stay in the pocket, but (and yet) doing some driving solo conversations which interacts with the audience. Good solo's are feed from the audience. They provide the energy to make the leap. This also where you and you band members set yourselves apart but keeping a balance to the unity and love you have for eachothers sounds. If you understand my point... Yeah, that's magic because its a musical conversation, and sometimes the music can be in happeness, or in argumentative funk/rock groove. The message is great in either case, as long as it is understood by at least other musicans listening. I am very strong on peers comments, because they walk the walk too. Sorry for my ramblings... It's hard to explain sometimes. | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 457 Registered: 11-2005 |
Couple of months ago at a show, there were 2 women who walked up and asked what kind of guitar I was playing. I thought to myself, "Wow these ladies recognize quality when they see it..." and told them it was an Alembic. They nodded and smiled, and then we started the next song. A little bit later, one of them came back and asked, "OK, but why is it so much longer than those other guitars, and why are there so many little black buttons on it?" oh... I didn't think it was possible to live 38 years and be a music fan and not know that there was such a thing as a bass, but apparently, it is. I think musicians tend to assume that everyone else hears music the way we do, and many don't. It's like Hal writes above... "Man, that was killer!" means a little more when it comes from another player. | ||
| mele_aloha
Advanced Member Username: mele_aloha Post Number: 297 Registered: 1-2007 |
Thanks flax, I think you know what you are talking about! P | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5701 Registered: 5-2002 |
Well Charles, you have to admit, your bass is an absolutely beautiful work of art. So even if they didn't know what a bass is, they did notice that it was an extraordinary looking instrument of some type! | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 88 Registered: 6-2007 |
The facts of the matter these day, the next generation of kids really lose out with the current music culture. Man, I wouldn't be inspired to play today, if it was not for seeing people who cared about playing "real musical instruments" of the past. Listen to the musical phrasings of the 50's, 60's, and 70's that was such a wonderful time for learning sounds, and the dedication it took performers to release such magic. I really feel sorry for "Fartist" (non-Artist) who serve "Mu-sick" (Non-Music) with only love for the money and 15 minutes of fame. The Nilly Vanilly's, and sample heads. An exaggerated sense of self-importance; pimps. These same producers, probably wouldn't know a bass from a broom stick. | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 89 Registered: 6-2007 |
It it taste from the listeners, or is it musical taste from the producers? Who knows, and a musician (a true musician) really don't care, and it matters just as much as knowing the going rate of tea selling in China. We are a tough people to please, because in most cases in order to be aware of Alembic, for some, it was a awakening for us to become even more aware of music. Its pretty hard to fall back asleep in mediocrity, after the first pluck and it was also, "Good to the last Pluck" :-) Happy Thanksgiving! | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 329 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hendixclarke..totally agree with you, I once was given a gig where I had learned the set list but get this..it was a cheesy covers band and the girl singer said very politley ' no need to plug in' as they whole lot was on a mini disc. The drummer was absent but the only 'live' sound was her voice along with the non playing keyboard player and non playing guitar player. Easiest money I ever earned but what a sham. As far as noticing my MK, where i live they are a rarity and the non musicians ie audience sometimes comment on the instrument as it looks very unusual(bubinga faceing) | ||
| tbrannon
Senior Member Username: tbrannon Post Number: 583 Registered: 11-2004 |
When my Alembic first arrived in New Zealand, I was asked several times, "What is that thing made out of? Is it real wood?" And those were comments from the 2 VERY talented guitarists in the band. Neither of them had ever seen a non-painted finish in person before. In terms of a solo- not from me. | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 90 Registered: 6-2007 |
I am not at all surprised about the guitarist never seeing real wood. Discovery of new things, is a wonderful thing Companies paint, to cover up flaws and wood quality. It's a very "cheap" process, to ignore wood quality for the sake of mass production. I have no problems with painted guitars, because at least, people can still pick a guitar play them. In fact, I thank God for owning many of them over the years. However, companies who produce guitars "showing the wood" are primarily concern with wood quality at the heart of production. We ultimately pay the price for this preference. As to the better sound, is debatable. But as far as beauty, no questions about it, nature wins over paint anyday. I remember seeing a "see-through" solid plastic guitars during the 80's and they sounded great, but it was a gimmick/fad of the times. Back then, I wouldn't go out and buy one, and today, it would be a nightmere...but they are cool. If you are a drummer, the "see through" drums was also around too... | ||
| rami
Senior Member Username: rami Post Number: 705 Registered: 6-2002 |
I remember watching Stanley Clarke on the Arsenio Hall show way back in the early 90's. Stanley didn't do a Bass solo. He was playing his short scale Series I. Arsenio was definitely mesmerized by that Bass. He couldn't stop ooohing and aaahing over it. It was almost as if Stanley was upstaged by his own Bass! One thing I learned from that was that an Alembic definitely has serious stage presence whether or not you even know what it is. ;) | ||
| hendixclarke
Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 91 Registered: 6-2007 |
Man, that's what I am talking about. It's magic and Stanley knows it too. I had yet, see any of Stanley Clarke's albums where he didn't pose with his Alembic or his bass was pictured solo. You would think the bass was alive or something. "If this bass could talk..." Stanely markets the hell out of his bass. BB King like...(remeber Lucile). Stanley created this myth with the Alembic bass. I am not sure if this was a smart move on his part or not. Arsenio Hall probably was just identifying to those elements Stanley presented. But I do know, Stanley chosen a great company to symbolize himself. When its all said and done, Stanely is more valuable than a bizillion Alembics. For in this matrial world, we only get one Stanely Clarke. This is why I change up basses when I play. I don't want to be that "Alembic playing guy" but simply, a bass player. Stanely Clarke is the Alembic Playing guy, that position is very much filled. Only a legendary company can have such a wonderful problem. Where the gifted is confused with what to put forward, the tool or the talent. Deep stuff to ponder on Turkey Day eve. | ||
| hifiguy
Intermediate Member Username: hifiguy Post Number: 120 Registered: 10-2006 |
At a gig a couple of weeks ago the bassist in one of the other bands (Sol Spectres, and they're great, esp if you like Canterbury-style prog/fusion) and I traded "first sightings." He'd never seen an Alembic in person and I'd never seen either a Carvin or a Steinberger electric upright 5-string. The guy was a tremendous player but flipped over my Alembic. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 1233 Registered: 10-2003 |
There are worse problems than being "that Alembic playing guy.." ;) | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 113 Registered: 6-2007 |
Sometimes I don't know what get's more attention; "walking" my Alembic or my Akita dog. | ||
| oujeebass
Intermediate Member Username: oujeebass Post Number: 109 Registered: 10-2002 |
If your playing an Alembic, it typically symbolizes that your an artist that only settles for the very best, and does not play for anyone but themselves. I sold out once....... once. Never doing that again. Thats why I got an Alembic, and I hope "Lowly" never lets me down. | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 114 Registered: 6-2007 |
Man, I hate to say it, but it happened to me too. I don't know what the hell I was thinking when I sold my Alembic back in the late 80's because I sure didn't need the money. It was a long scale S1 "big bertha" (I called it). And damn, she could sing. Yeah, and after she was gone, I was left with a deep cut for years until she was replaced with another Alembic. (Nothing else would/could do it for me...) I never really though I could care so much about something material before, and that bass really "got in". It was so beautiful in every way. So over the past 20 years, Ivied been mainly playing electric guitars (and keeping my mind off of basses, for the pain was too deep...). Since I found luck again with another Alembic, it filled the empty spot completely and wonderfully. I learned a very important lesson. NEVER SELL ANOTHER ALEMBIC... I paid 1300.00 in 82 for the S1. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 1234 Registered: 10-2003 |
$1300 in 82, yeah that sounds about right. When I lived in L.A., Alembic basses were always in The Recycler for $1200-$1300, and for a while The Bass Center on Ventura Blvd had an 8-string (Scorpion maybe, I at least remember it had a knobby peghead) sans electronics for $400... I traded my Alembic to an older brother for a new Steinberger in '85, solely due to the weight. The L2A was/is a wonderful instrument, but I never really connected with it (or any other) and ultimately got him to trade back, solely because of the weight! ;) I think he's actually happier with the Steinberger, though, so it's all good.. John | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 70 Registered: 11-2007 |
Hindsight is a big stick that is good for beating yourself up with folks! Back in 86 I was looking for a handmade bass in Glasgow (Scotland, UK) and there it was..in the window of a local emporium with a sign above it proclaiming " Yes, it is the real thing!" A new birdseye maple topped Alembic spoiler! Man, you would be lucky to find an Alembic anywhere in europe at this point..but Scotland! I had never seen an Alembic in the flesh before..just pics! It was like something that had been handcrafted by angels in another dimension. I had to have it, but didnt have enough money..so i saved and saved. Each week I would go to the window ( no-body was actually allowed to touch it!) and stare at it for what seemed like hours. I finally had enough money to put down, and set off to have the axe of my dreams..it was gone. I was gutted  Real pain ensued. Figuring (correctly) that it was a one off to find an Alembic in this, or any, local store I bought a WAL instead. Wonderful bass, but you know what its like when you dont get exactly what you wanted..anything else is just a second choice substitute! I subsequently went through bass after bass. I stupidly traded the Wal for a Jaydee (because it looked like an Alembic..nothing but trouble!) traded the Jaydee for a Musicman stingray because I wanted a "reliable" bass, traded the Stingray for a Vigier graphite, went through various Fender jazzes, Rickenbacker 4001s etc etc etc. All because the Alembic was sold before I got to it! Here I am almost 22 years down the line and I finally have an Alembic persuader...what a journey! The moral of the story? Dont settle for anything other than what your heart really wants! On the question of being obliged to take a solo if you are playing an Alembic? If it feels right and you have the chops then do it, if not then it is enough for the audience to have the pleasure of being in the presence of an Alembic, enjoying its tone and being dazzled by its beauty...and being jealous of you | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 115 Registered: 6-2007 |
Its true. There's nothing in the world like having something you want, and you have all the means to get it, but can't because of things "out-side your controls". Its like having worthless money. You have the money for the things you want, but what you want, is not for sale. Man, its a hell of a position to be in... and I believe it's worse than not having the money at all. At least when you don't have the money, you knew this day one and it easy to adjust to make it a wish...no problem. Having the money, damn... you're closer in reaching those things you want, but yet you still can't get it...? OOOH its a crying shame and it's harder to cope. Timing is everything. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5737 Registered: 5-2002 |
In my view, the acquisition of things does not bring true joy. A joyful life, again as I see it, is lived through compassion; compassion for oneself, and compassion for all beings. Appreciation of the work of artisans, such as the craftspeople at Alembic, is a wonderful experience, as is the appreciation of a beautiful sunset. Playing and sharing music on an Alembic is also a wonderful experience. It seems reasonable to me that one would want to acquire and play an Alembic. It seems reasonable to think that one's ability to communicate musically will be enhanced with the acquisition of an Alembic. It seems reasonable to me that the karma associated with an Alembic, through the family, the history, the craftspeople, would be a consideration in choosing an Alembic. However, if one is not in a position to acquire an Alembic, or any other thing, one's ability to lead a compassionate, joyful life is not diminished. To the degree that we are attached to outcomes, to the degree that we have attachments, aversions and even indifferences, we will lead lives of suffering; and we will cause suffering for others. To the degree that we can live our daily lives free of attachments, aversions and indifferences, we can live in equanimity and be of benefit to others. The acquisition of things, the fulfillment of desires, can bring a brief, momentary happiness; a momentary respite from the daily tribulations that one may be suffering. But it is only a fleeting happiness; it's like taking a week long vacation from one's job, and then returning on Monday morning to find that you're just as tired of the daily grind as you were before you left for vacation. It's like going to your favorite restaurant and enjoying a nice meal, and then getting really pissed off in traffic on the way back home. The momentary happiness isn't deep and abiding. The acquisition of things and the fulfillment of desires are not skillful tools for living a joyful life. We are on this planet for a very brief period of time. We have a limited amount of time to find, and to learn to use, tools that will enable us to live compassionate lives, to share some measure of joy and peace with the other people with whom we are sharing this planet at this very moment. Each of us can only be where we are right now. And that's ok. Karma brought us to this point. And we move forward from here. All of our experiences in life are part of who we are right now. To fully accept with an open heart who we are right now, to fully love ourselves unreservedly, allows us to be fully accepting and loving of our fellow human beings. That we have not acquired certain things that we desire for ourselves is not an impediment to being compassionate toward ourselves and others, to living a joyful life. But that's just my view, based on my experiences and observations. Others will have different views. | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 71 Registered: 11-2007 |
Everything happens for a reason, of that I am sure. We all have lessons to learn in our individual journeys through this life..that is how we grow! The hardships that we suffer teach us many things..after all "that which doesnt kill us makes us stronger." The Alembic I saw back in 86 wasnt meant for me as much as I didnt like it at the time, but I know one thing for certain, It just enhances my fulfillment of being a proud owner now | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 116 Registered: 6-2007 |
Simply stated and I agree. To live a life without joy, is also "simply" impossible. Therefore, getting "stuff" to enrich your life don't do it for me. I am a 43 year old guy, who loves preparing my kitchen to create my chocolate chip cookies for my children and who happens to come over. People tell me, the cookies are sweet and wonderful, and they can't stop going to the jar after trying them. Making those cookies are a pain in my back, but sometime the joy in my heart overwhelms me to do it anyway. There's nothing like taking mental pictures of people love what I made. When it comes down to it, the cookies I made, was a bridge to get us together and "kill time." If you can own time for youself, to bring joy, then you got joy. No matter what, if the product(s) are good, its magic, and people will smile and love the hard work you did for them, but you found joy because it was not easy to do. Joy is the journey of doing thing for sake of love. | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 117 Registered: 6-2007 |
"that which doesnt kill us makes us stronger." I don't agree. Some people watched or discovered to learn their whole family were wiped of the face of the earth by many causes: war, nature, folishness, accidently... How is a survivor (man, woman, child) made stronger in that situation? I always disliked that statement... Yet, I understood your message. No harm. | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 118 Registered: 6-2007 |
"that which doesnt kill us makes us AGE (older) is more like it..." | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 72 Registered: 11-2007 |
You have carry on after witnessing such tragedy..you simply have to for the honour of your loved ones memory. Thats the thing, they would never want you to give up on life. When those who we love, admire and cherish falter we have to stand tall, pick up the standard and plough on through the adversity..we have no choice. That requires strength. To have no choice but to have to carry on in their memory makes us stronger. That is what that saying is all about in the context that you provided. Thats the thing about pain..it hurts like hell, but it lets us know we are still alive my friend! | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 119 Registered: 6-2007 |
Thank you for your follow up message. I do agree with you... A loved one who's gone, never really is, because all that was good in their lives, now lives through you. Yeah, I believe this is what life is all about. However, the world's ills and tragic consequenses don't always come with warning labels or methods for preparation. I remember being at my mother's side, in her last days of her life. After she passed away, I must have aged 20 years "just like that"... | ||
| byoung
Senior Member Username: byoung Post Number: 842 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dave, While I mostly agree with you, and I'd sum things up as: "a true craftsman doesn't blame his tools" There is something to having the right tool to express your muse. I know that for myself, getting in the zone/finding my muse/etc. can be a difficult thing, and if the right tool comes along (to help), then it's generally worth what you pay. I'm not sure what you meant about attachments, but I suspect that you're referring to "things", not people. Attachments to people are the only thing that makes life worth living. | ||
| byoung
Senior Member Username: byoung Post Number: 844 Registered: 12-2004 |
And my comment on the original question is: Yes, people expect more, because you brought something that stands out. I suppose they'd think the same thing if you dressed like Bootsy-- you're drawing attention to yourself and are expected to back it up. I don't necessarily think this obligates a bass solo, just that you better bring your "A Game". | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 75 Registered: 11-2007 |
Im sorry to hear that Hal, when you live through that kind of experience you fully understand what real sadness and loss is! The world just keeps turning and everyone else goes about their business as usual..you feel like screaming "dont you know what has happened?" Yeah, its life, its deep and its hard to understand at times | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5740 Registered: 5-2002 |
Bradley; I'm sitting here trying to craft a response to your question, but I keep deleting my attempts. I've been thinking about this for well over an hour now, probably close to two, and there are a lot of things that I want to say to address your question, but there's no way I can get it in a post of reasonable length. And it would take a very long time to write. That attachment causes suffering is observable (for instance it's fairly well observable in divorce court). But that's not to say that attachment is "wrong" or even that suffering is "bad". (By the way, for those of you unfamiliar with the distinction, in this context "suffering" is not the same thing as "pain".) I think that the important thing here is the awareness that attachment causes suffering. It seems to me that our culture here in the US (I've never lived in another country) promotes the idea that you can buy happiness, and it seems to me that a lot of people just accept this unquestioningly. It seems to me that a lot of people are unhappy with where they are in life at this very moment, and are always looking for the next thing that will make them happy. But that "happiness" is fleeting. Still they keep at it, one thing after another, always pursuing but never arriving. It never occurs to them that they can fully and compassionately accept who they are right now; that tool has never been available to them, they're not aware of the concept. And it runs counter to a culture based on consumerism. Yes, there are people with whom I have very close relationships; and being separated from them can be sad. But that's ok. I can fully accept with an open heart who and where I am right now, attachments, suffering and all. I think of love as being selfless. There is a teaching, a tool, that love is not jealous or boastful, which to me is similar to saying that love is selfless. Attachment, as I use the word, is not selfless. It seems to me that you can fully and selflessly love someone, and at the same time also be attached to that person. Thus it hurts to be separated from someone with whom you are very close, but love is not jealous; we can fully accept the situation with an open heart. Because who and where we are at this very moment is all there is. It seems to me that for many people, "love" is not selfless, but is based on attachment itself. And it seems that in such a case, when separated from the person to whom they are attached, the suffering is not "acceptable". And it further seems to me that for many people the reason that this is the case is that the tools of compassion and acceptance have never been made available to them. When someone pulls out in front on them in traffic, they get pissed off, they react in anger, they're thinking about what a jerk the other driver is. That's always been the way the world works for them. They are not aware that there would even be another way to react. The tools have not been made available to them. That's who they are right now. That's ok. Perhaps someday they will discover tools, teachings, practices, that will enable them to pause before reacting, to see the situation without attachment and to accept the other driver for who that person is right now. And perhaps some people will find that love isn't just attachment, but is fully and selflessly accepting someone for who they are right now. And that we can fully accept everyone for who they are right now; that we can love one another; that we can have compassion for all beings. The very fact that we are where we are right now, sitting in front of our computer monitors, on this little planet, zooming around this particular star, in this section of this one particular arm in this particular spiral galaxy, itself hurtling through the universe with countless other galaxies, .. is pretty amazing. This one moment right now, is simply amazing. | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 120 Registered: 6-2007 |
Thanks John. I believe, Love could not exist, if we lived forever. I say this beacuse our understanding of time and how precious life's definite directions are guided, focus our attentions in sharing time with others and taking nothing for granted (For those people, that do..., are not ready for this reality). Time is more valuable than anyone really realizes; and in some cases "even want to know". As with things, people, and places there's no guilt in wanting substance, and true love. | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 77 Registered: 11-2007 |
Love and fulfillment are the things that we spend so much of our lifetimes searching for, We should never feel guilty about enjoying fulfillment when we are lucky enough to find it because it often doesnt last for too long! As Joe Zawinul (rip) said "Man, its all part of the picture. Good and bad. You have to experience it all. Without bad we cannot appreciate good. Without bad there is no good!" And that from a man who at the age of 11 had to pull his neighbours body parts out of rubble and eat rats to survive during WW2! | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 121 Registered: 6-2007 |
Josef Zawinul died? Ah man...NO YOU ARE KIDDING ME!!! Wait a minute... (I got to look that up!!!!).... ................................................ He died this year 9/11/07 What a wonderful person and a wondeful life. May Peace Be Upon Him and his family. | ||
| edwin
Advanced Member Username: edwin Post Number: 247 Registered: 5-2002 |
hendixclarke, I had the same reaction when I first heard the Dixie Dregs. I had heard Alembic basses in person first at Grateful Dead shows in the 70s, but in 1980, when I was going to UC Santa Cruz, the Dixie Dregs played at the Coconut Ballroom and Andy West was just amazing. Very clear punchy sound. Shortly after, he went to a Steinberger and when I moved back to Boston, his Alembic was for sale for quite some time at Cambridge Music Center. I played it a bunch in the store, but it didn't really talk to me. It was a medium scale, btw. I finally got my Series I for $750 in 1995. It spoke to me! Edwin | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 122 Registered: 6-2007 |
$750!!!! DAAAAMMMM! That price alone, I wouldn't care if the thing needed "new pickups, tuning machines, volume controls, or even new frets" what a steal! | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 370 Registered: 11-2004 |
Whitecloud - I guess you saw that documentary on Joe which was on BBC3 a couple of years ago..when I found out Joe had died it had the same effect on me when my dad died..I felt a total loss upon me. So much talent gone but what a wonderful legacy he left for us all to enjoy. | ||
| pas
Intermediate Member Username: pas Post Number: 105 Registered: 3-2003 |
Zawinul's passing left me with a very empty feeling. What a composer & innovator. I was was fortunate to see him several times at Blues Alley in DC, including his last stop there - a 4 night stand - in late '06. "A Remark You Made" is one of my all time favorite pieces... | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5742 Registered: 5-2002 |
John: "Love and fulfillment are the things that we spend so much of our lifetimes searching for" In my view, they are right here available to each of us in the present moment at any time; there is nothing to search for. "We should never feel guilty" In my view, I agree. Guilting ourselves or others is not compassion. Compassion is fully accepting ourselves and others for who we are right now. In my view: "Fulfillment", to use your term, is all around us all of the time; there is nothing to search for. It's not something that we have to spend money for or plan for or worry about getting. It's right here right now. When we quiet the mind, when we allow the chatter that's constantly going on inside our minds to cease, when we can be still and present right now, then we can fully experience the world around us. In my view, being "lucky enough to find it" has nothing to do with it. It's right here, right now. Go outside; if it's cold, put your coat on. Sit down on the porch and just breath. Don't think about anything, just breath. Be with the trees, the cool air, the warmth of the sun, the stars, the moon, the Earth. Be with your breath. Just be present right now. There's nothing to think about, or plan for, or worry about, or regret, or to be upset about. The immense beauty found in everything is always here, if we can just be present right now instead of always thinking about something else, of being somewhere else, of being somehow different. When we are always caught up in these stories we tell ourselves, this endless chatter that our minds are constantly making up, we miss what's happening right now. As the air that fills and joins our lungs constantly demonstrates, we are not separate from the world around us. And at any time during the day, we can experience that "fulfillment" of being fully present, even with something as simple as washing dishes or sweeping the porch. But again, that's just my view. Others will have different views. | ||
| rockbassist
Intermediate Member Username: rockbassist Post Number: 117 Registered: 8-2005 |
Personally, I can't stand solos unless they are a key part of the song, such as the bass solo in My Generation or a guitar "solo" in most rock songs. If it's a situation where a musician is doing some long drawn out solo such as at many rock concerts, it doesn't matter if it's bass, drums, guitar or who is playing them, I find them boring. I hate listening to them and can only tolerate them for 20 or 30 seconds. In my opinion, the only reason for doing a solo is for self indulgence on the part of the musician. | ||
| danny_bryant
Junior Username: danny_bryant Post Number: 20 Registered: 9-2007 |
This is a great subject to comment on. I myself get asked to play solos all the time. I will usually do one in between songs to make the crowd happy but sometimes we will all go around and do one in a song. Usually everyone takes on for abot 20 seconds and its over. | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 80 Registered: 11-2007 |
I was totally gutted when I heard of the death of Joe Zawinul, he was an incredible composer. His music touched me very deeply and I guess thats the best compliment I can pay him! Interestingly enough, JZ never felt obliged to take many solos despite incredible chops. I suppose he had the luxry of mostly sitting back and letting his incredible sidemen grab the solos. That shows great maturity as a musician and as a person, it showed his lack of any musical insecuritys! | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 123 Registered: 6-2007 |
I love all solos (good, bad and ugly). I get hyped playing them, and its a time when others in the band break out and start "stretchin". Some songs were completely designed for the a solo and I love them. I think of the Funkadelics with the song "Knee deep" in how Michael Hampton smoothly merges into a groove then BAM!! he's moves our listening attention to his solo. If you're in to Funk, that song is a great example of moving from a funk groove, into a metal rock drive! George Clinton was a master here. Frank Zappa (RIP) has done this so damn well too with his members. Solo's are very important to me and will always be... | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 376 Registered: 11-2004 |
I agree with hendixclarke..solos are good, they stretch you musically, all music types has solos, no more so than classical where they were written by composers who didn't play the solo instrument but wrote them so the musician could interpret and perform them to the best of their ability. If it wasn't for solos then every song would be another boring pop/muzak song which graces the charts. Rockbassist - are you in a band? and if so your guitarist must do a solo at some point?? And of course it's self indulgence, why not, we all earn it at some point..bring 'em on!!!!!!!! | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 81 Registered: 11-2007 |
I love all kinds of bass players, but it was the innovative solo players that really turned me on! Guys like Jeff Berlin, Percy Jones, Stanley Clarke, Jaco, Jonas Hellborg, John Entwhistle, Ralphe Armstrong etc blew me away in the good old days when I was starting out! These guys stretched the limits at a time when the true role of the bass was only just starting to become realised... So, YES YES YES I love solos too | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 124 Registered: 6-2007 |
Percy Jones, sends chills down my back... This guy is so under-rated, it makes me sick. | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 83 Registered: 11-2007 |
Percy jones is second only to Jaco as a fretless player in my mind! The guy is so unique. I adore his Brand X material...check out his playing on "the ghost of mayfield lodge" on the "Masques" album..WOW! | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 381 Registered: 11-2004 |
Percy Jones missed my list..maybe I should check him out..any track/album suggestions from you guys?? All suggestions very welcome | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 125 Registered: 6-2007 |
Percy Jones, is my favorite fretless bass player of all time. Percy Jones bottom grooves, are smaller tight solos, while keeping in time with the drums. He add so much color to where; you can hear him far in a distance (like a train coming from miles away...) then BAM, he stop and the band goes into a totally different direction on his lead. Jaco never did this kind of stuff. His music was pretty easy to follow, yet he (Jaco) was the melodic King. I love Jaco's riffs with Joni Mitchell so much, it makes my heart skip just thinking about some of his works he did with Joni. It's like looking down a sunset of a beautiful lake and small ripples of water in the shadows. Just heavenly... But if I had to choose between styles (this would be very hard, because I love both signature styles), but Percy is tighter when it comes to the fretless bass. His band is called "Brand X" Phil Collins even kicks some mean skins on some of the older albums. | ||
| keith_h
Senior Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 913 Registered: 2-2005 |
Terry, For a good example of Percy Jones listen to any of the early Brand X albums. Brand X is still one of my favorite bands. Keith | ||
| hendixclarke
Intermediate Member Username: hendixclarke Post Number: 126 Registered: 6-2007 |
Check out percy jones on youtube. They finally got music on the guy. | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 382 Registered: 11-2004 |
Now I know who you mean, you know sometimes you miss someone that you have heard all the time, yes an incredible technician and subtley different from Jaco | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 84 Registered: 11-2007 |
Hey Terry, I cant believe you havent heard of Percy..he's a proud welshman from the valleys of north Wales!! His unique style totally shocked and impressed me back in the day. I strongly recomend the album entitled "masques." It features the excellent John Godsall on guitar and Kenwood Dennard on drums!! The opening track "the poke" is magnificent, and the rest of the songlist just gets better and better. Awsome bass playing, some of the best fretless ever layed down in my opinion. British fusion at its very best! Another good recomendation on a slightly differnt note is this: Check out the track "struggle of the turtle to the sea pt3" on the Jean luc ponty album "enigmatic ocean." It features Ralphe Armstrong playing a totally blistering bass line and fantastic solo! Amazing stuff! (Message edited by white cloud on December 05, 2007) | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 383 Registered: 11-2004 |
Well I know another great welsh bass player..Lawrence Cottell..another master of the fretless I will endeavour to bring myself up to speed on Percy.. My main influences were Stan, Jaco and Mark King | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 87 Registered: 11-2007 |
I have heard of Lawrence cottell for many years, but havent actually heard much of his playing Terry! Any recomendations on Lawrence's work? | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 1502 Registered: 10-2002 |
This thread seems to be going in about three different directions so... terry and John.. lawrence performed at Bass day and also took the time to chat. I really enjoyed his set; his playing was superb (although on a fretted yamaha) and fitted in perfectly with his band. His Solos were very tasteful.  You can download a couple of his albums free from his website and for later Percy jones, check out his 'Tunnels' album. It's very good. Another fretless player in the same vein is John Giblin who also played in Brand X (check out Wal to Wal on Product) and has appeared on just about every Kate Bush album. Dave. I know exactly where you're coming from. I love to get into the hills by myself and just appreciate 'being'. Hal. The music my band plays doesn't really lend itself to bass soloing. I get a couple of chances to shine during the set but I don't really think our audiences expect it just as I doubt if any of them know anything about Alembic. (unless John makes it to Glasgow this wednesday). My main reason for taking up the bass was seeing Yes in 1974. Chris Squire managed to make the bass sound very interesting while still serving the music. Granted he did take a solo spot with 'The Fish' but that was really just the icing o the cake for me. Graeme | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 88 Registered: 11-2007 |
Yes Graeme, you will at least have two Alembic fans in the audience on Wednesday at Glasgow( my wife and I) I dont really care if there are bass solos or not, I get as much satisfaction from just hearing simple lines well played with a tasteful sounding bass tone to be honest! I was also a big Yes fan, I loved Chris squires tone so much that I had two Ricky 4001's at one time. I was at the "magnification" tour at the SECC a while back and loved every minute..im willing to guess that you were there too? Im personally not a big fan of plectrum bassists, but I guess CS and mr Entwhistle where my exceptions to that rule! Im also a big KT Bush fan and love the vibe that John Giblin brings to her recordings..and oh yeah, hes a Scot isnt he? | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 1504 Registered: 10-2002 |
Yep, John's from lanarkshire. I too was at the magnification gig. I moved to Scotland in '98 and have been to every tour that's visited since then - the first, in march/ april 1998, I went to the Glasgow show the day I moved up, then the playhouse in April which was a bonus date. Unfortunately, the home I was leaving in worcester was burgled the same night so I had to tear down the M74 straight after the gig:-( A shame as I hear Chris and Alan White hung out with fans for quite some time (in a pub too!!). graeme | ||
| white_cloud
Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 90 Registered: 11-2007 |
You know, why the hell do I always miss out on these type of incidents??? The only people I ever end up sitting in pubs with are old guys smoking pipes and playing dominoes..no rock stars for me |
