| Author | Message | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 2863 Registered: 6-2002 |
Well I have to admit that there is quite a difference between the sound of my series II bass and my non series basses.... Hmmm. I have to admit, I was kind of scared that the difference may be subtle or something I would have to convince myself of due to the price difference. ( but let's not dwell on price since that is an emotive subject and as I've already bought it, pretty irrelevant). Anyway since I've got the "Other Twin" home I've been pretty much taking a lot of time playing it and trying to get to grips with the extra knobs. I've been using Clarkee's recent two albums as a sound reference for some target tones. From what I'm hearing it would seem that he gets down on record the sound he wants out of his bass most of the time rather than with the studio gear, which is pretty much what JJ advised me to do when I was doing a studio session a couple of years back. Well, today I decided to get my other Europa's out for a sound check between them and both have pretty new strings on and haven't lost their brightness. Starting with the all Maple bass which has a naturally a fat, piano like, meaty tone. I put both filters fully open and balance in mid position and volume full on. Even with all that maple, the Series Bass came out on top with a fatter, cleaner, brighter and more defined clarity in the sound and the attack is something else. Changing the tones to a more mellow tone the Maple signature bass still has some crispness on the attack of the not but nothing anywhere near the series bass which has a very defined clear round ness and a very full bottom end. Next I compared it to my Bocate Europa that has been retrofitted with some ACG Filter circuits ( think spellbinder) thus it has for each pick up, a low pass filter with a "CVQ Pot" and a high pass filter with a boost only gain pot. On it's own this bass sounds great and is usually my first call bass for gigs. But compared to the series II, it sounded significantly different, was weaker in tone and lacked warmth in all registers. Where It did score highly over the series II is in the very low lower frequencies as the LP filter starts at I think 80 Hz to 6.3k so you can get the lower frequencies and whack up the Q to get some righteous dub reggae bass. If I use the SF-2 I can get down to those subs too but I could also do that with the other bass. However I can imagine how much bigger it would sound with the SII. As for the ebony laminates, I don't really know what I'm listening for and without a similar bass that has regular neck laminates it's hard to know what it is bringing to the sound. But I'm liking what I hear regardless of how it is composed. So all in all i'm extremely happy with my purchase and if a suitable short scale series bass came up for sale in the future at the right price, I'd be comfortable about letting one or more of my non series basses go to help with the purchase. Any good advice on tone changes would be most welcome. Jazzyvee | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 1438 Registered: 3-2004 |
Let us know about you black 5 with leds sir. | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 251 Registered: 5-2005 |
In my experience, the Ebony lams add clarity, or increased definition to the notes, and of course the ladies favorite, Infinite Sustain!!!! They also weigh a ton so start pumping iron or pay a roadie well. | ||
| jcdlc72
Intermediate Member Username: jcdlc72 Post Number: 148 Registered: 11-2009 |
The Ladies Favorite? Hahahaha!!! That was awesome! ;) | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 252 Registered: 5-2005 |
So is the infinite sustain, Viagra and all (for those who need it, fortunately not me). | ||
| serialnumber12
Senior Member Username: serialnumber12 Post Number: 958 Registered: 12-2004 |
Enjoy wife .....eat out more often. | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 255 Registered: 5-2005 |
Yo serial #12, if you change your sentence around to eat the subject of your sentence .... U O monitor suppression alert. Keep chomping! | ||
| serialnumber12
Senior Member Username: serialnumber12 Post Number: 959 Registered: 12-2004 |
HaaaHaaaaaHaaaaahaaaa!.....................you just made me spill my malt liquor & i dropped my joint!. | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 256 Registered: 5-2005 |
Yo your twelviness just don't drop the joint on your joint. Beside you should be drinkin' single malt. Next time you are in NY or CT, call me and we shall imbibe together, Grasshopper (and smoker). Only then will you be partaking in a real alcoholic drink. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1849 Registered: 9-2002 |
JV: The ebony is a subtle difference in the fundamental of the note. What we usually hear as 'bass', which you'll recognize instantly dialing up the deep end for dub reggae tone is that range around 100-200hz, where it gets thick mighty quick. If you think about those frequencies, and remember that open E is around 43hz and open B around 37 if memory serves me correctly, you see these are actually first and second octave range (those numbers doubled and tripled), not actually the bottoms of the note. Of course the octave overtones repeating and doubling up the scale give the sound we're used to hearing. The ebony, coupled with that mostly maple construction, will let you hear those fundamentals if you know where to listen. This happens on my Elan: No ebony, but a completely white wood (maple + ash) axe, and I notice a certain solidness or a type of penetrating bottom to open B, low C, low D, etc., I've never quite heard before. When Will Gunn was here in Nashville, I played his monstrous coco/ebony five string, and you could feel those fundamentals through the floor. It's not obvious, it depends on the room, the amp, your Q, a lot of things. But over time, I think you'll begin to notice a presence at the very bottom of your lowest notes, once you learn where to listen for them. J o e y | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 257 Registered: 5-2005 |
Joey, once again you provide extremely useful information. Your post on setting up an Alemic is absolutely mandatory reading. Please accept my thanks, and I have excellent single malt waiting for you if you ever get to the NY CT area. The only thing about ebony lams is you need to be real manly. Remember the Salem witch trials - More weight. | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 2864 Registered: 6-2002 |
I don't think I'm an experienced enough bass player to hear the specific items that make up the components in the tone as you are Joey. All of my gigging bass playing experience has been gained since I got my first alembic so i've always had a good solid bass sound. Mica showed me on the scope at the factory how the fundamental sustains so I know from a technical perspective it is there I just don't think I can separate it from the overall sound of the bass and attribute it to the Ebony..... yet. I just love the sound I get from that bass. Whatever part of that is attributed to the Ebony lams is perfectly fine with me. :-) I hope to develop the ear to determine the factors as you have done. jazzyvee | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1852 Registered: 9-2002 |
JV, I hardly have the ears that the serious guys have: I just noticed I kept hearing 'something else' on the Elan that I didn't hear on the BigRedBass. I can't tell you what does it, but it has it and the other one doesn't, it's just a certain extra weight, only on the lowest notes on the B. Sometimes I hear it as a very slow harmonic, a very slow-paced growl, almost a beating type sound, like you'd get on a double-stop if the two strings were just ever so slightly out of tune with each other. Besides, you don't want my ears: EVERY day I play (the same axe, the same room, the same Q on the amp), it sounds very different, to the point I'm going to sell my amps and only play through headphones from now on to take the room out of the equation. This happened every night I gigged, often on 'sit downs', the same venue for weeks. I'm done fighting it. The ebony does add some weight, but hey, bass is a 'full-growed-man's' instrument. Buck Up ! Steve, I'd love to come to NY and CT, but I don't drink (the drink does NOT like me). However, I'm sure you know someplace I can find some great crab cakes, so we can wheel and deal ! The connection between the frequencies of the notes on the bass and the frequencies indicated on EQ's on amps was once illuminatingly pointed out to me by someone WAY smarter than I, and it's been very useful ever since. J o e y | ||
| tubeperson
Advanced Member Username: tubeperson Post Number: 258 Registered: 5-2005 |
Joey I save my drinkin for very special occasions so no worries there. Crab Cakes it shall be! Between your post and Mica's encouragement, I am willing to attempt a neck set up on my Alembics that I would not even consider for any of my Vintage Rick's. | ||
| tbrannon
Senior Member Username: tbrannon Post Number: 1466 Registered: 11-2004 |
Jazzy, I'm guessing that as you get used to hearing your Series II that it'll be that you find something is missing when you pick up another bass. I know that's how it was for me and my Elan with a single ebony lam. I didn't really hear it the first time playing it. The bass sounded great and the lower registers were strong, but I didn't know what I was hearing. However, after a couple weeks of hearing it, when I played something else or listened to recordings of my previous Alembic with an all maple neck, I noticed the difference. Subtle, but you'll know when it's NOT there. | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 2865 Registered: 6-2002 |
I'm already hearing the difference between my series II and my other basses. I've started to play my non series basses first during my practice sessions then series bass at the end. That way they all sound great but If I do it the other way the others sound like they are lacking which in reality they are not. Ironically though if I play my Elan 4 string bass with the filter wide open in sounds closer in sound to my series bass than any of the others and that is all maple. However once the filter starts to be closed down the difference shows itself greatly. Hopefully over time I will be able to distinguish what is giving me the sounds I'm hearing. Thanks for the input guys. Jazzyvee | ||
| a_martin
Junior Username: a_martin Post Number: 30 Registered: 1-2012 |
Hey Jazzy, I was just wondering how your opinion about the tones has developed since since your last post. | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 2954 Registered: 6-2002 |
Hey a_martin, I'm still discovering the dramatic and subtleties of the sounds available on this bass. When the amp volume is low at home many of the finer settings of the CVQ do not show up as dramatically as they do when the volume is up at a higher setting when the sound is absolutely incredible. Probably more to do with the way ears work than the bass. Victor Little mentioned that to me also in a conversation on Facebook that I won't hear the bass properly at home need to gig with it all the time to get used to the controls". So as much as it sounds magnificent at home I'm still aware that it has much more to offer when played at a gig or recorded. But that said, I'm so pleased that I have eventually got to the top of the current alembic models with this bass. I really think it was the right move to make and the timing was perfect with Poor Nigel offering me the bass. One thing I do notice on all of my basses, except one which again is probably my personal tone preference, is that the only sound I don't like on them is with the filter closed on any pickup and turning on the Q-switch or turning up the CVQ. That sound is not something I could use. With the Q/CVQ off at that point the sound is great. Last night I was doing some playing on this bass and also my SC Deluxe and I still think that playing an open E on that short scale bass produces the warmest, fullest, roundest and most authoritative tone of all of my basses. I do have an upcoming gig at the Symphony Hall in Birmingham next month so I think that may be it's first public outing. Jazzyvee | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 3492 Registered: 6-2002 |
A year or so on and I'm even more impressed. That sound with the q on and filter closed is still not useable for me yet but with the filter moved slightly of closed and the Q setting up at the higher end is where all those lovely hollow nasally tones that stanley uses for soloing on tracks such as "Larry has travelled 11 miles and wiated a lifetime for the return of vishnu's report", hang out. It's a beautiful tone. I wish I could solo well enough to use it as effectively. Untimately long term users like the Stanley's JJ's etc of this world are gonna hear the sound they want in their heads and turn the knobs to get that sound instinctively and quickly. I, by contrast, and i'm not sure if this is frustration or joy, find that everytime I pick the bass up to play I'm finding a seemingly new and amazing sound and wondering if I will ever get it again once I move the controls elswhere. Fortunately ears have great short term memory and I get useable sounds. :-) I'm getting better at it but it is still a long process. Jazzyvee |
