| Author | Message | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 1 Registered: 12-2004 |
......my '73 pbass for something Alembic. Will provide more info and pics for anyone interested. | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 3 Registered: 12-2004 |
Nobody, huh? | ||
| pas
Junior Username: pas Post Number: 26 Registered: 3-2003 |
Sort of like trying to swap a Ford for a Rolls Royce...good luck... | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 4 Registered: 12-2004 |
Not quite, since anyone can see Alembics going for around a grand or less on Ebay or Instrument exchange.... | ||
| apdavis
Junior Username: apdavis Post Number: 25 Registered: 5-2004 |
It might help if you could post a picture of your instrument, or a link to a pic of it. If you are still fond of the bass itself, you could looking to upgrading it with the Alembic pickup retrofit electronics and keep your current electronics for the vintage sale later on. I upgraded my Ric's pickups and no one I gigged with felt the bass was diminished by it. | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 5 Registered: 12-2004 |
Here she is. No, I'm not attached enough to it to change the electronics. I have a buttload of more detailed pics for anyone interested.  | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 6 Registered: 12-2004 |
On hold...trade pending | ||
| rob
Junior Username: rob Post Number: 15 Registered: 12-2003 |
>>Sort of like trying to swap a Ford for a Rolls Royce...good luck... >Not quite, since anyone can see Alembics going for around a grand or less on Ebay I feel compelled me to chime in here, as an owner of a Series bass. There are many who follow the camp of "however old a fender is, its price should increase" philosophy. On the opposite spectrum, we who pay many many more thousands for a series bass know that if we ever sell it, we will get somewhere near half of what we paid. Yes, you can find a great used alembic bass for about a grand, on par in your expected trade, but I think mr. pas' reference to "rolls royce" was referring to the lot of basses that are deserving of that reference... best of luck to you on your trade/sale though! - Rob | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 7 Registered: 12-2004 |
Of course I would give the distinction of "Rolls Royce" to an Alembic and it is well deserved. Actually I took Pas' comparison as an attempt to dismiss my offer as ludicrous. However, no offense intended to anyone, and thanks for your kind wishes. | ||
| jacko
Member Username: jacko Post Number: 74 Registered: 10-2002 |
I'd like to jump in here. Although I don't want to cause any offence I feel it's highly unlikely that anyone in this club would want to give up their prized Alembic for a Fender of any vintage. In all likelyhood, I suspect most of us (including me) have been through the fender owning stage and 'moved on' to Alembic.I still own a precision that gets played about once a year out of guilt but I don't enjoy the experience as much as picking up my epic. Hopefully you'll get your trade and will never look back. graeme | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 8 Registered: 12-2004 |
Jacko, I'm afraid you would have lost that bet. What I think you fail to take into account is another scenario than the one you mentioned about moving on from this one to that one. Some people prefer to have an arsenal from which to choose a specific bass for a specific purpose, and some prefer to accumulate a diverse collection. I think it's reasonable to expect that an owner of several Alembics, wether for collecting or having as wide a sound pallate as possible from which to draw as a player, might just part with one to expand the collection or arsenal. | ||
| jalevinemd
Intermediate Member Username: jalevinemd Post Number: 141 Registered: 12-2003 |
I don't know about a "Fender of any vintage." If someone was willing to swap the beautiful 1965 pre-CBS Fender Strat I sold years ago for my Orion guitar, I'd do it in the blink of an eye. I'm not saying they sound the same, but there are other instruments out there besides our precious Alembics...and each serves a purpose in its own right. I cherish my Alembics and will more than likely continue to acquire more of them than any other maker. But the world of basses and guitars existed long before Alembic and will continue to do so after. Let's try to remember that. No one should be made to feel awkward for proposing such a trade to acquire an Alembic...especially not their first. That's what the section is all about. Regards, Jonathan | ||
| pas
Junior Username: pas Post Number: 27 Registered: 3-2003 |
Didn't mean to start a controversy. I'm rather sarcastic by nature and yes, the concept having someone swap an Alembic for a P Bass - particularly in this venue - struck me as somewhat far-fetched. However, I sincerely wish you luck in acquiring an Alembic. I've been playing them for 20 years & they are easily the best basses I've ever laid hands on. Once you've had one, it'd be hard to go back. | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 9 Registered: 12-2004 |
Knowing this is why I've got the terminal G.A.S.!!! | ||
| jacko
Member Username: jacko Post Number: 75 Registered: 10-2002 |
Steve. You're right of course, As I indicated previously, I still have my precision and won't part with it - we kind of grew up together ;-) However, i can't see any situation (for me) where I'd take it to a gig rather than my epic. Each to their own I guess. Anyway, good luck getting your first Alembic - I'm looking forward to my second. | ||
| shakeyeraz
Junior Username: shakeyeraz Post Number: 49 Registered: 11-2002 |
Hey 4 - this may be dumb by why not sell the P outright? With that you'd have the cash to broaden your search for an Alembic - here you're limited to those that would want to do a trade. Just curious.... | ||
| 4string4ever
New Username: 4string4ever Post Number: 10 Registered: 12-2004 |
I have tried. I had it listed on Ebay and Instrument Ecxhange. At the moment, or at least this is my theory, everyone seems more interested in selling their musical equipment for Christmas money, making it a buyer's market. Hell, I saw a transparent blue flame maple Essence sell for $750 last week on Ebay!! I am also a regular member on a bass forum, (don't know if I'm supposed to refrain from mentioning other forum's names here) and have it listed in the classifieds, but same thing. (Message edited by 4string4ever on December 17, 2004) | ||
| shakeyeraz
Junior Username: shakeyeraz Post Number: 50 Registered: 11-2002 |
<removed the duplicate post> (Message edited by shakeyeraz on December 17, 2004) | ||
| shakeyeraz
Member Username: shakeyeraz Post Number: 51 Registered: 11-2002 |
Got it- I haven't been paying much attention to the high-end pre-owned bass market lately. Bob/bsee generally has some good insight there (as do others). I wonder, too, what the Alembic price increase will mean to the pre-owned market come January. Bob? | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 585 Registered: 3-2004 |
Any thoughts I have on the price increase and impact on the price of used basses are pure speculation. Obviously, some sellers will point at the new list prices and try to get more for their instruments as a result of them. That doesn't mean that buyers will pay. If pressed, I would have to say that I expect the price of nearly-new used instruments to go up by a few percent over the course of the next 18 months or so. Remember that there has been a significant notice of the increase. All of the dealers have probably been scrambling to refresh their stock before the increase hits. For custom orders, you have at least a four month wait. As a result of all this, it is unlikely that any newly priced instruments will hit the used market before at least July '05. It also seems to be true that, for most models, the maximum price paid for used instruments in new condition is about half of list. If that trend continues, the 15% price increase will result in a 7% max increase on used gear. That's $200-300 on expensive gear, an amount that is hard to distinguish from noise when you consider the great variety in Alembic basses out there and individual preferences. One recent example that I was involved in was a custom Essence set up like an SC standard model with PH laminates, side LEDs, and Europa electronics. Best guess at value on this instrument would have been about $1800-2200. The instrument traded hands twice in about a month at prices of $2600 and about $2350. The second time, it would have gone higher again if the seller set up his auction better. Talking to all involved, the reason people were willing to pay a premium for this instrument was the presence of one or two cheap/free options. This bass is set up with an ultra-narrow neck, the primary draw, and a wider pickup spacing to boost the bass response on the short scale instrument. In this world, a nice '73 P-bass in original condition appears at retail in boutiques for prices up to $1500. Even a player's bass tends to sell around $1000. That's an even trade for a lot of used Alembics out there, but you have to find the right guy. We've got quite a few Alembic bigots around here, but there are also players that have a variety of instruments. My initial response to this thread was that maybe the question should have been asked on a Fender-oriented forum, but I can't think of any such place. Remember also that these basses tend to appreciate. In 5-10 years, as these things get more rare, the value of an instrument in good shape will probably go up. Alembics don't appear to do that from what I have seen. The prices may rise along with the price of new instruments and inflation, but not to values above current retail for a new one like old Fenders have done. As a side note, that cheap Essence was a member here selling the bass for what he paid for it. It was a bit beat up, and I think the low price scared away some buyers wondering what else was wrong with it. Essence basses in decent shape generally run $1000-1500 on the used market. It's definitely true that it's a buyer's market in the last quarter of the year. A bass that I was trying to buy for $1300 six months ago (seller wanted $1500) was just offered to me for an even $1000. Money gets tight and high-end basses are luxury items that can go for many people, especially since so many of us have more than one (or more than five...) Think on all of this and come to your own conclusions. Most of the above is opinion, and you know what that can be worth. Happy Holidays, and good luck getting what you're looking for! -Bob | ||
| lbpesq
Intermediate Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 195 Registered: 7-2004 |
This whole area is so incredibly subjective and irrational. When I consider that my '61 strat (a wonderful guitar, but still just a bolt-on neck strat) is worth 10-20 times more than my '83 Electrum, and 2-3 times more than Im paying for a custom Furhter, I'm dumbfounded. The reality is that the used instrument market has little to do with the actual relative quality of the instrument. It is much more a reflection of which rock-star plays which guitar/bass and the mythology that has built up around certain instruments over the years ("pre-CBS" Fenders; "dot neck" ES335's, etc.) I think the market for the highest end instruments (I mean Alembic) is limited by the fact that there are a limited number of players who 1 - know about these instruments, 2 - desire these instruments, and 3 - can afford these instruments. There has been a new Further guitar that has gone around e-bay a couple of times in the last couple of weeks. The seller is asking a hair below $5000 on a "buy it now". That's about what you'd pay for a new stock Further, and no wait. My reaction is that if I'm going to spend that much for a guitar, I'll spend a little more and get it made exactly like I want it. I suspect I'm not the only one who feels this way. Thus, someone like me is less likely to purchase used - unless I run into a great deal like my '83 Electrum at the World Guitar Show for $1200. (Which, by the way, convinced me to pony up the bux for a Further). I guess the bottom line, for me, is that I play for enjoyment. My instruments are my toys - not a business proposition. A long time ago, a wise man told me to never sell an instrument. For the most part I have taken that advice. On the few occasions when I haven't, I later came to regret it. You can always get more $, but that old weird Martin Electric I used to have ...... oh well. Bill tgo | ||
| jagerphan84
Intermediate Member Username: jagerphan84 Post Number: 139 Registered: 10-2003 |
As a side note to a side note, the buyer of that blue Essence stated that the bass was in better-than-advertised condition and he was very happy with the purchase. I guess I was a little TOO honest with my listing! It worked out well for all parties involved, though. | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 433 Registered: 6-2002 |
Bob, As far as I can tell (not being of a commercial disposition) - and IMHO - your maths are a bit off. You can either halve the full price and calculate with the same percentage, or halve the percentage and calculate from the full price. Halving both price and percentage halves the effect you're trying to ascertain. | ||
| dnburgess
Advanced Member Username: dnburgess Post Number: 344 Registered: 1-2003 |
Following on from Bill TGOs comment, it seems to me that the prices of vintage instruments, Fenders in particular, are not driven up by the professional musicians that could most exploit their virtues. Rather it is moneyed and nostalgic baby boomers - the dentists, doctors, lawyers who can afford to bid up the price of a vintage Fender even though they may not have as much time to play as they would like. Some of these people will also order $20,000 new custom Alembics. Then, of course, there are the "collectors", who may not play at all but want to own a part of musical history or, worse case, see them as merely appreciating assets. This phenomenon has been going on a long time in the classical world and has lead to $1M stringed instruments. The response has been the purchase of such instruments by philanthropic bodies (which ironicly introduces a new class of moneyed buyer to auctions, pushing prices even further) that insure and lend the instruments to professional musicians that would otherwise never be able to afford them. I would encourage owners of valuable vintage instruments to consider creating endowments (maybe in conjunction with local music colleges) to allow these instruments to be played in public by up and coming young players. David B. | ||
| richbass939
Junior Username: richbass939 Post Number: 42 Registered: 11-2004 |
4 string, good luck to you in finding an Alembic and finding a buyer for your P-bass. As you can tell, Alembic owners can be pretty passionate. As David B. said there is some doctor out there who had to get rid of a '73 P-bass when entering med school who is dreaming of having one again. We all make some decisions for nostalgic reasons. I would love to have a '73 Rick 3000 again. And it is not because I think it would sound as good as my Epic. I know you walked in the Alembic Club door and were immediately whacked on the head. Please, DO NOT GIVE UP on the club. Collectively, the club members can offer so much expertise on every issue and problem you may encounter. I feel that you would be pleased with any Alembic model that has had good care. One thing about Alembic is that the same quality goes into the lower priced basses. I have never played a Series I or II but I know my Epic sounds great. Again, good luck in your efforts to get an Alembic. Rich |
