| Author | Message | ||
| pietzouille
Junior Username: pietzouille Post Number: 11 Registered: 8-2007 |
Hey all, I'm having bad things with my orion.. The other day i was at a small session, and a guy asked me "nice, but where's ur fender jazz??" or another time... "nice and shiny bass but nothing compared to a FJ" So i'm asking, I'm BEGGINg, what to do agains that??? just say "F....K YOU" did anything like that happened to any of u guys??? or sometimes it's "ooor what's that?? olympic??" "yeah right..." In my opinion, fender are just shit most of the time.. and good ones are way too expensive to me.. when i ssee that a factory instrument can cost 8000 us dollar i saw a fender jazz 64 which cost that price.. it's just making me sick.. alembic.. are expensive.. but each one is a work of art... anyway, any opinions?? how to deal with ignorant sound guys?? cheers | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 2826 Registered: 7-2004 |
Pierre: Kind of like showing up in a Ferrari and someone who doesn't know anything about Ferrari's looks at it and says "not bad, but you could have saved up a little more money and bought a Mustang". Here's a link to some past discussion of this issue that you may enjoy. Bill, the guitar one | ||
| jbybj
Intermediate Member Username: jbybj Post Number: 128 Registered: 6-2006 |
Just politely point out how unflattering it is for them to display their ignorance so boldly. Say it with a smile, plug in, turn up, and offer them a Q-tip. JBY | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 167 Registered: 11-2007 |
Hey man, when Im faced with this type of thing I sit down, cross my legs, repeat "OM" over and over until I enter a meditative state and rise above the uneducated minds that confont me! As the Dalai Lama correctly states "Fools that dont know Alembics dont know S**T" Wait a minute, was it the Dalai Lama that said that or was it Mike Tyson?? I just cant remember! | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1058 Registered: 6-2002 |
Sometimes, you just have to leave people to their own views. There are many reasons people would say that. These range from jealousy, ignorance, the fact that alembics are not cheap and probably out of their price range... , many think they are over priced for what they are,,,, and the list goes on really. For me, the point is this, i'm sure you, like me and many other alembic owners, didn't buy the bass for everyone else to bow down and worship it. Neither did we buy it because we wanted it to sound like a fender bass. It's a high quality musical instrument that serves a purpose in a way that we like. I think like many you bought it so that you could enjoy it and have the sound that you want from it. You don't buy an alembic expecting it to sound like a fender bass nor vice versa. Play your bass, dare to be different, enjoy it and leave them to their own minds. Just my few pennies worth. Jazzyvee ps: I've never owned a fender bass and have only played one once or twice in myl ife. I don't dislike their sound, I just prefer a different sound hence why I got an alembic. | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 170 Registered: 11-2007 |
Fenders are basically good, reliable and basic basses..especially the jazz. I have had a few of them throughout the years. What must be remembered though is that for every handmade Alembic that leaves the mothership a thousand fenders roll of the factory production line. That says it all for me! | ||
| richbass939
Senior Member Username: richbass939 Post Number: 910 Registered: 11-2004 |
Jazzy, like you, I have never owned a Fender and have played one only a few times. I can appreciate that much of the first couple of decades of rock, blues, jazz, R&B, etc. was recorded on Fenders. I just have never really connected with them. I'm not putting them down but there has never been an attraction to them. I suppose it's the same way with some people and Alembic. If there isn't an attraction then don't go for it. Instruments are a lot like cars. The Ford Model T got the job done. After a while some innovative people started to improve on the basic idea. If some people thought the newer ideas were all fluff and the Model T was still the best out there, then they bought the Fords and were happy with them. If they criticized the better ideas then that was their opinion. I have yet to have someone tell me they want a Fender on their gig/project. I just show up and plug in. Sometimes they ask what it is. They almost never ask what it costs and I never mention it. Most have never heard of Alembic so they don't know that they are pricy. However, noone has ever said "I don't like the sound. Do you have something else we could use?" Rich | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 686 Registered: 3-2004 |
I agree with the jealousy,ignorance combo. I have mine because I wanted them. If I had to sacrifice a bit, then I did. Does it make sense to own 16 of them plus others, no. But thats what I chose to do. I still get slagged because folks can't really make fun of me about other things. So the bass becomes the focal point. Some of it is the speck of dust-plank in the eye thing. The sweet part is when a soundman or engineer says what an amazing sound I get and how well I perform in front of the other guys. So, don't let it bother you, just plug in and play and let the sound educate the great unwashed. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5936 Registered: 5-2002 |
I can cook dinner for myself, but I'm not a master chef. I have neither the skills nor tools of a master chef. For instance I don't know anything about cutlery (there's actually an in-depth discussion of cutlery in a previous thread). And it's ok that I don't know everything there is to know about cooking and cutlery. It's also ok that some people don't know about Alembics. And I'm sure you've noticed that some people develop biases and allegiances about all kinds of things; cars, sports teams. And I'm sure you've noticed that some people desire to possess something because other people they know or admire have or value that thing. Each of us grows up in very unique circumstances; the events that shape the way we perceive the world are unique for each of us. If you meet someone who only likes Fender basses, well then that's where he is right now given all of the events in his life that preceded this moment. And you might meet people that are closed minded, not only about basses, but about a lot of things in life. Each of us is a human being, each of has lived a life that, up to this very moment in time, has seen its share of suffering. Each of us is deserving of respect and compassion. So, when someone tells you that your bass is nothing compared to a Fender, have compassion for him. You don't know how it is to live his life; you don't know the experiences he has lived through. You don't know the combination of things that lead to him having this belief about this particular aspect of the world we live in. Responding to hostility with hostility tends to escalate the hostility. Responding to hostility with warmth, respect and compassion tends to defuse a hostile situation. When he describes his Fender, listen with interest and respect. And there is no need to boast of the qualities of your Alembic. Chances are you've earned his respect just by listening; and the next time he runs across an Alembic, maybe that respect will give him pause to listen; and learn. | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1060 Registered: 6-2002 |
I like your replay Davehouk, but don't you think us alembic diehards are also closed minded to a degree about our basses? I admit to being that way about basses but not so to the same degree with my guitars. I personally have loved Alembic bass sounds sound way back to hearing clarkee on one in the 70's and for me everything I owned up until I got my first Alembic was considered temporary. Now I can't see me getting any other bass. I'd like to try one of the high end Fodera's and a Ritter's but I doubt very much I'd buy one. Life is too short to spend time getting to know another bass hahahaha. Thanks for making me nod in agreement and smile with your thread. On a more direct response to your thread pietzouille, I've had many compliments about the sound of my alembics, especially my Orion guitar since i had taken it on tour with me for most of 2006. But interestingly no-one had ever realised it was alembic till I told them. They just knew it sounded great and didn't sound like a Fender or a Gibson. JAzzyvee | ||
| briant
Junior Username: briant Post Number: 39 Registered: 12-2004 |
Nice response, Dave. Well said. I'll contribute that I find some people listen with their eyes more than their ears. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5956 Registered: 5-2002 |
Thanks guys. Jazzyvee asked: don't you think us alembic diehards are also closed minded to a degree about our basses? I can't speak for others in our group; but for myself, I think it's a great question. And I've been sitting here for a while thinking about it. There are a lot of great bass players who don't play Alembics and whose tone I like. Last night I was watching a YouTube vid of Michael Manring with Andy McKee and Don Ross (very very nice tune); and I like Manring's tone in this video. My Essence completely changed my approach to playing bass and my S1 completely changed it again. And as you said, life is too short. And for me, part of the meaning for me at this point in my life of playing an Alembic is the association it has with being a part of this community. I now personally know a lot of really nice people all over the world who play Alembics. And I even know some of the people who build them; and they're some pretty nice people too. And just as my Alembic basses have been a significant influence in my life, so also have I learned a lot from, and been influenced by, this community. My bass is a wonderful musical instrument and a beautiful piece of craftsmanship. But not all potters use the same wheel, and not all carpenters use the same hammer. And it doesn't bother me at all that Marcus Miller plays a Fender; I still love listening to him. I am constantly amazed at how beautiful my S1 sounds. And recently I've been playing my Essence 6 a lot unplugged; wonderful tone. I think Alembics are absolutely wonderful instruments and I have absolutely no desire to play anything else. Again, as you said, life is too short. But that's where I am at this point in my life given all the experiences that I've had up to the present moment. Life on this planet is just so amazing. (Message edited by davehouck on January 06, 2008) | ||
| edwin
Advanced Member Username: edwin Post Number: 270 Registered: 5-2002 |
I think engineers want you to play a Fender because they know what to do with it. After recording a couple dozen of them, they know how they sit in the mix. That, of course, leads to a lot of bass parts sounding the same. It can be a great sound, but if you are after something different, some engineers get nervous about having to step out of their comfort zone. Having never really owned a Fender, I've never been able to satisfy an engineer who wanted to hear that sound, but on the other hand, I've never had an engineer who asked me that after hearing what I was playing. These days, the bass engineers and other players want to hear is my Starfire, but that may change once I get my Series I back! Edwin | ||
| darkstar01
Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 97 Registered: 6-2005 |
Personally, although I haven't had an alembic in quite some time now, I don't find them terribly appropriate for the band i'm in now. The reason being, the majority of the time I'm playing my early 80s PBass, I'm beating the living crap out of it, literally. Wire brushes, the occaision Dremel tool, these are not things I would put my Alembics through, and I think most would agree. Just an opinion. Austin | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 177 Registered: 11-2007 |
I think its very much a case of horses for courses! There are so many fine basses out there now, and most do a very good job...but at the same time so many sound predictable and, ultimately, alike! Alembics dont just have a sound all of their own...they have an aura unmatched by any other instrument! For whatever reason a lot of folks just dont get that, but for us, and Im sure that I speak for us all here, there can be no other choice! P.S. Michael Manring has a lovely tone for sure, but is it just me or is he spookily morphing into Geddy Lee??? (Message edited by white cloud on January 07, 2008) | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1061 Registered: 6-2002 |
White cloud, I agree, there are so many basses around and seem to be chasing the fender slot in the audio spectrum so they are trying to sound like a fender but outdo the fender sound and become Super Fender-man.... :-) Choosing a fender bass sound, as nice as it is, especially in Marcus's hands, is really a no brainer. One of the reasons I went for alembic was it sounded different and it was a sound I'd come to love and a voice I wanted to be able to use. At this point in my life there really isn't another choice. | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1062 Registered: 6-2002 |
White cloud, I agree, there are so many basses around and they all seem to be chasing the fender slot in the audio spectrum. They are trying to sound like a fender but outdo the fender sound and become Super Fender.... :-) Choosing a fender bass sound, as nice as it is, especially in Marcus's hands, is really a no brainer it's hard to go wrong with getting a useable sound. For me thought, one of the reasons I went for alembic was it dared to be different and it was a sound I'd come to love and a voice I wanted to be able to use. It's a bit like falling in love with a girl at school but thinking she was out of your league so admiring her from afar. Feeling your heart flutter whenever you heard the sound of her voice, then getting together later in life, realising you both make a great couple and spending the rest of your days together making wonderful sex... sorry i mean wonderful music together... hahaha All the best Jazzyvee | ||
| keavin
Senior Member Username: keavin Post Number: 1325 Registered: 12-2002 |
Jazzyvee .............Dude playing an alembic IS Electric sex!!! | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1063 Registered: 6-2002 |
Woah, Keavin are you telling me every time I get on stage with an alembic, I'm committing a lewd act in a public place???? hahaha Jazzyvee | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1265 Registered: 9-2002 |
I've always marveled that whether in the days of the Summer of Love all the way to now, that all of those 'too-cool-for-school' musicians insist on playing the SAME damn instruments that have been around since the 50's. Even though we've progressed from tape to hard disk, transformers to toroids, film to digital, there's still so many guys that all they want is a wiggle stick that won't go out of tune and the perfect tube amp. Wow . . . where's my 8-track of 'Pet Sounds'? In some ways, it's the same mindset for studios and engineers who should just know better than anyone: Considering the huge jump in recording technology in the last 10 years, EVERYTHING has changed. Here in Nashville, you can buy 2" Studers and SSL boards in the Shopper's Guide, they're worth whatever they weigh at the metal recyclers. Yet they still peer over their 'control surface' through the glass, and ask 'where's the Fender'? I guess I could ask 'where's the EchoPlex, and how come you don't have those big monitors built into the walls?' I've always believed that hi-fi is better than lo- or no-fi. I've never understood why instruments should NOT improve at the same relentless pace as PA or recording gear. I always heard in my head more than a Jazz through an SVT. So you just take your Series, hook it up through that idiot Pod, and make it SOUND like a PBass! Gee, I knew there's a silver lining to this digital s**t! J o e y | ||
| darkstar01
Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 98 Registered: 6-2005 |
you know what makes my Fender not sound like every other one out there? me. enough said. Austin | ||
| terryc
Senior Member Username: terryc Post Number: 406 Registered: 11-2004 |
happy new year everyone! Well I don't care what people say, it is my bass, whether it looks like an expensive coffee table or not, it plays like a dream, sounds superb and looks fantastic. All you fender owners can keep your fenders I have no intention whatsover in the future to buy any other bass unless I had the dosh to buy another Alembic | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 189 Registered: 11-2007 |
Well said Terry! Owning an Alembic is proving addictive for me..Im saving for another! It might take years but I dont care  | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1064 Registered: 6-2002 |
It's proved addictive to me too, I had my first one in 2002 and I'm saving for a custom series instrument to bring in my 50th birthday. jazzyvee | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 1570 Registered: 10-2002 |
My balance K was supposed to be a 50th birthday present but family events made mrs j more aware of our mortality and told me to get it while I could still get the enjoyment. I'm now thinking I have about 3 1/2 years to save for the real pressy ;-) Hopefully she'll have forgotten all about the MK by then. Hah! not likely ;-( Graeme | ||
| terryc
Senior Member Username: terryc Post Number: 408 Registered: 11-2004 |
Just a thought when I re read the thread...do you really think that Marcus's bass sounds like a fender J...it sounds nothing like it at all..it could have been an Alembic, Tobias, Fodera, Vigier, JD, Smith, Sei(and the list goes on) certainly not like a fender at all. It may have the logo, the neck and the body but the electronics..Mr Sadowsky thank you Damn good sound too especially in his gifted hands!! | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 1571 Registered: 10-2002 |
Don't forget Terry, he also has the biggest range of pedals I've ever seen on a bassist and he's playing through the most sophisticated amp setup on the planet. When I saw him in November, it didn't sound like any Fender I've ever heard. Graeme | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 190 Registered: 11-2007 |
I agree, MM has a wonderful sound! I really do think however that there is another factor here as well..the Fender custom shop! Jazzers like MM's certainly dont roll off the factory production line. Im quite sure that the MM signature model LOOKS the same, but I would expect a world of a difference between those Japanese models and the one that MM wields so well! | ||
| neurotictim
New Username: neurotictim Post Number: 3 Registered: 1-2008 |
I dunno, I suppose for me it's just the variety of sound... We all get G.A.S. and have several basses to satisfy those various sounds we've got in our head. Fenders and Corts (I looove my Curbow 6) and fretless, it's all in the ear of the beholder. For some situations, I would put down the Epic and pick up my Cort, or my Fender Precision... As versatile as it is, it's got it's own voice, and sometimes that's just not what I'm looking for. I brought my Epic to practice Thursday night for the first time, and the guys were all like, "Nice lookin' bass..." Didn't even notice the difference in the quality of the sound. When pressed to see if they could notice the difference, all I got was, "I can hear the strings now." That being said, I think this Epic is a perfect fit for the modern-rock sound we've got going on, and it cut through the mix so much better than my Cort I was half in a daze throughout practice... I could really hear what I was doing, as opposed to feeling it. | ||
| white_cloud
Intermediate Member Username: white_cloud Post Number: 194 Registered: 11-2007 |
Funnily enough I just sold my fender Jazz today to a lovely young woman who wants to learn bass! Its just me and my Alembic now. The money goes straight into my "get another Alembic" fund! | ||
| keith_h
Senior Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 941 Registered: 2-2005 |
Just to show not all non-Alembic folks are heathens. I was sitting in with some folks last night and the first thing the lead guitarist said to me after introductions was, "Is that an Alembic?". To which I replied, "Yes it is and it's nice to be playing with someone of such obvious taste and culture". LOL Keith |
