| Author | Message | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1717 Registered: 6-2002 |
(Message edited by jazzyvee on October 15, 2009) | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1718 Registered: 6-2002 |
Just seen this on the UK American Guitar web site. (UK Alembic Distributor) http://www.americanguitarsuk.com/bassshop/alembicB.php     A lovely Jazz bass.....!!! I'm guessing it's based on the Elan, ( Vol, Pan, Filter & Q-switch and maple body), but with an Orion headstock. Now wouldn't it be good to hear Marcus play one of those. Jazzyvee | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 340 Registered: 5-2004 |
Beautiful bass, I'd love to have it! I'd also love to hear Marcus on it but let's face it, Marcus gets an amazing tone out of his Fender. A true master! | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 450 Registered: 5-2009 |
I really like this ! | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 2453 Registered: 10-2002 |
Graham gets some nice instruments in ( I ordered my Rogue through him). It would be interesting to know who's buying them and why they're not members of this forum. I notice the dragon wing he's had for years has gone. Graeme | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1721 Registered: 6-2002 |
It is a really stunning version of a jazz bass. I don't know what the top wood is but its swirl pattern is amazing. I bet the fender custom shop would look at that with envy. :-) jazzyvee | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1722 Registered: 6-2002 |
It is a really stunning version of a jazz bass. I don't know what the top wood is but its swirl pattern is amazing. I bet the fender custom shop would look at that with envy. :-) Maybe I should be devious and join a fender bass forum and paste it in there...... jazzyvee | ||
| enzo
Intermediate Member Username: enzo Post Number: 149 Registered: 4-2009 |
Jazzyvee, don't be mean haha ! Really gorgeous bass ! | ||
| chrisalembic
Member Username: chrisalembic Post Number: 78 Registered: 3-2009 |
i would really love to try this one!! i love jazz basses just like alembics. i am really curius how this one sounds and how much jazz bass there is to it. anyone here ever played something like this? | ||
| toma_hawk01
Intermediate Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 186 Registered: 9-2009 |
Wow! Imagine Jaco playing one of those in a fret-less version...? The world will never know. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on October 16, 2009) | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1724 Registered: 6-2002 |
In the absence of Jaco, maybe Victor Bailey or Richard Bona would be good guys to give it a whirl. But, I think Stanley Clarke should buy it and give it to Marcus as a gift on the next SMV tour. Imagine an alembicised Miller tone......!!! Jazzyvee | ||
| toma_hawk01
Intermediate Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 188 Registered: 9-2009 |
I could see it... sure, I see this one going to Markus Miller definitely. But Stanley would have to do it, because if Markus thinks Alembic would present him with a bass of this nature, it would take about 30 years of using an Alembic professionally, and by that time, Markus would probably be in his 80's driving a Ferrari around the backdrops of the French Rivera or Monaco looking to better days. (Well, perhaps I reveal too much of my own fantasies...)  | ||
| enzo
Intermediate Member Username: enzo Post Number: 152 Registered: 4-2009 |
I've read an interview long time ago where Marcus said basically this: the man, not the bass. In other words he was ( proudly ) stating that you don't need an expensive bass to be a great player. So I don't see him willing to switch to Alembic any soon... | ||
| chrisalembic
Member Username: chrisalembic Post Number: 79 Registered: 3-2009 |
I think Marcus Miller would still play and be recognized as Macrus Miller, if he played Alembic. But as the same time I am very certain that the sound would be different. I too believe its about the player, the hands, the touch etc. that create a unique voice. But I dont think anyone can deny that the instrument also plays a certain role in the tone. Otherwise Anthony Jackson, Jimmy Johnson, Marcus Miller could all just buy a cheap squier p-bass and let their hands create all the tone ;-) I mean if its not about the bass at all, we wouldnt even be on this forum, right? | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1726 Registered: 6-2002 |
I agree Chris, Marcus would still sound like Marcus whatever he plays and I would still sound like "me" on his bass. I think also along with the bass that a player uses, it is also the note choices and how they are articulated them that makes a players style recognisable so it's more than just the sound an instrument brings with it. True, you don't need an expensive bass to be a great player. I would confidently assert that most of us learnt our craft on pretty dodgy, cheap basic instruments and only when we got to a competent level, and finance allowed, chose to purchase an expensive or quality instrument. It would be an interesting test to get a band of some top musicians to record/perform on stage completely using beginners starter instruments and back line, everything from brass, to drums, guitars, amps, mics, cables cabs, keyboards, the works, taken right from a shop without any modifications adjustments or anything. Just tune up and go. I wonder how much different the overall sound of the band would be? Jazzyvee | ||
| toma_hawk01
Intermediate Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 198 Registered: 9-2009 |
Does anyone really believe Famous Artist speaks to mass media-outlets with the whole truth; or as to the degree of a sworn oath; or even with some caution? If Marcus wants to promote a tour, he could call in a favor based on his business senses. It's business, just as simple as that... "Baby needs a pair of new shoes". The media cares nothing about the truth, it just need a story to sell, and the Artist needs the publicity, and once the two meets, the last thing Artist wants to do is piss off any present or future deals with phrases worded in ways that could harm. You can't piss the wrong people off, even if its your parents, -- who pays your tuition or provides the lifestyle... The sad thing about this, its true in all fields. I never believe in most interviews, unless it comes from true Masters! Stanley Clarke is one of those individuals, I consider a true Master! (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on October 18, 2009) | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 341 Registered: 5-2004 |
I agree Toma except with the true masters statement. Even Stanley is not going to "pee where he sleeps." The SMART people do exactly as you suggest and Stanley is a smart man. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Intermediate Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 199 Registered: 9-2009 |
A Master Pizza Maker, never compromise on the purist quality of their ingredients, otherwise anything less, they leave the kitchen in protest. Alembics and Fenders.... Alembics are as the New York Steak, as the Fenders are Hamburgers. One uses mascots and/or clowns, while the other focus on the quality. If anyone support an inferior product for a living, is one thing -- but supporting an inferior product as a conditional state of mind, is insane. Marcus Miller probably has an Alembic "At home, and in privacy of his media free home." (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on October 18, 2009) | ||
| hg30904
Member Username: hg30904 Post Number: 55 Registered: 6-2003 |
I thought that I read somewhere that Victor Wooten purchased some of Clarke's basses. Also I thought that he said in an interview that he bought an Alembic very early in his development. I know that there was a short time when Mark King used a Fender and that was after his flirtation with Alembics. Many years ago The World's Most Dangerous Band did a song where they all played toy instruments. While they wouldn't do it all the time, the point was rather obvious (if not gimmicky). | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 342 Registered: 5-2004 |
LOL I'm not going to get into another disagreement with you friend, I think Alembics are world class! :-) But I have to say, Marcus gets an amazing sound from his hamburger! LOL Sometimes there nothing like a good burger! Let's be honest ... there are a lot of great instruments out there. Alembics are amazing instruments and few can compare in regard to workmanship but it's a big world with a lot of choices and thank god a lot of amazing basses to pick from. It's all good! | ||
| toma_hawk01
Intermediate Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 200 Registered: 9-2009 |
It basically comes down to: "We will pay you not to use Alembics because we can't compete with their products going toe to toe." Die-hard Alembicans are the finest and bravest people in the world! Quality is like Love, it overcome above all things. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on October 18, 2009) | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 343 Registered: 5-2004 |
For me ... I'd love at least 12 different brands of basses I can think of off the top of my head in my collection. I think they all have something special to offer. And I'd LOVE this Alembic Jazz bass to be one of them. I've always loved Fender Jazz basses, my 1st "professional" bass when I was a kid, and of course Love Alembics so for ME this alembic Jazz bass would be a dream instrument! | ||
| mario_farufyno
Advanced Member Username: mario_farufyno Post Number: 322 Registered: 9-2008 |
I'm curious about the Neck, is it Bolt on? And what about the Pots, is it Vol-Vol-Tone? How much of Fender do we get with this 24 fret Jazz? (Message edited by Mario Farufyno on October 20, 2009) | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 239 Registered: 9-2008 |
it's neck through with a volume, pan, filter, and q-switch. i like Fenders, don't own one yet but have been trying to get an American Deluxe jazz for a while now, but if Marcus likes the tone he gets from HIS signature, then it's obvious the sound he is looking for, so Alembic may not be his cup of tea if you know what i mean. for me, i find tones in my Rickenbacker copy that i like more than one of my other basses with Alembic electronics in it, it's all about the sound you are looking for ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| mike1762
Advanced Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 364 Registered: 1-2008 |
I love the looks of that bass, but I very much doubt you could coax a "true" Fender tone out of it (neck-through, active electronics, etc). However, emulating a Fender tone is not really why we own Alembics is it??? | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 345 Registered: 5-2004 |
I believe each bass and each brand has something different and good to offer. If you ONLY like Alembics so be it however as i said in an earlier post, I know of at least 12 different brand of basses I'd love to own (including Alembic of course) because they all have something to offer. Some are high end like Alembic and some are common like Fender but all IMO are worth owning and playing. After all ... the instrument is the TOOL the musician uses to reproduce the sound in their head and we all hear sound differently. And If we didn't it would be a very boring world! | ||
| enzo
Intermediate Member Username: enzo Post Number: 153 Registered: 4-2009 |
+ 1 | ||
| karl
Intermediate Member Username: karl Post Number: 165 Registered: 7-2002 |
Yes, one of the young Victor Wooten's first basses was an Alembic, which he bought in order to emulate his hero, Stanley. Apparently, though, he switched to Fodera when the sound engineer in a studio in which he was playing a session complained that he couldn't get a good sound out of the Alembic . . . it takes all sorts, I guess! Incidentally, there's a track on the SMV album called something like 'Lemme Try Your Bass', I think, on which Victor, Stanley and Marcus swap basses, with some interesting results. Maybe someone out there can work out who's playing what. You can certainly hear the difference, which only serves to back up the notion that 'it's the player, not the bass'. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 238 Registered: 9-2009 |
Hey Karl, if you you are going to make statements like those, you made - please, please, please provide your sources. One area particular, when you said Victor's sound engineer complained about not being able to get a good sound out of the Alembic... I would be very interested in learning this insight from you if possible. I have to read this with my own eyes... | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1748 Registered: 6-2002 |
Hey, I read that story too, here is a link to the details. http://www.fodera.com/artists/wooten/book/bassexc.htm Jazzyvee | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 239 Registered: 9-2009 |
Haa haaa!!! "Victor managed to buy that Alembic and he played it until he entered the recording studio with Kashif..." "Kashif took one look at it and told Victor to get another bass." Maybe I am going blind, but I had not read where the sound engineer "Kashif" complained about not being able to get a good sound out of the Alembic. From the readings, Kashif, simply wanted Victory to play his supplied Music Man bass. From the way it reads, Kashif was caught off guard when Vic entered the room with his Alembic. I don't see a connection from the readings, where the sound engineer allowed Vic to play the Alembic. Vic never even got to bat with the Alembic. So, how could the sound engineer even make a comment of complaints, when Vic was stopped in his tracks before playing a single Alembic note? Check this out... "I asked Vic why he liked the Fodera so much. Was it the tone?" “No, it was the feel". A bass had to feel good, before commenting on the sound. Clearly Alembics sound good, but probably didn't feel as good to him... The sound engineer offering Vic a Music Man, in comparison to an Alembic was laughable. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 01, 2009) | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 240 Registered: 9-2009 |
Again, I don't think it comes down to feel either. It comes down to the money they had in the budget for Vic's bass. It just so happens, $900.00 bucks for the Fodera was more than an investment of Vic's bass, it was also an opportunity cost to aid a young guitar company. This is how endorsement deal are made. Hey, Victor was about to use his Alembic, but with $900 bucks, and a business relationship with a young company, that "$900" buys you support Alembic don't offer. In this case, Victor must continue using Fodera or lose sponsorship. From a consumer perspective, the same rules apply... and this means, I am still not going to run and get me a Fodera because Victor plays them. Victor was picked up very quick by Fodera, because they needed his talent and Vic needs the money to support his craft, and future business ventures. Usually when a company looks to endorse their products, the product usually lack quality. Heck, just make a great instrument, and speak with the truth and without the worries of kissing up to an artist. Alembic is a a solid company, of which, I am very proud! As for Stanley Clarke... I believe Stanley loves his freedom to pick and choose any or whatever bass he wants without any company breathing down his neck. But, what does this mean for the price of tea in China anyway. | ||
| mike1762
Advanced Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 373 Registered: 1-2008 |
I don't know Hal. I go to different basses for different things. My Alembics are (without a doubt) the most versatile in the stable. But they can't do EVERYthing and a Music Man tone is a good example of that. I record just about everything with one of my Alembics these days. But if I were to find myself on stage again, I would probably have a Stingray in my hands for a variety of reasons. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 242 Registered: 9-2009 |
Mike, I totally understand what you are saying. I like Music Man basses too, but Musicman's twangy bright sounds, is really all you get... I like tea too, but I love a bold cup of coffee. Alembics are like a bold cup of coffee. But to pit one bass against another is simply juvenile. I could take an Alembic and make it sound cheap if I wanted and need to do this. But Try making a Music Man sound rich and full... I don't know anyone who achieved this feat. Also, Music Man basses was never designed for the fullness, they were designed for disco music, of a disco age. | ||
| darkstar01
Intermediate Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 175 Registered: 6-2005 |
i hate coffee... and just to interject, i don't think vic is "sponsored" by fodera as much as he just endorses them. which is to say, i'm pretty sure he buys his basses just like everyone else. but whatever. i didn't buy my fodera because vic plays them, and i don't buy alembics because stanley plays them. i could really care less, honestly. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 244 Registered: 9-2009 |
So what is your point, you hate coffee? You are kidding yourself if you think Vic is not getting sponsorship for supporting Fodera basses. Also, nobody ever said you purchased your basses because of Stanley or Vic. But I'll tell you one thing to this, neither Vic or Stan,didn't hurt the brands either. For there are people who were and are inspired by not only their music, but also by what tools they use too. Ok, you dance to a different drummer, that's wonderful. However, our discussion was not of this nature. It was about Vic's engineer who didn't want to record the Alembic. Also, during the time Vic's engineer refused to record him with the Alembic, Vic was not even aware of Fodera basses. The bottom line is... If you have the freedom to play a Fodera, Alembic or a sitck with a string, it's your business, unless you have a sponsorship agreement. For a young 16 year old bass player, they are likely to go for the money. I seen this story before. There's nothing wrong with endorsements or sponsorships, where would many businesses be without them. This is a question of your own musical ethics, which is different from my perspective. I don't play any other bass but Alembics basses. By the way, the first time I seen and heard an Alembic, was not from Stanley Clarke, it was from a 1975 concert of George Clinton and Parliament Funkadelics. If you asked me who Stanley Clarke was back in those days, I would show a blank face. So, when I seen my guitar heros like Micheal Hampton honor Jimi Hendrix with an Alembic Series I electric guitar, I was floored, and would soon learn about what guitar he played. Stanley Clarke was told about Alembic basses, as Vic was informed about Fodera according to Stanley's interviews. LOL... (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 01, 2009) | ||
| darkstar01
Intermediate Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 176 Registered: 6-2005 |
yeah. that's my point. | ||
| mike1762
Advanced Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 374 Registered: 1-2008 |
I agree that a Music Man is a tonal "1 Trick Pony", but they are a hell of a trick!!! | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 251 Registered: 9-2008 |
agreed, i'm not a big fan of musicmans, but i just got a Gibson Victory Artist bass and it's incredible, they need to re-make them. ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| hieronymous
Senior Member Username: hieronymous Post Number: 654 Registered: 1-2005 |
Gibson basses +1 | ||
| elwoodblue
Senior Member Username: elwoodblue Post Number: 872 Registered: 6-2002 |
I love my Musicman, it's easy to play for hours on end...especially with the La Bella tapewounds. I had a 2004 jazz bass and something wasn't right about it...it seemed like more work than play when jamming. The Leo era G&L's are great sounding (and versatile) too when a bolt on bass is desired. I would have loved to have an Alembic that looked like a J-bass from a distance when playing Hendrix bass lines...still keeping an authentic look with all the goodness of an Alembic's sound. ( I quit that band because of quibbling about appearance ...Marshall,Marshall,Marshall...there's better equipment for bass out there besides Marshall. Sorry, I digress.) | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 252 Registered: 9-2008 |
Ampeg bass cabs for sure, no questions asked, i have a SVT-1540 cab with a Hartke 3500 head that i will never get rid of ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 347 Registered: 5-2004 |
Fact is Victor would NOT use a bass unless it does what he requires. He's not going to hurt his reputation by using a low quality product that doesn't fill all his needs regardless of the deal he has with the manufacturer. Mark King has an Alembic named after him but now uses Status basses, not Alembic. And as far as I know Mark NEVER used an Alembic bass with the electronics supplied on the Mark King Signature bass. Do you think Mark's simply a sell out and is willing to kill his reputation by using an instrument that doesn't do what he requires? During the last Who tour I saw John Entwistle (on TV) using a black Fender Precision bass, not his Alembic. In a TV interview he spoke about his love for the Precision bass too, his FAVORITE bass. Could have been motivated by business but he still sounded like John! My point is, Alembics are (in MY opinion) the most amazing basses available BUT they DON'T sound like Fenders if you want the Fender sound, they don't sound like Modulus basses is you want that sound, they sound like Alembics. There isn't a "one bass sounds like them all" bass available out there regardless how versatile most Alembics are. (Line 6 tried, didn't work) It really depends on personal taste. And if you love the sound and feel of a Fender Precision you would be nuts to spend 10 grand on an Alembic when you can get a made in America Fender Precision for a little over a grand. It's all a matter of taste, there is no right or wrong. And I think being totally loyal to just ONE brand of ANYTHING ties your hands. I'd love a few of EVERY brand of bass out there if I had unlimited funds. 2 Alembics series II (fretted and fretless both 6 strings), a few Modulus basses (which i love) a fretless and fretted, a few Musicman Basses (Fender on roids) fretless and fretted, a few Warwicks fretted and fretless, the list goes on. Choice is a GOOD thing! | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 253 Registered: 9-2008 |
i like how Raymond summed that up :-D ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 251 Registered: 9-2009 |
I can make an Alembic sound cheap like any one of those basses you mentioned. However, no bass could sound like an Alembic. Also, anybody who play's professionally, and starts off with an Alembic, artist are completely free to play any bass they deem fit. Mark King plays Stratus basses because, Stratus company pay's him something... If you want to play an Alembic bass, YOU must pay for it with your honest; fact-seeking; detail unlimited; comparison analytical; hard earning dollars if you want the best. If you think Alembic needs to start paying Artists to play their instruments, that would be the first sign, I would need to start looking to building my own bass. The most beautiful thing about Alembic started with the beautiful philosophy of not supporting endorsements. That's a powerful stance period. What this means, is they care only about the quality of their basses and guitars... NOTHING ELSE. If Artist want to go for endorsements contracts with other manufacturers, that's their business, and it means nothing to me. But if you just take a look at those companies who created packs with Artist, now the honest discussion quality become stifled and extremely political, and in some situations, the products are so bad, it's one hand covers the other. Even artist themselves look cheap. But, they are rich as hell, but their souls are short!!! There are people who sacrifice even lucrative contracts with inferior basses to keep their sound and quality as honest they could get. I always said Stanley Clarke is the most honest Bass Player I ever seen. I love his honesty (how can you not?) This guy could had made more money with Fender than anyone in history, but chosen quality over money. He stayed with a company who focused only on the quality of their products; while Stanley focused on his art. This is why Alembic is so special. This is why Stanley Clarke is too. What is also interesting, Stanley would later seek to make his own line of basses, and being the honest guy he is, "That Alembic bass is 'First String' instrument he uses as an extension of his soul." Not even Stanley basses could compete with Alembic quality. Stanley would never be caught, without an Alembic period. Not in my lifetime. Alembics are expensive? It takes 10 other basses, to have the satisfaction of one Alembic. Man, I have to pay for storing all that wood -- not me. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 03, 2009) | ||
| tbrannon
Senior Member Username: tbrannon Post Number: 1112 Registered: 11-2004 |
Nobody has dug up this thread yet... a couple more pictures of Alembic Jazz basses in there http://alembic.com/club/messages/402/29475.html?1152146122 | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 348 Registered: 5-2004 |
Toma ... Obviously you're VERY pro Alembic and I respect that but that doesn't mean all other brands are crap and deserve to be put down. They all offer something and thinking people who play something other than Alembic only play their "inferior" basses because they need the endorsement deal is ridiculous. And do you seriously think Mark King, John Entwistle and Stanley Clark got NOTHING from Alembic to put their NAME on their SIGNATURE basses? Basses BTW they NEVER EVER used with the stock "Signature" electronics as sold by the company? PLEASE!!!!!!!! Mark, John and Stanley ENDORSE (or endorsed) Alembic basses in return for something of value, some kind of payment. No different than people who endorse Fender basses. And endorsement is an endorsement. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 253 Registered: 9-2009 |
I believe we had this discussion before. I already know your position on issue. I believe you said Alembics are over priced right? Well, if everybody felt like you, Alembic could not exist. Yes, I am very pro-Alembic and with the true bassist like Stanley Clarke who wanted nothing but a quality bass, are you kidding me? By the way, Stanley Never asked for a tribute bass. Alembic honored Stanley's name by producing a SC bass and that was beautiful. Honoring a living legend is rare for any company, and there it is, somebody picks up an extraordinary object, and does extraordinary things. Alembic is that kind of company. So, just because you feel a Ferrari is too expensive and there are other cars to drive, get the other car. I will not look down on anyone who's doing what they want and needs to do. It's your money, and you have every right to justify how you spend or save it. Heck yeah, I am pro Alembic - How did you guess? See, I had made up my mind a long time ago. I don't need to play anymore games with myself as to what qualities of this and that bass. I have no time for this. When it comes to the best, and I worked my ass off for it, I buy it and it last almost forever, and it holds their value. I had it with games people play. I like to take this life up a few more notches when it comes to my basses. | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 349 Registered: 5-2004 |
Toma I'm not attacking you. I just don't think it's right to put down everything none Alembic and you tend to do that which is why we seem to butt heads occasionally. I honestly think all brands have something good to offer. ANYWHO we are not going to see eye to eye so I'm done feeding the fire and I am sorry if my views upset you in any way. This is my final response to this thread regardless of reply. Have a good day! | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 254 Registered: 9-2008 |
i agree with Raymond :-D, every brand has something to offer and must be given that opportunity to show the world that something, i honestly don't like the sound i get out of my Alembic P/J pickups, but i like sounds i've heard out of other Alembics on the net, meaning that as a personal experience, it hasn't been that great, but that doesn't mean i'm going to throw Alembic out of the window just because of that experience. ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 255 Registered: 9-2009 |
I can't honestly say or think something is good for me unless I buy it. Purchasing something other than an Alembic for me, at this time in my life is foolish. I was once like you. I said, there are other good basses out there... I said this before I owned my Alembics. But after I got the chance to buy one... I just smiled like I knew a big secret in life. Also, if you read anything I said, I don't knock anybody who feel like Alembic is not there thing. That is to them, and it's their beliefs. I absorbed all the "pro-alternative bass members..." However, when I jump in and support Alembic, my message is termed as "an argument" instead of a discussion. I told you I could make my Alembic sound like a cheaply made Fender. There's noting nonfactual about my statement. Fenders are cheaply made basses. Fender basses are crap in stock form. Everybody I know who plays them, upgraded their pickups and the electronic controls. Even doing this, it's still no Alembic. Maybe it works for them... cool. As for the Alembic with the Jazz look, that bass is a direct "Bulls Eye" of what Fender "wish" they could engineer. They can't because if they could, they'd would had done it by now. Also, they would lose market share because nobody truly pay 10K for a new Fender. They just don't have the reputation for making such a bass. There's no room for argument. It's pure silly dude. Also, this forum is called is called Alembic.com, and the chances are, you will run into Alembic zealot like myself for it's only natural I would exist. I played all the rest, now I have the best, and it's getting even better... By the way, just in case you didn't know it, I could had taken offense when you said Alembics are over priced. You made your statement with reverence and fortitude. So, I guess we are all fools to waste money right? We should be like you? There are all kinds of people here and with a diversity of backgrounds. I understand where you are coming from, but this topic of Alembic being too expensive is too juvenile for me to discuss. My father would always say: "The only a fool, settle for less when the best is right here or there..." And, I didn't settle... Take a look at the Toma_Hawk bass. Pure Alembic Badness. This bass represent the heart and soul of a design begging to be played, and played hard. Are you kidding, Me, look at another bass brand of bass with the same balance and scale as if they earned my respect? LOL!!!!! (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 03, 2009) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 761 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hal, I think everyone here appreciates your unwavering support for Alembic basses and the company in general. I think we all have similar sentiments or else we wouldn't be here. I own Fender, Gibson, Musicman, Rickenbacker, Godin, Martin, Guild, Peavey, Pedulla, Lakland, Ovation and Parker basses in addition to my Alembics. Each has their good and bad points - none of them is the "cat's meow" per se in my opinion. There are times that I turn to my Alembics, and there are times that I turn to another marque. I love all of them for many different reasons. My Alembics are the "crown jewels" of my collection - I've never played a better designed and built bass in 32 years as a bass player. This being said, there are times that I don't want a crown jewel. Sometimes I want that less than perfect Fender, or the one trick pony Guild. And that's cool - it's all about choices. No bass that I've played can do it all - not even an Alembic (although it comes very, very close). And I understand where you're coming from, believe me. I love my Alembics as you do, and I am as passionate about promoting them you are. This being said, I've always held that there are many other options bass-wise that are more appropriate than an Alembic for folks. And that's OK - I think the Alembic company would understand this, and indeed support it (if not necessarily like it for financial reasons!). One thing is certain - Alembics, I think, inspire both fierce loyalty and also a level of skepticism. We who understand what they can do become devotees for life. Others play them and give up - they're not your average off the shelf instrument. They demand that you learn how to use their unique (and IMHO ultimately very rewarding) qualities. And this is as it should be - let everyone discover that instrument that will bring them and others joy, be it a Fender, Gibson, Alembic or any other marque. I must say I'm looking forward to see how your bass comes out. It will be the bass of your dreams for sure. Best regards, Al | ||
| tbrannon
Senior Member Username: tbrannon Post Number: 1115 Registered: 11-2004 |
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| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 256 Registered: 9-2009 |
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| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 257 Registered: 9-2009 |
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| darkstar01
Intermediate Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 177 Registered: 6-2005 |
...right. so what's the deal with the alembic jazz basses anyway? it seems like they were all made around the same time. i wonder if they considered making them a regular model. | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 256 Registered: 9-2008 |
can we just close this thread? ~Taylor Watterson | ||
| darkstar01
Intermediate Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 178 Registered: 6-2005 |
+1, taylor. | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 258 Registered: 9-2009 |
Y'all can have those Fender looking Alembics. Honestly, The style is much too dated for me. That style of bass looks like the days when the bass stayed in their place - in the background That shape is 103 years old... Sorry, this is my last post here... I said enough. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 03, 2009) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 762 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hal, Jaco played a Fender Jazz Bass. Entwistle played Gibsons and Fenders before he found Alembics. Jack Bruce played a Gibson, and Chris Squire is renowned for his use of Rickenbackers. None of them "stayed in the background" using those basses. Just sayin'. Alan | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 2479 Registered: 10-2002 |
Here's another Fender player who rarely stays in the background ... in concert in London a couple of years ago....  Graeme | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 259 Registered: 9-2009 |
That's not a Fender Jazz. BTW, you can now buy a Fender at WalMart. http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10232420 It's a game for some people, but that's where a company like Fender goes... A continuous path of mediocrity. Another child becomes confused to someday learn that Fenders are cheap and crappy basses from a crappy company. Look around at any town's local businesses today, and you will see huge box companies like WalMart killing smaller business. Sorry fellas, I'll never support Fenders regardless who plays them. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| serialnumber12
Senior Member Username: serialnumber12 Post Number: 574 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hey Toma hawk Marcus miller is going to pluck some Feathers outta your Hat for that...LOL!!! | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 2481 Registered: 10-2002 |
It's still a fender and Stanley was really getting into playing it, and the point of posting the picture was to highlight the error in your earlier comment... "Stanley would never be caught, without an Alembic period. Not in my lifetime.". The whole point is that even died-in-the-wool alembic players like stanley sometimes like to play a different instrument to get a certain tone or feel. Graeme BTW, what about your previous comment..... "Sorry, this is my last post here... I said enough." ? ;-) | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 260 Registered: 9-2009 |
#12, This has nothing to do with anybody's personal preferences. Marcus Miller, Stanley, or whoever... Play what you can pay... I joined the "Alembic Club" not "The Fender Club". How can I make myself more clear here? Joining this site, represents my honest feeling about Alembic basses. I have no room to express any other basses with the same trust. It's just that simple. I don't play games with words. My Fender days are over. I did that already... We had this discussion before about Fenders, and if people want them, they are available just as fast as a McDonald's hamburger on a major highway. If you shop at Wal-Mart, they could be purchased there too. This is reality. All jokes aside. WalMart kills those one of a kind special gem companies like Alembic. Sorry, but if you want a cheap crappy bass at the cost of destroying Alembic, what kind of member are you? Just who do you think you are talking too? You're no friend of mine, I don't even know you!!! So, for those who support Fender's fine. I joined the Alembic Club and support the business with meaning and heart. I would hate to see Alembic have a "Going out of business sale" over BS crappy guitars attracting new generations of children down the throats of corporate titans business models. Those who fell to learn from history, are doomed for a repeat. There had been many people losing jobs and business because what is taking place. I believe, we can change this direction if we just start supporting local business. This topic is not just about guitars, it's bigger than that... Sorry if I offended anyone, but this is a very difficult topic in nature. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| 12stringwilson
Junior Username: 12stringwilson Post Number: 32 Registered: 12-2008 |
Yet again fellas...it would appear we are taking away from the value of the forum. "Just who do you think you are talking too? You're no friend of mine, I don't even know you!!!" This is the kind of crap that must be stopped. There is no need to take personal shots at anyone here....is there????? | ||
| goop
Member Username: goop Post Number: 72 Registered: 7-2008 |
I just read this entire thread...kinda like the car accident you can't look away from and I had to reply. I am with the concensus on this one. I love Rickenbackers for their sound and feel. They are a quality instrument that have their place in music history. I am not a fan of Fender myself, but I think they have their place as well. I think fenders are the most widely used and emulated basses. Was the Jazz not the very first electric bass? I think a greater respect is due here. Didn't JE comission Status to build the Buzzard? Doesn't Marcus tell Fender what he wants on his signature model? When Mark King has Status design a signature model, isn't it set up exactly how he wants it? If you are Rob Green, owner of Status and JE and MK are coming to you asking you to build unique basses for them, of course you are honoured and are thinking of giving it to them. I can't beleive they would expect, or accept these basses without paying. These relationships are no different from any other. They are based on respect. Paul McCartney did not use his free 4001 indefinitely because it was free. By the way, does marcus play the exact same Japanese made model that his name is on? I believe Geddy Lee does not. These artists are playing what they want, not what they are provided. Athletes get endorsements and are not necessarily playing with the exact equipment being sold to the public. I am pretty sure Fender is a more profitable business than Alembic. Each company have their niche. Hal, I agree with your words; "But to pit one bass against another is simply juvenile." BTW, the jazz bassed Alembic above is an outstanding looking instrument. Colin I think artists use | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 261 Registered: 9-2009 |
Wilson, Don't get caught up on the few words I wrote, read the entire message, please read my message in context. I don't think a great discussion takes everybody to agreement. Being different is human, and it serves humanity best. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| georgie_boy
Senior Member Username: georgie_boy Post Number: 988 Registered: 8-2005 |
Well said Brent!!! It's high time that this sort of talk was forbidden once and for all. Certain members are guilty, and they know who they are!....Hal just loves Alembic...end of story!!......but, a certain European member has been very insulting and rude of late. Whether an Alembic customer or not, we need to stop this now. Look how many people rarely post anymore, due to attacks from others, or just got plain fed up reading such crap!! To name a few; Whitecloud Rami Flax David Fung | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 262 Registered: 9-2009 |
For now on, if I see a Fender or Fender like supporting discussion, I will not join in... This is madness. Have a good day everybody. | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 2482 Registered: 10-2002 |
"For now on, if I see a Fender or Fender like supporting discussion, I will not join in... " This is indeed madness Hal. Why remove yourself from the discussion just because you don't like a product or someone has disagreed with you? An alternate viewpoint is always valuable; it would be a shame if we lost yours. Graeme | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 263 Registered: 9-2009 |
"Cat's meow" and perfect this, perfect that... "Marcus Miller... being upset..." Who cares what other basses you play or what professional Artist play? None of those guys pay my bills, nor have a impact on the music market place, nor the price of tea in China. The only thing that excites me are Alembics. If it's not an Alembic, I can personally care less what anybody thinks. Call me an whatever you want, but when it's all said and done, you will never see me with a Fender strapped around my neck. It's not that I have something against people who play with Fenders, it just I would look pathetic supporting them, knowing what I know about them. Ignorance may be bliss for some people, so if this is the case, I can't fault them. But for me, knowing what I know, and from my own experiences, I wouldn't be able to look at myself if I crossed the line. Frankly speaking, Fenders are not even a challenge, nor can I express of having "one" isolated nerve being tempted. You play what you want; eat what you want; drink what you want. However, this is my vessel and Soul I was honored to protect, and Alembic basses are the best there is... Everything else, is secondary. I try real hard (very hard) to practice what I preach. This site is about Alembic guitars and basses (So I thought...) but if this site is about Fenders too, show me the fine print. Excuse me, if I am wrong, but if this site is about Fenders, then I am with the wrong site. If this is true, then will somebody please help me locate where "The Real Alembic site is located, with "The Real Alembic Supporters". I am not interested in discussing anything Fender. So please, will somebody help me please find The Real Alembic website if this is not the correct location!!! I am not perfect, so if this is a Fender site, please forgive me for thinking I was supporting Alembic, when Fender supporters dominate this forum. No more Fenders or "Fender like objects," I am going crazy!!! (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 581 Registered: 10-2006 |
"Was the Jazz not the very first electric bass?" No - the 1935 Audiovox was the first electric bass guitar. The Fender Precision was the first mass produced one, introduced in 1951. By the time the Jazz came out in 1960, it was also preceded by Rickenbacker 4000 (1957) the Gibson EB-1 ('53), EB-2 ('58) & EB-0 ('59), the Höfner 500/1 ('56), and no doubt several I'm missing. Peter | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 470 Registered: 5-2009 |
Perhaps then one can surmise that the" Fender Bass" was designed as the Bass for the" Proletariat". Leo Fender wanted ANYBODY and everybody to be able to afford a Bass or Guitar. I think that that was the original design parameter. | ||
| goop
Member Username: goop Post Number: 73 Registered: 7-2008 |
Peter, thanks for the clarification. I did confuse the precision with the jazz. I thought I had read the precision was the first electric bass and I am shocked to hear there was an electric bass design in the 30's. I thought Les Paul invented the electric guitar in the late 40's/early 50's and that the electric bass followed shorty thereafter. I am going to have to look the audiovox up. Colin | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1751 Registered: 6-2002 |
Hmmm, at the risk of re-focussing this thread..... "Just seen this on the UK American Guitar web site. (UK Alembic Distributor) http://www.americanguitarsuk.com/bassshop/alembicB.php A lovely Jazz bass.....!!! I'm guessing it's based on the Elan, ( Vol, Pan, Filter & Q-switch and maple body), but with an Orion headstock. Now wouldn't it be good to hear Marcus play one of those. Jazzyvee" I thought that was a pretty innocent start to a thread. Jazzyvee | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 1752 Registered: 6-2002 |
I would never have thought that an innocent post could get heated like this. It's quite sad that over this year there have been so many conflicts on the threads. I actually would prefer it didn't escalate to the point where people don't want to take part in the forum.I know for a fact that I have learnt more in the past few years about basses, constuction, sound, playability, design, choice of amps, cabs etc than I think I would have found had i not joined and bought an Alembic. I personally love alembics to me they enable me to get a sound I love. They feel and play and most importantly don't try to sound like anyone else's basses and I love that about them. I have no "need" to buy any other basses because I don't gig enough to discover that I may require a radically different sound on stage than what I get now with my alembics. I only really started gigging as a bass player once I got my SC about 7 years ago, so never went through loads of other manufacturers basses. That is not to say I don't like the sound of other basses and I freely admit I'm no expert on basses. That said, if I'm listening to a band live or on record and there is a good bass sound coming off, I don't care what the bass is. In fact apart from Clarkee, the most interesting bass tones I've heard live is that of James Genus from his concert with Herbie Hancock with a Fodera Bass and Jimmy Johnson when I heard him with Allan Holdsworth a few years back. (I've never seen Marcus Live). I'm sure most of the music that we have grown up listening to to, loved, learnt to play was not made with an Alembic bass. I think there is a place for all basses, maybe not in the collection of some of the posters here but If I had more spare cash I'd have added that Alembic Jazz bass to my collection and maybe investigate a Ritter and Fodera. FWIW, my favourite band "The Wailers" aka Bob Marley & The Wailers, Peter Tosh, Bunny Wailer basslines were played on Fender basses and no-one can tell me in complete honesty that those bands don't have a quality bass sound. In recent years Aston Barrett has used an Alembic Elan bass on occasions. Jazzyvee Over and Out. :-) | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 582 Registered: 10-2006 |
I don't think we can surmise that, Wolf. According to Tony Bacon's Six Decades Of The Fender Telecaster a 1951 Broadcaster (the original name of the Tele) was $169.95; a Gibson ES-175 was $175. He calculates that to be in the range of $1350, 2005 value. I would have to assume that the P-Bass was similarly priced. They weren't cheap instruments. Colin, the first production electric guitar was the 1932 Rickenbacker. Les was fiddling around with it by the 40s, but his signature model followed the first Fender "Spanish"* guitar (the 1950 Esquire) by 2 years (and there is disagreement among the parties involved as to how much of the design was actually his), but Gibson had already been making hollow-bodied electrics, starting with the ES-150, since 1936. *"Spanish" (the S in the Gibson ES models) is also called "Standard" - held parallel to the torso & fretted (that's the verb, not the adjective). Leo was making electric "Hawaiian" guitars - lap steels - by 1945; others preceded him. Peter (Message edited by cozmik_cowboy on November 04, 2009) | ||
| chrisalembic
Member Username: chrisalembic Post Number: 86 Registered: 3-2009 |
I have read this thread, and in a way I didnt want to say anything to make things worse. But there is one thing that i constantly think in those gear (alembic vs. fender vs. whatever) converstaions. And thats what Jazzyvee just said.. thanks brother!! At the end of the day, when all gear talk is done.. its about the Music and lets dont forget that. When I hear J. Johnson, M. Miller, A. Jackson I dont hear Alembic, Fender or Fodera. I hear notes, grooves, melodies,.. I hear music. Seriously, in the end who cares about what bass they play, if they can work with it, to get their musical ideas across. Its about the music. Thats all. And if any of my favorite bass players chooses to play a different bass, that should not make them a lesser player in my eyes. I personally strive to be the best musician I can be, and not being able to affort an alembic at the moment is not going to put me off track from that in any way. | ||
| jbybj
Advanced Member Username: jbybj Post Number: 242 Registered: 6-2006 |
"Sorry, this is my last post here... I said enough." From your lips to God's ears................ | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 264 Registered: 9-2009 |
When it comes to the bass, the bass is a very serious discussion for Funk. There is no instrument that is more important than a Funky Bass. Personally, I don't consider anyone is a good bassist unless they can play some funk. Fingering techniques and playing, are only half of the story... Anyway, here a list of bands I listen to as a teenager. Many of these artist are no longer together, but thank GOD for You-Tube. Funk bands! Cameo, Barkays, Bootsy, Con funk shun, Slave, George Clinton _Parliament Funk-A-Deleics, The Isley Brothers, The Chamber Brothers, Brick, Donald Byrd and the Black Birds, Maze, Prince, Brother's Johnson, Sly Stone, Larry Graham, The Commodores, Kool & the Gang, Johnny Guitar Watson, Earth Wind & Fire, Ohio Players, Rick James, Sheryl Lynn, Patrice Rushin, George Duke, Heat Wave, James Brown, SOS Band, Mary Jane Girls, Taste of Honey, Rufus Featuring Chaka Chan, The Time, Nona Hendrix, Tina Marie, Tom Brown, Lenny White (Marcus Miller) LakeSide, Dazzband, Zapp-Roger, Average White Band, Herby Hancock and the Head Hunters, Gap Band, Red Hot Chili Peppers... Although I understand that Alembic were not used with some of the music, but if you listened to any of the groups I mentioned above, and played the same FUNK riffs with an Alembic bass, it sounds fuller and dam right better. The Funk is all about the bass! (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 471 Registered: 5-2009 |
LOL , ok let us not forget ROCCO PRESTIA !!!!! (Tower of Power) I think he was a "Fender" guy in the beginning . I don't know what Bass he plays now . FUNK !!! I like that kind of FUNK the best !!!!! | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 265 Registered: 9-2009 |
Latin, Brazilian, and Arabian Funk is where I am leaning toward these days. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 04, 2009) | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 472 Registered: 5-2009 |
Oh yes , I agree Hal, I think it is always a good thing when one encourages diversity in ones listening and performing influences. As FUNK goes around the world it is mutating into many different kinds of shapes and sounds. Check out http://funkdubdivision.com we have a featured Punjabi rapper. I play Trumpet and Mellophone on the last CD release and on the next one to be released soon I will also be on fretless and fretted Bass.Cds are available at Amoeba and other fine stores and also at http://cdbaby.com. To be forewarned , this stuff is not for everybody many might not like it . I was just hired as a sideman but I do have some co -writing credits on some of the tunes . | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 266 Registered: 9-2009 |
That's Funky Wolf! This is such a joyful sound. Thank man, this made this thread, much better. Music like yours is healing. | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 473 Registered: 5-2009 |
Thanks Hal. I am glad that you like it . | ||
| goop
Member Username: goop Post Number: 74 Registered: 7-2008 |
Wolf, I checked it out and like is so much I think I have to buy it. Thanks. I love all things funk and particularly this kind of new age exploration into new musical fronteirs. To me, this kind of thing started with Acid Jazz in the early 90's. You likely know about DJ Greyboy and another local act to you, the fabulous Junk. I also enjoy Canada's own Bullfrog (a.k.a Mark Robertson), The New Deal and Jazz Pharmacy, discovered through the Mo Funk label. Thanks man. Turn me onto more, please. Colin P.S. Jazzyvee, if it wasn't for your post of the lovely Jazz Alembic, I never would have heard these new sounds. You never know where circumstances will lead you. You should start another thread today. God I love music. | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 474 Registered: 5-2009 |
Thanks Colin ! I am so very pleased that you feel that my post number 472 is having this kind of positive response. Wolf . | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 268 Registered: 9-2009 |
We all must pay our respects to Larry Graham!!! Larry invented Slapping, Thumping, and Popping. Point Blank -- Larry invented the Funk Bass Sound! Stanley, Mark, Victor, and Marcus should be thanking GOD, for Larry Graham. I thank GOD for Larry Graham too. The best things in life don't have PATENTS, or COPYRIGHTS. (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 05, 2009) | ||
| otis
Member Username: otis Post Number: 87 Registered: 10-2008 |
Here's some funk of a different flavor: www.myspace.com/otiserie Check out the video for "Five Ton Mary" Peace;) Frank | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 270 Registered: 9-2009 |
Frank, don't hurt them, don't hurt em!!! Your bass sounds SLAMMIN! | ||
| toma_hawk01
Advanced Member Username: toma_hawk01 Post Number: 272 Registered: 9-2009 |
The first time I heard a bass being strummed... (Before I even heard of Stanley Clarke...) Straight 70's Funk (1975)! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKI_jx1OO2I (Message edited by toma_hawk01 on November 05, 2009) |
