| Author | Message | ||
| musikill
Junior Username: musikill Post Number: 31 Registered: 12-2003 |
Ok, I'm showing my ignorance but hey, I don't know everything. While I adjust to my SC deluxe which I have had for exactly 1 week; and in that week have learned a lot about Alembics from this group - but I have a question. What are the diffrences between the Series I and Series II besides the obvious body styles. What are the differences in electronics if any? What does the cancellation pickup do? And finally, has anyone put Series electronics in a SC? If so what is the cost? thanks in advance for the input. greg | ||
| davehouck
Advanced Member Username: davehouck Post Number: 289 Registered: 5-2002 |
Where the Series I electronics have a three position Q switch for each pickup, the Series II electronics have a CVQ, continuously variable Q, control for each pickup. I believe another difference is that the Series II electronics add a master volume. I believe the Series II body has an extra veneer centered in the core; and the shell logo on the Series II is recessed. There may be other differences I'm not thinking of. To quote Mica, "The pickups on the Series I and II basses and guitars are single coil. They employ an electronic humcancelling circuit to reduce the hum inherent with single coil pickups". According to the quote generator, the upgrade cost for Series I electronics on an SC Deluxe is $3,500; and for Series II is $3,900. Of course that's on a new bass; I don't know what the cost would be to upgrade an existing bass. | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 837 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brother Greg ... thou aret confused!?!?!?! First of all "Series" stands for a kind of electronics, not for a design. I think most of the Alembic designs can be made with Series electronics in some cases -with the smaller bodied models- the thickness of the body has to be adapted. The difference in electronics are: Series I: PUvolume neck/bridge, PUfilter neck/bridge, PU-selector switch (out-bridge-both-neck), and 1 3 position Q switch per PU. The Q-switch has "off", +6db and +12db (if I remember well). Series II: Idem as Series I + Master volume and the Q"switch" is replaced by a rotating CVQ: Continously Variable Q from 0db to +15db. Series I and II differ in finishing. Series II can have all super-de-luxe woods with no extra cost, have 7 laminates bodies, have bookmatch to center pegheads, have goldplated hardware standard, have standard side-leds (Again: I'm not completely sure of this but if you wander around in this place you'll find answers to a lot of questions) Did one build them in SC deluxe. Well: If I'm well informed Stanley's bass has always been a Series I with the Small Standard body. Armand Sabal Lecco plays a red SSB Series II if I remember well (soem brothers in the club too). So putting them in a SC ...no problem they were born there. Of course there's the "3th PU" thing. Well ...the best that you can do is think of it as a "noise gate". A PU that blocks the hissing of the PU's. Because you may not forget that Series electronics are build around single coil PU. Other PU of Alembic are "Humcancellers" (and Mica refuses to call them humbuckers for a good reason that I'm not able to reproduce here). How it works, why it is, if it can ...you will be helped by others. I'm not a technician. How it sounds? Well ...I wrote a threat about it somewhere hidden in these mines of lowfrequenced gems. Paul the bad one | ||
| valvil
Moderator Username: valvil Post Number: 294 Registered: 7-2002 |
Hello Greg, Brother Dave & brother Paul (TBO) have pretty much covered all the bases; however I must point out that "super-de-luxe" woods, as you called them, Paul, are indeed an extra charge on Series II and Series I both. The Series II also comes with continuous wood backplates. Regarding the master volume on the Series II, that is something that can be easily added ( and has been many times) to a Series I. Valentino | ||
| the_schwartz
Junior Username: the_schwartz Post Number: 34 Registered: 1-2003 |
Now I'm curious about the unfit-to-print "humbuckers" reason cited in brother Paul's (TBO) post above :-) | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 1360 Registered: 6-2000 |
The Series I and II are very closely related electronically. The only differences have already been pointed out by our good Clubbies, but they boil down to: Series I volume x2 filter x2 3-position Q switch x2 4-position rotary pickup selector switch Series II same as above but replace the Q switches with CVQ adds a master volume The pickups are single coil in a Series I/II system and require the dummy humcancelling pickup to eliminate the hum that plagues the single coil design. It doesn't "pickup" anything, it's more like an eraser. It's almost impossible to add Series I/II electronics after the fact unless the bass was made with that in mind because we make the instruments as thin as possible to keep the weight down. A Signature is 1.55 inches thick, the Series needs at least 1.65 to fit. Superfilters fit in a rack though, and it's about as close as you can get, especially if you swap out the regular AXY pickups for FatBoys (which are AXYs wound on to Series I/II magnets). Oh, about the humcancelling/humbucking deal, humbuckers have two coils each wrapped around a magnetic core in an opposite direction and the magnetic domains flip or "buck". Our humcancelling pickups have only one magnet (more like a single coil on the top with a humcanceller coil on the bottom). So to call them humbuckers is incorrect. | ||
| musikill
Junior Username: musikill Post Number: 32 Registered: 12-2003 |
Thanks Mica, 2 quick questions: 1. What would be the difference (or what would be gained by swapping the AXY pickups for the Fatboys? Would anything be lost? 2. Is the SF-2 also a preamp? Or is it strictly line level signal processor? Thanks, greg | ||
| bob
Member Username: bob Post Number: 99 Registered: 11-2002 |
Greg, I can take a stab at these, starting with the easy one: Yes, the SF-2 can be used as a preamp, depending on how you hook it up. If you plug the instrument into the front panel jack (and don't put anything in the Channel A line level input on the back), it functions as a preamp. You get a choice of 0, 10, or 20 dB gain, configured by an internal jumper. I use mine this way (don't own a preamp), and I think there are a few others here doing the same. You might take another look at the description on the Products page, it's fairly complete. Here are the basics on the pickup options. The Series pickups are single coil; everything else is humcancelling. There are some differences in tone resulting from these two different design approaches, but I can't properly describe them and the single coils aren't an option for you anyway. An AXY is electrically and tonally identical to an MXY. The only difference is that the AXY is in a larger plastic housing; the guts are identical (at some point in history, they shrunk the housing as much as possible to create the MXY look). A FatBoy uses the same housing as an AXY (you can't tell by looking at them, at least from the top), and is the same humcancelling design and (probably?) the same number of windings as an AXY/MXY - except that it is wound on a magnet which is larger, along the direction of the strings. This results in a wider aperture, meaning that the pickup is listening to a longer section of the string, roughly twice as much. This means that you should get a somwhat more complete, or complex tone, and (I think) it should also help to reduce the tonal variations as you move up and down the fingerboard. They are also louder. I suppose you could turn that around, and say that switching from AXYs to FatBoys might cause you to "lose" a slightly more quirky tone from the narrow apertures, but I have a difficult time thinking of that as a loss. A few people who have tried both have commented that the FatBoys "growl" a bit more, or may overload or distort too easily (I think that may simply be a matter of taste/perception). I currently have mine almost as far as possible from the strings, and find that gives me a really nice clear tone. But they also sound good closer, and if you end up not using a preamp, you might find you can get a hint of something similar to tube overdrive by keeping them closer to the strings, if that's what you want. Personally, I don't think you can go wrong with FatBoys. You get the wider aperature of the Series pickups (which is certainly a factor in tonal differences), although you still won't have the single coil design (probably a bigger factor). However, I must point out that I haven't had the opporunity to make direct comparisons myself. So if you decide to switch, maybe I could borrow one of your old AXYs for a short while... -Bob | ||
| dnburgess
Intermediate Member Username: dnburgess Post Number: 171 Registered: 1-2003 |
I have been using the SF2 as a stereo preamp while waiting for an F2B. Feeding it a reasonably hot stereo signal from my TC Electronics SCF (thanks, Stoney, for the reccomendation), the direct (input) level controls provide all the level control that I need. With a lower level signal you could set the filters to high pass, wind the filter frequency right down and use the (up to 20dB?) boost of the filters for extra gain. | ||
| kungfusheriff
Junior Username: kungfusheriff Post Number: 31 Registered: 8-2003 |
Mica-- Could Series electronics be fit into an SC by using a convex back plate? One-tenth on an inch doesn't seem all that unwieldy... | ||
| adriaan
Intermediate Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 101 Registered: 6-2002 |
There's a groove on the inside of the backplate on my Spoiler to accommodate the circuit board, but I don't think the groove is 0.1" deep (2.5 millimeters?) - the backplate isn't even that thick! | ||
| musikill
Junior Username: musikill Post Number: 37 Registered: 12-2003 |
Thanks to all for the info and to Bob for the pu details. If I decide to go the Fatboy route I will loan you one of my pu's - loan, because I might prefer the tighter pickup range of the AXY and I do like the fact that I can get the AXY pu very close to the strings and the sound remains very clean. But I think I will try the Fatboy just to see how it sounds. I used to have a F2B preamp - one of the early ones in the blue chassis and blk/red knobs. I bought it in 1976 new for $350 from Guitar Center in San Diego. My how prices have gone up - but that is true for everything. It just makes me mad that I let it go years ago. |
