| Author | Message | ||
| rv_bass
New Username: rv_bass Post Number: 2 Registered: 8-2014 |
Hi, I have a Guild Starfire I (recent reissue) and I'm thinking of installing two Fat Boy pickups and Europa electronics. I love the sound of the Starfire, and with Pyramid Gold flatwounds I can get a sound reminiscent an acoustic bass. I like the bisonic sound, but the G string is a little too bright and crisp, and adjusting for it with the amp (Eden WT550) alters the tones of the other strings too much. I'm thinking the Fat Boys for the robust low end and softer high end, and the Europa electronics to keep it simple, but still have some options for tone shaping as needed. I'd be interested in feedback on this proposed set up. I use this bass specifically for Jazz. Thanks, Rob | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 3934 Registered: 5-2009 |
One word " Excellent " | ||
| edwin
Senior Member Username: edwin Post Number: 1930 Registered: 5-2002 |
I have Series II pickups and electronics in my Starfire (you can hear it here: http://alembic.com/club/messages/449/206554.html?1423839784 and there are pictures elsewhere on the site) and my guess is your plan would be great. Maybe get a stereo output and then tilt the pickups with one favoring the high strings and the other favoring the low and then you can EQ them differently. Check out the build thread for Keith's Starfire, too. I'm now thinking about getting Alembic pickups and electronics for my Modulus. Alembic setups spoil you. | ||
| 5a_quilt_top
Senior Member Username: 5a_quilt_top Post Number: 450 Registered: 6-2012 |
+ 1 on both. The Europa electronics are very intuitive and easy to navigate when playing live. Word of caution, you may find the Fat Boy in the bass (neck) position to be a little too prominent. I use an FB in the treble (bridge) position only and, for me, it balances nicely with the standard Alembic bass (neck) PU. I never have a problem getting lows out of my Alembics, but when I emphasize the treble position, I find the standard PU to be a little thin. YMMV. | ||
| rv_bass
New Username: rv_bass Post Number: 3 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks to both of you for the feedback, good food for thought! I will look into all of this further. Edwin, your bass sounds amazing, fine playing as well! Your band gave fine treatment to a beautiful tune! Thanks, Rob | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 3935 Registered: 5-2009 |
Here are two more ! I sold the Maple but kept the Mahogany . http://alembic.com/club/messages/411/2792.html?1262960781 http://alembic.com/club/messages/411/84774.html?1282495288 | ||
| rv_bass
New Username: rv_bass Post Number: 4 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks, Sonicus. I noticed that one of your basses as well as Keith's recent build have trapezoid pickups . Can you tell me what characteristics those pickups have? Thanks, Rob | ||
| edwin
Senior Member Username: edwin Post Number: 1935 Registered: 5-2002 |
My bass has trapezoidal structures in the rectangular shells as well. I don't notice a huge difference between them and traditionally shaped pickups, but they are the only Alembic pickups I've had in this bass. Mine have the wide end under the E string. | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 3943 Registered: 5-2009 |
Hello Rob . Your Europa or Activator type cuicuit is a different animal and will cost you a bit less to install . You might want to inquire about an Activator fit for your bass as well . I sold that Starfire in 1978 , that would be 37 years ago.Those pickups are even older then that dating to some of Alembics very early designs. Those pickups used hum cancelers that were inside the body of the bass ( you can see them in the pics in the links ) At this time Series I/II use's a hum canceler configuration but with low pass filters and Cue switches on the Series I and CVQ on the Series II . The original Alembic electronics circuit in that bass did not have filters but buffer preamps and passive tone controls instead. Your question asks for characteristics and because of my technical background I want to give you a very technical answer as to the exact NUMBERS as far as engineering data in finite measurement terminology. Is that what you would like to know ? It has been so long ago and I know far more now then I did then as far as how to answer your question. Back when I had that bass I was an audio engineering student at " The College for Recording Arts at Golden State Recorders. The recording studio owner and my teacher and mentor was Mr. Leo De Gar Kulka and I took the bass into the studio there where he was fascinated by it. He commented thus ; What a wonderfull full spectrum sound your bass provides ! . _______Quite certainly today's Alembic products can give you that and even more without any RF-EMF noise . The earliest Alembic cuircuits sounded awesome as far as frequency response and dynamic range and clarity compared to anything alse available but were a just a little more interferance sensitive then what can be provided at this time. I have a Bass with a PF-5 example as well as with the new version Series cuircuit. Both are wonderful but the newer very quiet. | ||
| rv_bass
New Username: rv_bass Post Number: 5 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks, Edwin for your update, and thanks Sonicus for your comments as well. I'm not familiar with electrical engineering, so a technical explanation would go over my head. I was just curious about tonal quality. I appreciate all of the feedback, and I think for now I'm leaning towards my original idea of Fat Boys with Europa electronics. I think that will get me what I'm aiming for in tone and functionality. Thanks again, Rob | ||
| moonliner
Advanced Member Username: moonliner Post Number: 310 Registered: 12-2004 |
I highly recommend putting Alembic pickups in your Starfire. The combo of hollow body warmth and thump with Alembics powerful, clean, even, and crisp tone is quite amazing. Especially with flatwounds. The trapezoid pickups in my starfire have regular magnets in them, so they are trapezoid in appearance only. At the moment Alembic doesn't offer that shape of magnet. The entire bass was a tribute to the early days of Alembic, so I wanted that shape, whether the magnets were that shape or not. | ||
| rv_bass
New Username: rv_bass Post Number: 7 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks, Moonliner, I saw your bass on the Build page, beautiful and I'm sure it is a dream to play! After hearing what you all have said, I'm going to see if I can get the alembic pickups installed in my Starfire. Thanks! Rob | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 14 Registered: 8-2014 |
I had a very nice talk with Mica yesterday, the wheel is turning... | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 27 Registered: 8-2014 |
Hello Everyone, Just wanted your opinions on pickup pan vs. individual volume controls. I have an Orion bass with pan control, which works nicely, but I haven't used a bass with the individual pickup volume/Q-switch set up. Do you find a major advantage over pan control with a single volume? Thanks, Rob | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 4493 Registered: 6-2002 |
Here is a good thread to read which discusses this very situation. http://alembic.com/club/messages/393/12728.html?1095692060 For guitar I find that most of my tone changes are gained by switching pickups and so for that I find a single volume to be most suited to my needs. For bass, which is the point of your thread. I have both of the options you are considering and whilst at first I preferred the pan pot, now I would actually prefer individual volume for each pickup plus a master volume. That way when I have found a tone that I want to stick with I can just lower the overall instrument volume with out affecting the ratio of one pickup to another. Trying to tweak the individual volumes by and equal amount to keep the tone can be a bit tricky until it becomes second nature. But I'd go with a master volume also. | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 28 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks, Jazzyvee, good advice. I read through the post link that you provided, seems it might come down to personal preference as to which one to go with. I might explore the two volume with master option. I have used the two volume option for guitar as well, so it's not too foriegn to me. I also like the thought of having a Q-switch for each pickup as well, that could expand the tonal options...so much for keeping it simple! | ||
| adriaan
Moderator Username: adriaan Post Number: 3237 Registered: 6-2002 |
The Q switches go with the filter, not with the pickup. So you'll have 2 filters with Q switches (3-way is thoroughly recommended), 2 volumes and a master volume. Soinds like a plan! | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 4162 Registered: 5-2009 |
I like the Master Volume knob ! ___I think that is a good plan as well. Since the signal will be able to output from the instrument via standard 1/4 " TS (tip sleeve) ,WHY NOT wire it to be powered externally with the extra positive ring from a TRS( tip,ring,sleeve) plug instead using the sleeve as common ground and the signal hot either tip or ring and the 9 volts DC either tip or ring. ( it would be decision of the final designer wiring it to pick Tip or Ring for the DC power) Will that work ? That way there might not be a need to cut a place for a battery on the instrument OR cut open the back at all. An external battery pack or filtered power source would be at the opposite side of the TRS cord both powering the bass and routing out the audio output. Just thinking ! Wolf | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 31 Registered: 8-2014 |
Adriaan, thanks for the clarification. I like the 3-way Q as well, I have one on my Orion and like the versatility it provides. I agree with you and Wolf, a master volume is needed! Wolf, thanks for your thoughts, the outside power source is a nice idea and something I will discuss with the folks at Alembic as we work through the details. Rob | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 4241 Registered: 5-2009 |
Rob, I look forward to watching the process of this project. In the hands of the experianced and high level of craftsmanship @ Alembic everything will turn into "Gold" ! & Magic ! Wolf | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 40 Registered: 8-2014 |
I had another great conversation with Mica this evening and we worked out the details. I'm going with Anniversary electronics with master volume, 3-way Qs and a couple other details. Wolf, I am on the Golden Road! It's in the queue and I can't stop smiling!! Thanks, Mica! | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 4295 Registered: 5-2009 |
Rob, I think that those are all wise choices. I look forward to the resulting instrument . The "Golden Road " is surely an exciting adventure. Wolf | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 41 Registered: 8-2014 |
I stopped by the Mother Ship between Santa Clara shows this weekend, and Mica was gracious enough to take time out of her weekend to show me around. I was thrilled to be walking through the space where it all happens, and learning about how it all comes together, and was able to try out a couple different bass models in front of the infamous couch and painting, fantastic! I saw my bass on the wall waiting patiently in line, FTC page to follow. Thanks Mica! | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 11824 Registered: 5-2002 |
Congrats on getting started Robert! | ||
| hieronymous
Senior Member Username: hieronymous Post Number: 1536 Registered: 1-2005 |
You are so psyched! I think Anniversary sounds great - that's what my Stanley Clarke has, I couldn't be happier. Awesome that you got a tour too - you didn't happen to see a red Guild M-85 in the queue by any chance?  | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 45 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks hieronymous! Yes, very psyched and looking forward to the learning curve with the Anniversary set up. I think I recall seeing the M-85, but I'm not sure exactly where, there are a lot of instruments all over that shop! | ||
| rv_bass
Junior Username: rv_bass Post Number: 50 Registered: 8-2014 |
Thanks, Dave, I can't wait to hear how it sounds! | ||
| rv_bass
Member Username: rv_bass Post Number: 69 Registered: 8-2014 |
Hi Mica, Just wondering if you might have a photo or two to ease the anticipation! Thanks, Rob | ||
| rv_bass
Intermediate Member Username: rv_bass Post Number: 174 Registered: 8-2014 |
Back plate installed, pickup rings created, pickup position determined, routing to begin soon...yeeha!  |
