| Author | Message | ||
| musikill
Junior Username: musikill Post Number: 46 Registered: 12-2003 |
I have been using an Ashley SC-50 limiter/compressor for 20 years and it has finally started to fail. I have not paid any attention to new compressors since I didn't need one, but now faced with replacing the SC-50, I have been overwhelmed with the number of brands and configurations available. I don't need a 25 knob stereo with reverse flow plumbing and optional auto-pilot/indoor grill. But I want a single channel rack mount unit. I would really appreciate any suggestions you might have to offer. Thanks, greg | ||
| lindoom
New Username: lindoom Post Number: 3 Registered: 1-2004 |
the DBX 163 over easy compressor is very simple very small and inexpensive | ||
| essencetimestwo
Junior Username: essencetimestwo Post Number: 33 Registered: 8-2003 |
I think it is called an Emperical Labs Distressor. Somebody out there can correct me if I am wrong. It is the one with the big white knobs on it. Magical! I wish I could afford one. Marcus Miller has one in his setup. Way cool. Check it out | ||
| essenceman
New Username: essenceman Post Number: 10 Registered: 10-2002 |
I use an Alesis Nanocompressor. It's only 1/3 rack size, but it does the job and it doesn't cost the earth! Here's the link: http://www.alesis.com/products/nanocompressor/index.html | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1078 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brother Rob. I'll try to load the Alesis picture as an example. No ...not to show off me loading pictures but just as a didactic help for you all to explain me what in fact a "compressor" is doing. Well ..I KNOW he is lifting dips and cutting peaks but ...that related to the knobs here. Can you clear this out for me please? Paul the bad one  | ||
| adriaan
Intermediate Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 129 Registered: 6-2002 |
Brother Paul TBO, I'm no expert, and I don't know the Alesis, but I think in ordinary language it goes a little like this: Threshold translates as "drempel": it is the minimum level for the output signal. If the signal starts out above that level then the compressor won't bite at the start of the signal, else it amplifies the signal to the threshold level. As you turn this up, you should start noticing the compression more and more. Ratio is how flat you want the output signal to be, like the dynamic range you want to allow in the output signal. Turn this up to get a less natural sound, or when you get tired ;-) Attack sets the time it takes to reach the peak level. As you turn it up, your notes will sound increasingly lazy. Release (I may be entirely wrong here, but okay ...) sets the time it takes before the unprocessed signal takes over from the processed signal. Hard/Soft sets the compressor's manners (aggressive or civilized). Peak/RMS sets what you're seeing on the LEDs on the left: RMS shows the average signal strength, Peak will show (surprise, surprise) the signal peaks. Input/Output is for the LEDs on the right, which kind of show the amount of compression in the output signal or the dynamics of the input signal (I guess). (Message edited by Adriaan on February 24, 2004) | ||
| effclef
Junior Username: effclef Post Number: 31 Registered: 1-2004 |
Here you go, Essencetimestwo: http://www.empiricallabs.com/ EffClef | ||
| davehouck
Advanced Member Username: davehouck Post Number: 392 Registered: 5-2002 |
Paul; I thought about it for awhile and decided I couldn't explain it. So I went looking and found this excellent article which increased my understanding of what the compressor is doing: http://www.harmony-central.com/Effects/Articles/Compression/ | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1080 Registered: 9-2002 |
Well ...printing time again I guess. Brothers and sisters ...I have No -abosultely zip/nada/niente/nul- technical background so I am afraid this article will be close to japanese for me. I suggest I read it first than -als hij dat goedvind- I'll do a mail to Brother Adriaan or Brother Edwin to translate the lingo in just plain understandable flemish. Iedereen akkoord??? Hurrah!! I REALLY like this club. Watch me when I'll be grown I'll be a real bass-player LOL!!!!!! Paul the bad one | ||
| davehouck
Advanced Member Username: davehouck Post Number: 393 Registered: 5-2002 |
Paul; Some guitar and bass players use compressors as an effect, i.e. by turning up the ratio and the release they can get an interesting "sqeezed" and "sustained" sound. If you like a clean natural tone, this is probably not what you want to do. I suppose this is useful for "heavy metal" playing; I don't know, I'm just guessing; I don't play that style. I use a variety of right hand techniques, from barely touching the strings to heavy thumb attacks and finger plucks, which results in a wide dynamic range. For me, the compressor is useful in controlling that wide range for both the protection of my speakers and for sending a useful signal to the PA. If your right hand technique is fairly consistent dynamically you may not need a compressor for this purpose. A lot of players don't like compressors, and don't like preamps with built-in compressors, because they feel that the compressor only takes away from the natural tone of their instruments. And I think they have a very good point. The way my compressor is set up it only really takes effect when I'm attacking the strings aggressively. When I'm playing a "normal" finger style, the compressor doesn't do much. But if I suddenly pop my thumb hard on an open E, the compressor's gain reduction comes into play. I like the clean natural tone that my Alembics and F-1X give me; and I don't think the compressor does anything to enhance that tone. I certainly understand why some players do not use a compressor. I just feel that with my playing style it's a good idea to have a compressor controlling the dynamic range. | ||
| essenceman
Junior Username: essenceman Post Number: 11 Registered: 10-2002 |
Hi Paul, As you asked me to try to explain how compressors work, it only seems fair that I give it a go. The Alesis Nanocompressor handbook is really helpful here – it has suggested settings for different uses, even bass! Adriaan is pretty close in his post – THRESHOLD sets the level at which compression will begin. As long as the signal level is below the Threshold level, it will not be compressed. Once the signal goes above the Threshold, compression starts (this is how Davehouck uses it with his thumbed E string), How much compression depends on the Ratio setting. For example if the RATIO is set to 6:1, the signal level will have to be 6 decibels above the threshold for the output level (what you hear) to rise by 1 decibel. ATTACK is the length of time before compression starts and RELEASE controls the length of time before compression stops. Using these controls together sensibly can make compression work really smoothly. The HARD and SOFT knee settings determine how compression starts. HARD knee only applies compression above the threshold, SOFT knee brings it in gradually (less noticeably) from just below the threshold. The picture below should help with this. As to the PEAK/RMS Adriaan is right on the money.  Just out of interest my settings are: Threshold set so only the peaks are compressed (around 0dB) Ratio set at 4:1 Peak/RMS set at Peak Attack is set at 9 o’clock Release set at 10 o’clock Hope this helps Rob (Message edited by essenceman on February 24, 2004) (Message edited by essenceman on February 24, 2004) | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1085 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brothers Rob, Dave, Adriaan ... unbelievable ... I CAN FOLLOW this. I'am an INTELLIGENT bassplayer ...well ...let's not overreact here. I am interested because I like to switch plucking style in 1 song: so going from parts plucked to parts slapped. When everything is set on Tweak Peaks for the plucking ...the moment I hit the strings with my thumb ...gosh!!! OTOH ...I don't want to have my more silent playing being cranked up, only the top flatted between a reasobable range. So I guess I have a compressor to add to my loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong wish list. When I'm grown up ...just you wait!!! Paul the bad one Again ...I LOVE this club!!! | ||
| hollis
Junior Username: hollis Post Number: 32 Registered: 11-2003 |
Thanks for all the explainations. It seems I've been reinventing the wheel in yet another phase of my oh so limited understanding of sound reproduction... The Harmony Central article really helped me to understand why I've been turning the knobs the way I have for so long! Thanks Dave! It's not only Alembic Instruments that are clearing the fog, the folks in this club have taught me so much useful information that can be resonably applied.......Thanks! Hollis I too LOVE this club!!! | ||
| essenceman
Junior Username: essenceman Post Number: 12 Registered: 10-2002 |
Paul & Hollis, you are both welcome. I agree with you in your love for this club. We make friends, even if we don't meet, (which would be great!!). Most important of all, though, is that we keep on learning from each other and through each other. Long may it last. Rob | ||
| thebass
Intermediate Member Username: thebass Post Number: 112 Registered: 3-2003 |
I am using the TC Electronics Triple C Compressor (Mono) in my rack for 3 years. It is a 3-Band compressor with 60+ factory presets and 100 user presets. The sound is absolutely brilliant and noiseless. Due to the (named) user presets there is no time consuming tweaking required on stage or in the studio. By using the Midi interface it's software is even upgradeable (did it once, worked fine). I am only using the Triple C less and lesser since I play more often now. More informations are available here http://www.tcelectronic.com/Triple-C | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1090 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brother Werner!! Wie geht es Ihnen?? "I am only using the Triple C less and lesser since I play more often now." Can you explain that argument for me please?? Paul the bad one | ||
| thebass
Intermediate Member Username: thebass Post Number: 113 Registered: 3-2003 |
Hi Paul, I am ok. and try my best to master my fretless EPIC at the moment. I am becoming more familiar with it and see (and hear) 1st improvements at my intonation now. Well regarding the compressor. I was using it to achieve a fatter tone which doesn't change much in volume over the time. For most rock tunes this is highly required. But since I am playing in tree bands now with a lot of rehearsals I noticed that I could also get this steady tone just with a better controlled playing technique. Even for slapping techniques I don't use the compressor any more. I still have the Triple C in my rack because it's just there but I almost never use it anymore. I can only imagine to use it as an effect when I am after a highly compressed tone as you would get it from an old analog compressor which is driven far beyond it's threshold. In this case the compressor doesn't serve a role to equalize volume, it's rather an effect with very noticeable volume pumping. | ||
| hollis
Junior Username: hollis Post Number: 35 Registered: 11-2003 |
If I'm not mistaken, I think Greg Lake is using a compressor driven as Werner decribes on Knife Edge. A very interesting and effective sound... | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1093 Registered: 9-2002 |
Possible, but what Brother Werner also makes clear is "keep on practicing, you don't need a Compressor". ***sigh*** "au boulot!!!!!" Paul the bad one | ||
| hollis
Junior Username: hollis Post Number: 37 Registered: 11-2003 |
Such is our burden, our joy! | ||
| adriaan
Intermediate Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 133 Registered: 6-2002 |
Meanwhile I'd like to thank Rob for correcting my gross mistakes regarding compressors in general. As with all tools, only use them if and when you need them. A compressor is meant to smooth out unwanted peaks and dips in an acoustic signal. But hey, if you want to make interesting music you'll want those peaks and dips coming out of your rig. And by the way, an amplifier is essentially a compressor. | ||
| thebass
Intermediate Member Username: thebass Post Number: 115 Registered: 3-2003 |
Hi Paul, don't worry, an even volume within bass playing is not the peak of art. It was just a matter of time and it's nothing I would ever practice for. It's rather like adriaan suggests: after all the countless cover stuff I got to the point where I *want* to here the peaks and dips and dynamics. At this point an even volume is just mechanical playing and the dynamics in playing is the art. Everytime I listen to Stanley Clarkes tunes I just get new lessons in playing with dynamics. He's the master. | ||
| musikill
Member Username: musikill Post Number: 52 Registered: 12-2003 |
I went with the dbx 160A single channel comp/limiter. I use it more as a subtle sustain enhancing tool more than a compressor in the classical sense of the word. I can play evenly enough not to neeed to worry about spikes etc. but I think everything benefits from a little compression. Thanks to all for the input. |
