| Author | Message | ||
| gtrguy
Senior Member Username: gtrguy Post Number: 950 Registered: 9-2004 |
Another interesting copy bass on EBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-VINTAGE-80s-HAYAKAWA-NECK-THRU-BASS-MIJ-DIMARZIO-PICKUPS-FUNKY-SLAPPER-/191732615347?hash=item2ca42788b3:g:8ioAAOSw7hRWPD-A | ||
| harald_rost
Advanced Member Username: harald_rost Post Number: 244 Registered: 6-2002 |
Isn't it more a toy than a copy, from an Alembic's view? | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 2494 Registered: 9-2002 |
Looks very Westone or Vantage to me, probably the same factory putting 'Hayakawa' brand name for sale in the Far East. The neckthru section looks a LOT like an Aria SB. The MIJ basses from the 80's either fall into this very Alembic-inspired style (Aria SB's and Ibanez Musicians from this time frame particularly, and axes like this at lower price points) or the usual Jazz or Precision copies. I still have a soft-spot for those 'Red neck' Tokais, where the red tint on the body was duplicated on the maple neck, maple fingerboard and all. Alembic-inspired (even copies like the infamous Fernandes Series recreations) guitars bear testament to the impression they made on the Japanese guitar industry. Interestingly, while they went with DiMarzio Model P's (one of the first aftermarket bass pickups) and a brass cavity cover, they didn't use that crazy heavy DiMarzio replacement brass bridge, which was also 'Big Medicine' in those days. Joey | ||
| gtrguy
Senior Member Username: gtrguy Post Number: 951 Registered: 9-2004 |
True, that is more of a Fender style bridge than they would normally put on their bass. Many MIJ guitars from this era had nice brass bridges that they made themselves. I have owned several fine MIJ instruments from back in this era, such as Matao neck-throughs and Washburn A-20s (neck-through) etc and Ibanez GB-10s and Howard Roberts copies. And of course my fine Alembic inspired 12 string!  | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 2496 Registered: 9-2002 |
I think that the still-in-production GB10 is a minor classic, an answer to the usual archtop-at-higher-gain problems (as well as smartly being a bit bigger than an LP and a bit smaller and thinner than an L5 cutaway). Ibanez still makes these in Japan, a rarity for a Japanese guitar company any more. A close second is the Yamaha SA2000 or 2200, the best 335 you've never played. Joey | ||
| gtrguy
Senior Member Username: gtrguy Post Number: 952 Registered: 9-2004 |
I'd still like to find an SG2000 or SG (SGB) 3000 or an early one. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 2498 Registered: 9-2002 |
Back in the day (early 80's), my ordering a BB1200 allowed us to get to a 6-piece price break from Yamaha, so we got an SG2000 included in the order. Very Alemb-ish, neckthru, maple-capped mahogany wings, sustain block underneath the bridge. It had those Grover-copy, round-round button Gotohs, brass bridge, ebony board. We actually had to raise the action: It played perfectly, but the action was incredibly low. It's strange inasmuch as it really feels like a deeply double-cut LP, nothing 'SG' about it, and from a distance, the neck looks bent from the down-angle relative the body. Alongside a brand-new LP Custom we had at the time, there was just no comparison, hell, it wasn't even fair. I honestly think these are the greatest solid-body electrics that never caught on, in their ultimate 2000 or 3000 versions, easily on par with anything you can name. The rarely seen on these shores 3000's are still made by Music Craft, Yamaha's MIJ shop for their very best axes. But it's the Japanese way to get a hit and move on. Although these guitars have been around, like Ibanez they've made them in endless variations, and with their outlook, by the time something's a real hit, it's too late, on to the next. And aside from their budget box guitars, they start to get serious about electrics, then they're not, it all lapses, then a few years later, here we go again with their next great idea. Introduce something good, wane, dilute, repeat. This is why dealers don't stock them, as next year, hot sellers, the next year you can't give them away, and on and on. Aggravating. Order them at NAMM this February, ask about your back-orders at NAMM next February, all the while paying floor plan. Sheesh . . . . I waited 18 months for a BB2000 that never came, and when I cancelled the order, they still had NO clue when it would have come in. Joey | ||
| ed_zeppelin
Intermediate Member Username: ed_zeppelin Post Number: 186 Registered: 2-2010 |
Believe it or not, it begins (and to a degree, ends) with Singer sewing machine company. A collective "wtf?" Reverberates through the universe. After the war, Singer contracted the Tsukada family to make sewing machine cabinets. The Tsukada family had manufactured "butsudan," the altars in every Japanese home, for more than twenty generations:  I think it's very important to understanding the difference between Japanese and American attitudes for what happened next. Butsudan are by their nature the best woodworking on the planet, and every one is different. They reflect the status of the family that commissions them, as well as the maker: http://tinyurl.com/pyrp8t6 (feast your eyes, gentlemen) Imagine ten or more generations of your own family using the same family firm to craft altars for your home, and all of your relatives as well. Each customized to the smallest detail, while reflecting your family's particular style and status. Fortunately the sewing machine market tanked, and the Singer/Tsukada company, "Matsumoku" began making guitars (mostly from wood left over from making butsudan) like Guyatone, Vox and Teisco Del Rey. With acoustics, they started with classical guitars and flattops, and quickly moved to archtops. From Matsumoku's Wikipedia page: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matsumoku
Confused yet? I know I am. From a guitar construction viewpoint, the earliest models had glaring deficiencies: the wood, glue and binding all reacted horribly to America's drier climate. The way Matsumoku addressed those issues were what led to the Alembic-inspired instruments we're discussing. I'd like to return to the topic of the differences between Japanese and American guitar companies for a second, because it's only important to the point that both started moving their manufacturing operations to other Asian countries like the Philipines, Korea and Indonesia. Most of the instruments we're discussing were from the period that Japanese companies excelled at innovation and dependability (Toyotas and Datsuns from the 70s are still on the road. When's the last time you saw a Chevy Vega or Ford Granada?) One of the VPs at Daddy's grew up in Japan and dealt with Japanese companies a lot. He said that everything was oriented towards teamwork. So each "brand" within a company was organized in independent autonomous groups (like the MacIntosh team within Apple), and each innovation or method was shared freely with all the other groups. So if someone at Westone came up with (or stole  ) an idea or method, by Friday Ibanez and Washburn would be doing it, too. (How well do you think Gibson, Fender and Martin would have shared info?) Thus they arrived at neck-thru construction because they realized that the neck pocket acted as a hinge. (Or they just stole it from Alembic.) Matsumoku guitars began using three-piece laminated necks, with the grain of the middle lam at a 90 degree angle. They used better glues and binding material, brass hardware (as someone pointed out: sustain blocks). In 1987, Singer went kaput, Matsumoku couldn't buy out their contract and the "brands" were broken up into independent units and sold off. By then most Japanese and American companies had established manufacturing in other Asian countries anyway, to add to the confusion. Since we're discussing Alembic-ish guitars from a very brief era, from roughly 1980 to 1987, I think it's important to note what NOBODY has stolen from Alembic (with minor exceptions, of course): the two-piece adjustable brass nut. I worked as a repairman at Daddy's during its heyday as the world's largest retailer of used instruments, and even though I worked on thousands of instruments, I can count on one hand the number of times I saw a brass nut, period. I'm sure other repair dudes can verify. Alembic electronics are unique, period. The pickup height adjustment. Never saw that anywhere else. Slotted tailpieces. Yeah, a few here and there, but never in a massive brass foundation. And my favorite; that beautiful masterpiece of form and function: the Alembic bridge (though that bridge on the 12-string pictured earlier looks familiar ) There were lots of other companies building guitars of varying quality, but for the purposes of this discussion, I believe Matsumoku was the primary exemplar of striving toward the same goals that Alembic achieved long ago and has sustained ever since: EXCELLENCE. I don't think of them as "copies" or "clones" of Alembic. If so: not even close. They're more like nods in Alembic's direction. "Tributes" for lack of a better, more ironic word. Too bad Alembic doesn't make altars, huh? Well, as far as I'm concerned, they do. But this isn't a religious discussion. |
