| Author | Message | ||
| flaxattack
Junior Username: flaxattack Post Number: 30 Registered: 4-2004 |
(Message edited by flaxattack on May 02, 2004) | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 1320 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brother Jeff, I sympathise with your effort but ..alas ...for some people playing bass is a job and their ARE bills to pay. If Fender makes a nice proposition to those people ...well ...how do you expect them to react??? In most of the cases the Alembic is used from there on for studio work (cfr. Flea and many others) and the Fender-Ernie Ball - etc ...for live and pictures. Susan told us recently some stories about it. My good friend and our Brother Paul the fake one (the artist formerly known as Dino) is also an endorser as a professional ...well ...he has to live. About the Fender thing. I think our AAF bassplayer will get a very good and hand-made to his specs instrument made by a bunch of well trained craftman in a kind of custom shop and that the instrument he will eventually play will be a great instrument. As far as that I have no problem with it ...it is pure business. Although ...the moment that Fender brings SIMILAR instruments on the market that are in fact only cheap replica's of the original AAF-bassplayers's stuff I DO have a problem. Because on THAT moment the standards are changed and colleague bass-players who are willing to buy such a thing THINK that they have the real thing but ...they don't. THAT is what I hate about the whole "signature" concept. Until today I really don't know if Stanley Clarke and Mark King actually ever PLAYED one of their Alembic Signatures. I DO believe that they helped designing it. Paul the bad one Of course I want that bass of AAF to have a good home. | ||
| flaxattack
Junior Username: flaxattack Post Number: 36 Registered: 4-2004 |
its still a fender pal-lmao stay tuned- i just sent an email to mica I FOUND THAT I HAVE COLOR PHOTOS OF JACK CASSADY PLAYING ALEMBIC#1 i remembered after seeing the picture of ron with it- that it looked familiar somehow a couple of hours later... an unburnt nanocell realized where i had seen it-i remember being hypnotized by scrollwork on the back end i dug around this house this morning and lo and and they are in great shape tuna played at suny binghampton- we had access to the rear of the gym behind the stage and i brought my asahi pentax and agfa 400 speed film... son of a bitch- i got him and i got it.... and am heading over to the camera store to get these gems transferred to disc great stuff saunders and garcia- capital theatre saunders and garcia -bottom line with jerry sans beard hot tuna grateful dead and old and in the way | ||
| alemboid
Member Username: alemboid Post Number: 59 Registered: 5-2003 |
Bummer. My hat comes off for Leo Fender, who helped changed modern music with his creation. BUT- I am tired of everyone playing a Fender because its the bass to be "seen" with. I remember when I was in highschool in the 80's- there was this kid that would do anything to be in the "in" crowd. He confessed that he really didn't like the Beatles, but said he did to everyone so he'd be as cool as those "in" crowd people who said they liked the Beatles but probably didn't= but "did" to be sure they were "cool". Same thing here in new york- for a long time, you had to show up to a session with a Jazz or P bass to be "legit". Now, Fodera is a "cool" bass. Funny thing is- when I plug in my Alembic, the engineer says within seconds that he has a "sound" and that it is among the best basses he's heard. As far as Fender: Marketing, marketing, marketing. How else can a guitar company maintain sales in excess of 40,000 units a year worldwide? You gotta make sure everyone things it is what you have to play. Like the Matrix, we Alembicians have taken the "red pill", allowing us to see the truth about tone! There are many fine basses out there- many based on the Jazz bass (Alembic included). Not to say they aren't as good as an Alembic- its just a shame that Fender has set out to homogenize the industry. Bryant | ||
| alemboid
Member Username: alemboid Post Number: 60 Registered: 5-2003 |
Bummer. My hat comes off for Leo Fender, who helped changed modern music with his creation. BUT- I am tired of everyone playing a Fender because its the bass to be "seen" with. I remember when I was in highschool in the 80's- there was this kid that would do anything to be in the "in" crowd. He confessed that he really didn't like the Beatles, but said he did to everyone so he'd be as cool as those "in" crowd people who said they liked the Beatles but probably didn't= but "did" to be sure they were "cool". Same thing here in new york- for a long time, you had to show up to a session with a Jazz or P bass to be "legit". Now, Fodera is a "cool" bass. Funny thing is- when I plug in my Alembic, the engineer says within seconds that he has a "sound" and that it is among the best basses he's heard. As far as Fender: Marketing, marketing, marketing. How else can a guitar company maintain sales in excess of 40,000 units a year worldwide? You gotta make sure everyone things it is what you have to play. Like the Matrix, we Alembicians have taken the "red pill", allowing us to see the truth about tone! There are many fine basses out there- many based on the Jazz bass (Alembic included). Not to say they aren't as good as an Alembic- its just a shame that Fender has set out to homogenize the industry. By the way, Stanley Clarke and Mark King have both used their respective signature basses to perform and record with. Bryant | ||
| keavin
Advanced Member Username: keavin Post Number: 322 Registered: 12-2002 |
hey man some folks just sell out! ,,,, but we all gotta eat!! | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 232 Registered: 1-2003 |
I can't speak for anyone either in here or anywhere else for that matter. But, I've been in the fortunate position over the last few years to be able to afford to 'do things differently' - i.e. away from the norm. I learnt to play on a Jazz bass. It was great - but not great enough. Hence I ended-up with my 4001. For what this is worth, I also had an Aria bass during the 80's. Cost next to nothing, played fantastically and sounded great! Just proves that you don't have to spend a fortune to get a good bass (I sold it and have regretted it since). But around that sort of time I had the opportunity to buy another expensive bass in the 4001 league. So, I played a Fender Precision and a Squire Precision. I played a few other basses too - a Wal, a Gibson Thunderbird and some sort of headless Status. The Thunderbird I'd always liked the look of, and was sort of drawn towards because I liked the RD1 but had never (and still never) had the chance to play. It was awful - a dead plank of wood. Singularly the worst bass I have ever played. Next up - the Precision. Foul. No other word for it. I couldn't believe Fender wanted a small fortune for what was, essentially, a baseball bat screwed on to a piece of wood, with one single pick-up thrown in for good measure. The Wal - someone had told me that these were custom built. Not much better than the Precision but with a largely inflated price tag! No ring, no sustain and basically - not much going for it! Horrible. The Squire Precision - £200 at the time I seem to remember. Now - this was quite something for the amount of money, and ultimately I decided to pass on the grounds of one pick-up. Very different to the Squires of today I'm sure! The headless Status was great - all graphite! Considering this was mid-80's, this was new territory! I was very impressed with it but the cost ultimately was out of my league, but not by much. Otherwise I would have bought one. I eventually bought a JayDee Mark King Supernatural - wrong decision, I should have bought the Status... There is a point to this ramble of mine. The thing is that it must be "each to their own". Not all of us are professional musicians (I'm not). Not all of us can afford what we really want. Or want to be seen with. Alembic, to my knowledge, do not (publicly) endorse anyone (I stand to be corrected on this). If I were a famous bass player, I would go with whatever paid me the most money! What I record with behind closed doors is up to me! Replicating an Alembic bass sound FOH would be a nice challenge for most sound engineers I would have thought :-) You can't blame anyone for going for the deal that suits them best. I hope the bass in question finds a good home - but I'm sure that people who can afford basses at this sort of price level aren't bass guitar abusers ;-) Cheers, Rog | ||
| dannobasso
Junior Username: dannobasso Post Number: 22 Registered: 3-2004 |
I appreciate your passion Flax, but the language is a bit out of character for this forum. Fender gave Tye Zamora a deal and had a custom "Oar" bass built. (pg 144 of the current catalog) 9 pc laminate neck, at least 3 laminate body, Bill Lawrence pups, bubinga fretboad. Master built only so the catalog states. Not my cup of tea, not an elegant design to my eye. So he got a signature bass made and perhaps support from Fender. If you recall he didn't use his Alembic in the smooth criminal video either. Maybe he needs the money? The price was high to my mind but maybe a fan of his will pick it up. Maybe Fender's deal was not that lucrative for Tye? I have had discussions with people who think I'm nuts to play Alembics. They could get me deals with a few large manufacturers but I'm not interested. I try to do whatever I can to promote Alembic. So get yourself a record deal, make a video (which you will have to pay back the label from your recording profits) , get it played on MTV,FUSE, VHI etc, and use your Alembic, mention it in interviews, wear the shirts, use the preamps and turn down offers to increase your income between tours, then use harsh language to your detractors. BTW a record deal don't really mean much these days. I have friends who were never developed or promoted, but hey they have a deal! To my knowledge Alembic does not endorse or compensate those who use their products. They do lovingly support their customers and continue to improve on their art and craft. Happy birthday to Ron! May you have many more years of joy with your loving co-founder, daughter and company that we all love and respect. Danno | ||
| rogertvr
Advanced Member Username: rogertvr Post Number: 233 Registered: 1-2003 |
Is it Ron's birthday then? What exact date? | ||
| dannobasso
Junior Username: dannobasso Post Number: 23 Registered: 3-2004 |
I believe it was last Wednesday or Thursday. Might even have been Friday , I forget when I called. Danno | ||
| flaxattack
Junior Username: flaxattack Post Number: 38 Registered: 4-2004 |
gimme me a break dano | ||
| bassman10096
Advanced Member Username: bassman10096 Post Number: 334 Registered: 7-2003 |
I agree with those above who understood the reasons a musician would accept (gladly!!) an endorsement deal that required him/her to play that brand exclusively in public. Reality is reality. In music, career opportunities are not always plentiful or lucrative. It's naive to blame the guy. I'd do the same thing if I were him. Many companies, Fender included, rely extensively on doing whatever they can to attract less experienced, less mature buyers to buy huge numbers of their product. Endorsements really fit their need. Not much purpose in thinking it's pathetic that their products can't substantiate their own credibility and quality. That does not matter to them. But - for every McDonalds, there can be a gourmet restaurant where people go because they know what they are looking for!!! Bill | ||
| dela217
Advanced Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 366 Registered: 6-2002 |
It is a shame that people are forced to play and like certain instruments. I have lost work too because I didn't play a Fender! There are some blues guys in town here that won't use certain bass players because of the "look". New Orleans is a big Fender town it seems. There is a local Guitar Center in New Orleans that a buddy of mine works at. There is a P.R.S. bass in the store that will not sell. He was telling me that in other parts of the country they are selling like mad. Go figure! Same story with Warwick. There was a neck through Thumb in the store that sat for so long that they ended up selling it for $900 just to get rid of it. Anyway, back to the meat of this thread. (For me anyway) Please post all the pics of #1 that you run across. All the pictures I have seen of it does not show the detail that I gotta see. I hope you got some good shots of it. Michael | ||
| flaxattack
Junior Username: flaxattack Post Number: 41 Registered: 4-2004 |
thnaks mike right now i have found one perfect shot of jack form the front hes got the look to his left downward playing #1 and it is clear and if i say so myself well taken - the camera shop is transferring to disc for me-s o i should have it shortly- i think i have more- as i rememebr having shots from the rear side of the stage- but finding them is another story- first- it goes to the family- then i will post it | ||
| 811952
Intermediate Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 166 Registered: 10-2003 |
Michael D., I've played the P.R.S. basses, and they are about as far from an Alembic as I've ever played. I really, really did not like them. Every P.R.S. dealer I've visited (maybe a dozen or so) has had a difficult time moving them. The guitars are sweet, but the basses are not... As for endorsements, back in the day I never got far enough for long enough to be offered one, and I was so adamantly Alembic that I doubt I would have taken one. The Alembic defined my sound. If I were in the industry and offered an endorsement today, I'd probably wh*re myself out for a couple of years, but still specify Alembic guts and use my extra cash to have Mica and company build me an ultimate bass or two. It's a tough call, because the recording industry isn't what it was 20 years ago, and musicians are left to fight over scraps. I can't *really* blame someone for trying to secure his future, because I'm certainly trying to secure mine.. On the other hand, when I bought my Alembic in '81, Susan had compiled a long list of Alembic users which she included in all the information packets. That was a very convincing piece of paper. I suppose she doesn't do that anymore for legal reasons.. And yes, I acquired a Lakland for two reasons. First off, I wanted a five-string and wasn't up on James' ebay-trade-up scheme. Secondly, the Motown/funk band I'm playing in wanted something more Fender-ish and I caved. I'm not proud, but I do understand their reasoning. John | ||
| alemboid
Member Username: alemboid Post Number: 61 Registered: 5-2003 |
...so, even though I use Alembic basses for their tone and playability, I would jump on the opportunity to play the right jazz bass or stingray, as I find their tones appealing, too (think Jaco, Marcus Miller, Old Brothers Johnson, old Flea). There is nothing "wrong" with these basses, and due to less strict quality control than Alembic, some amazing pieces and some dogs got out from Fender & others. I feel Yamaha makes outstanding basses. So does Sadowsky and Warwick. I would gladly play a "fine" instrument, but know now that I can rely on Alembic to get it right- always. I plan on getting another Sadowsky, and at the same time I'm going to install Alembic guts for a clearer and more defined sound. It's because I love the J bass shape and I know Sadowsky can build one right. Most endorsement deals include an instrument(s), support (tech help), and signing an exclusivity agreement. They may do a custom build for you, too- and they will reserve the right to advertise the heck out of you and your bass so others will think that they will sound just like you if they buy that bass/ sig. model. After all, isn't that what happened when everyone bought the Fender Marcus Miller model? Marcus couldn't find work, because there were thousands of people that sounded just like him and worked for less ;-) Rarely will a company "pay" and provide an instrument when endorsing someone. In the end, I guess it comes down to whether or not a musician sticks with what they truly love, and how can they if they're not sure what it is they like? Bryant | ||
| frank_orlando
Junior Username: frank_orlando Post Number: 30 Registered: 8-2002 |
Why compromise... get one of these "Fenderlembics". It's like a P-bass on steroids! Leo would have had a big smile if he heard the tone on this one. Frank  | ||
| dannobasso
Junior Username: dannobasso Post Number: 24 Registered: 3-2004 |
What kind of break would suit you? | ||
| basso
Junior Username: basso Post Number: 42 Registered: 3-2004 |
Hey frank that bass looks great!!what tone controls does it have?i play Fender and Alembics,and for me it really doesn't matter what it is as long as it does what i want,it's a tool for me,nothing more. | ||
| jaybass
New Username: jaybass Post Number: 3 Registered: 4-2004 |
Hello everyone, Interesting discussion. As a professional bassplayer I think that developing a personality is more important then the bass you're playing on. I've been using Alembics for about 15 years now and they are great for me but for somebody else not. So we got taste as an influence,play ability and your financial status. Leo Fender kicked in a door for us bassplayers and technology goes further. Meanwhile we land on Mars and let a robot car explore the unknown. My point is that the evolution of the bassguitar is going further and further also. If somebody really digs a Fender from the mid sixties so be it. Personally it's nothing for me. Fender is indeed marketing. I've turned them down as they made me an offer. But we all buy shoes we fit right? At least I do. | ||
| frank_orlando
Junior Username: frank_orlando Post Number: 33 Registered: 8-2002 |
basso... it has Essence electronics. Volume, pan and Q (tone). Also, it is a short scale. I agree with the fact that they are a tool for creating music, but I like that the Alembics add another dimension by being as much a work of art to look at as they are to create music on. It adds an another dimension to playing live too. I ALWAYS get compliments and questions on my Alembics from other musicians and the audience. Not so much on my other basses past or present. | ||
| bassman10096
Advanced Member Username: bassman10096 Post Number: 335 Registered: 7-2003 |
Frank: Your bass looks even better being played than it did in the first pictures. Is that neck tapered (widest at the heel, narrowest at the nut)or is it the "standard" Alembic neck (almost no taper)? It looks mighty slim from the picture. My preference, exactly (short fingers). Anyway - it looks really cool! Bill | ||
| dean_m
Advanced Member Username: dean_m Post Number: 305 Registered: 7-2002 |
I'm obviously getting into this discussion late. It looks like Jeff's original message was censored but I think I get the whole jist of the conversation. This is not a defense on my behalf believe me, I just feel that I should speak my peace. Brother Paul, I do agree with you about what you said about cheap replicas of signature models. That to me only "bastardizes" the name of the player and the company. The obvious exception of course being the SC or MK signature models, there's nothing cheap there. I too am an "endorser" for lack of a better word for another bass company...so what!!! When I signed on with (oh heck it's no secret) Warwick, it was more so because they are also friends of mine and they were offering me a job as a clinician for their basses. Yeah, I'm not a big rock star so the extra income was well received. Would I have done the same thing for Alembic? You bet your sweet petuties!!!!! And you know what, in a lot of ways I do promote Alembic as well. Whenever I go into a store to do a clinic, if there is an Alembic on the wall, that's usually the first bass I go to. And I make damn sure that it's well set up and clean. And I ALWAYS explain to the sales guys that yes, even though I work for and play Warwick, my old faithful is a 91 Alembic Elan and a fretless Orion and I do have what I would like to consider a fantastic relationship with the Alembic Family... you all being included. Now one thing that I would also like to explain is that my relationship with Alembic is no secret to the folks at Warwick either. They realize that's how it is with me and that's how it will stay. And, if it someday has to change then maybe I'll be looking for another job. Now as far as being a professional player, there are times when I am requested to bring a Fender with flatwounds. Do I always like being told what instrument to play? No!!! But when the person writing the check at the end of the session or gig is insistent, you sort of have to respect their wishes. Now with that being said, I still bring my Alembics and W's because you never know, they may just listen and go, Hey, that's the sound I'm looking for on this particular thing. It's my job as a bass player to suggest other alternatives, if I didn't, I wouldn't be doing my job. Just like any craftsman though, you have to use the tool that's appropriate for the job at hand. Most of the time that can be done with just one bass, yep, you guessed it! But, sometimes it calls for something more specific. I'm sorry but only a P Bass can truely sound like a P Bass. I can get my Orion pretty close but it's not exact. That can be a good thing and a bad thing too. HA!!!! And yes sometimes it is a visual thing where they just want to see a Fender on stage. That's where I really have to draw the line. First of all if it's a visual thing, then why are you hiring my ugly mug!?!?! Do I love my Alembics? YES! Do I love my Warwicks? YES! Do I Iove my Fender? YES! Does this make me a traitor? NO!!! I'm a musician that makes his living playing bass for other people. 90% of the time it's my Elan that goes in the gig bag first though. I've said it before and I'll say it again.... Nobody ever told a poor little kid from Liverpool that he'd never be able to write some of the best rock bass lines on a crappy little Hofner. -remember its the player that makes the instrument. Now lets get back to making music!!! Peace, Dino(bptfo/tafkad) | ||
| bracheen
Senior Member Username: bracheen Post Number: 426 Registered: 11-2003 |
Well said! | ||
| hollis
Intermediate Member Username: hollis Post Number: 170 Registered: 11-2003 |
Can I hear an Amen! | ||
| flaxattack
Junior Username: flaxattack Post Number: 45 Registered: 4-2004 |
amen- the post wasnt censored- i pulled it after some crybaby said the f word was inappropriate amongst adults | ||
| lembic76450
Member Username: lembic76450 Post Number: 58 Registered: 5-2002 |
Flax, This is just an observation, almost 15,000 posts at this site and I think that was the first use of the f-word. As they say on Monday Night Football, you be the judge. I don't think anyone here is judging, just adding their 2 bits. Kenn R. | ||
| pace
New Username: pace Post Number: 3 Registered: 4-2004 |
>>>>>First of all if it's a visual thing, then why are you hiring my ugly mug!?!?! Your a pretty boy at heart, Dean!!!!! Just look at that picture of you in the odd-signatures book.... ;*) It's been a while.... how's things in your neck of the woods?!? I still have the BSX, mucho gracias..... I also owe you a thanks for greasing the wheels in my noggin (my first Alembic is on order~ time to replace that Jerry Jones w/ a real 30" six string!!)..... -Mike | ||
| kmh364
Member Username: kmh364 Post Number: 62 Registered: 9-2003 |
Flax, Right on! If you're moved to profanity, so be it. This is America (Alembica?, LOL!) so exercise them Constitutional rights, Bro. More importantly, post those pix of Tuna and Jerry (Vassar, Grisman and Kahn too)! The Capitol was a great place in a horrible neighborhood....I saw some decent shows there incl. JGB w/Robt. Hunter back in the day. | ||
| frank_orlando
Junior Username: frank_orlando Post Number: 34 Registered: 8-2002 |
Bassman, it is the standard neck...slight taper. It must be the picture angle. My Essence has the custom tapered version. Very slim. Strange but I don't find the wider neck an issue at all. It seems that the main thing for my left hand geometry is that they are both short scales. The fret-to-fret reach above the 5th fret is my issue and the short scale fixed that problem. Thanks for the nice words. I am liking this bass more every time I play it. Frank www.mediacrime.com | ||
| dean_m
Advanced Member Username: dean_m Post Number: 306 Registered: 7-2002 |
Holy Cow!!!! Mike Pace everyone!!!!!! Welcome to the club. Congrats on your new arrival!!!!! Yes folks, we have yet another member to be inducted into The ANEC. That's Alembic New England Chapter to those of you just joining in. I see that I've converted another Alembic believer!!!! Hey man please give me a call or contact me at dino@monotunesmusic.com. My number is still the same. Yeah that picture was a long time ago and a lot more hair!!! Shhhhhh, don't tell anyone. BTW-Frank, great looking Fenderlembic!!!!! Peace, Dino | ||
| frank_orlando
Junior Username: frank_orlando Post Number: 36 Registered: 8-2002 |
Thanks Dino... Next gig... Hogs & Heifers, NYC May 21. www.mediacrime.com |
