| Author | Message | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 67 Registered: 8-2005 |
Ok I've been mullin over the thousands of combinations and possiblities known to Alembic in my head. Alembic's countless possiblities make this process really hard. Add to that the pressure of the price increase! :D Anyway here's what I've come up with and I'm curious to hear what the seasoned custom veterans think. It's going to be a fretless 5 string, tuned EADGC. Model: Orion - I figure the set neck will be suitable for that nice throaty growl so desirable for fretless basses. Neck: Maple with 1 ebony lam in the center and 2 purpleheart lams for the other two. The ebony should bring some of that fundamental sustain (I'm hoping it still has the same effect on the set neck), and the purpleheart accents will keep cost and weight down, as well as add some brilliance to the sound. I thought about 1 ebony and 2 vermillion lams when I was considering a neck-through, thinking the vermillion would bring some warmth. But the set neck should take care of that. What do you think? Body: Mahogany with Macassar Ebony top (that I'm providing - I was lucky to score some killer stuff) with purpleheart accent in between framed by maple pinstripes on either side. Mahogany is great for true even tone, and I like the strong lows and definitive highs of the real dense woods like ebony. Electronics: Europa. I had planned on this package regardless of which model I went for. The only change here will be a 3 position Q. I'd like to have a more subtle option than the std. 0/8db. Something like 0/4/8 or maybe even 0/3/6. I'll also be adding the sustain block. Those are the vitals. There are a few other options but they are costmetic (plating, etc). What do you guys think? My main concerns are neck construction (set vs. through) and neck composition (laminates). Any advice would be great! Thanks in advance. Dave | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 749 Registered: 11-2002 |
The easy parts first... - fretless: excellent choice :-) - sustain block: yes - Europa electronics are great. Since you used the word "subtle", I would strongly recommend the 0/3/6 option (if it were me, I'd even consider 0/2/4, but then I'm a really subtle kind of guy). - body sounds (and should look) great. After that, I think maybe the key question is whether you are certain you will always keep it as EADGC. If so, then the rest of your choices would probably be fine, but if you have even the slightest inkling you might someday switch it down a string, then I would nix the set neck. With the right strings, setup, technique, etc, you won't have any trouble getting plenty of growl out of a neck-through. Set necks can certainly be great, but in some ways, it's a little like having a permanent, built-in filter. If you're sure that's what you want, that's fine, but to me, fretless does not scream for a set neck, in fact just the opposite. Looking at the rest of your choices, favoring sustain and great tone quality, the set neck just doesn't seem to fit. But that's just me, and I don't understand enough about what you play or how you want to sound. -Bob | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 68 Registered: 8-2005 |
Bob, Thanks for your input. Interesting point you make about the set neck acting as a permanent filter. I hadn't thought of it that way but I can see what you mean. So, if I keep basically the same spec but make it a Europa 5, what do you think of the neck lams? I read somewhere on here that vermillion is something like mahogany but maybe a little brighter. That might be a nice wood to put into the neck for some warmth. They're actually building a fretless Rogue with a mahogany/vermillion/ebony neck. I do want to keep the maple in there though cause I like the brightness. Yeah I'm thinking 0/3/6 will be a good Q setup for me. I don't tend to EQ heavily. In fact on my amp I rarely boost or cut any more than the 3-5 range. If I have to do more than that it probably means I don't like the natural sound of the bass. Yes it will always be EADGC or some altered tuning variation, but based on those string gauges. I play mainly rock and jazz type stuff. Some day I want to have a go at solo bass, but I'm not quite there yet. Dave | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 750 Registered: 11-2002 |
I don't think that anyone has ever felt it was a mistake to add 1 ebony and 2 purplehearts to a maple neck (and in your case, I don't think I would go for more than one ebony). I agree it would be wise to keep some maple in there, for both brightness and clarity, either of which you can tone done when you want to. As for throwing some mahogany and/or vermillion into the mix, I can't really offer an opinion, but I'm sure others will. Good luck. -Bob | ||
| keith_h
Senior Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 621 Registered: 2-2005 |
Dave, I can't speak to the neck laminates effect on a set neck but I suspect someone at Alembic can give you reliable information in this area. To go the opposite way from Bob. With my fretless I went with a set neck and ash body on purpose. I was looking for the strong mid-range growl that is inherent in this combination. I think my expectations were met very well. I did plan on a bridge block but it somehow got lost in my final features list. I don't know if this would have changed the tone or just enhanced the sustain. If I had to do things over I would probably add it in. I think your choice of electronics is great. I really like the Europa electronics especially from a live performance perspective. They are versatile yet straight forward as to functions and repeatable settings. 3-way Q switches are something I would like to add to my basses. Good Luck. Keith | ||
| alembic_doctor
Member Username: alembic_doctor Post Number: 93 Registered: 8-2002 |
I don't know about the combination of woods. But for me personally, I find that a Pao Ferro (did I spell that right) fingerboard is just the most awesome thing for mid range growl. (slide trombone)Maybe Mica or Valentino could weigh in on the subject. I had them turn my Essence into a fretlesss a few years ago. Mahogany Body, Maple Top, Pao Ferro Fingerboard. Now, One wierd thing did happen. The tone that I used to have to go to the bridge PU for is now coming out of the neck PU. Go Figure. Mica told me that it was the combination of the woods. Going from the Ebony to the PF. | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 70 Registered: 8-2005 |
Just got off the phone with Susan and she did say she really likes vermillion in the neck for a fretless. So it will be a variation of the "Valentino neck." Maple with center ebony lam and two vermillion lams. I'm having her do a quote as a Europa. I think the neck-through will be the way to go for me. I tend to like the open sound it produces and it's probably easier to dial in some growl with the electronics than it would be to dial it out if I wanted to on the set neck. Keep the feedback comin! Thanks guys. Dave | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 751 Registered: 11-2002 |
My guess is that Susan offered a little more detail about why she really likes vermillion for a fretless - can you elaborate for us? | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 71 Registered: 8-2005 |
She said the vermillion would be warmer sounding than purpleheart. They are an even exchange for purpleheart btw. They're also building a neck similar on the Jarrah burl Rogue in the wood bank. That one has mahogany. Mine will have maple for the brightness. | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 240 Registered: 9-2005 |
Hey bassjigga!!! So you're thinking about getting your order in before the price increase, huh? Sounds like a good idea! I hope you go for it!!! If you do, we might become bass brothers! I just got my order in December 1st -and I've also spec'ed vermillion in my neck! If you get your order in the pipeline soon, next to mine, they might well "stone two birds with one joint" and do our two relatively unusual necks together at the same time!!! If you order soon, we'll probably be having our masterpieces hitting the FTC threads about the same time!!! It also seems like our basses will be very similar, because not only will we have the commonality of ebony, vermillion, and maple in our necks, but also of Europa electronics with a 3-position Q. Since my bass' Q function goes 0/4/8/12, I can tell you that you should be very happy with a 0/4/8 setup. As even my lowest Q setting is noticeable, I'm sure that 0/3/6 would also be adequate for you, while predictably being "more subtle." I also agree you'd be much better off with a neck-thru. While I respect the Alembic set-necks, and would never knock anyone for having one, the neck-thrus are clearly superior -IMO. If you're gonna get an Alembic, you should pay the difference and get a neck-thru. If you run a quote with a 5-string fretless Essence with Europa electronics, and factor in the additional cost of 1 ebony laminate and 2 purpleheart/vermillion laminates, and then subtract 25% -the maximum dealer discount- it's actually not too bad! I'm crossing my fingers that the monthly special will be 5 strings for the price of 4, or something else you can use! Yeah, that Rogue is really something!!! The vermillion in the neck, and the neck woods of "Scott's Quilted Coco Bolo Custom -in the FTC thread- pushed me over the edge and into having my unique 5-wood, 11-laminate neck. The vermillion looks awesome. See, there's gonna be a really cool pattern in my neck. Between the 2 outer mahogany laminates of the neck, there will be 3 sections of 3 laminates... in the middle, an ebony laminate sandwiched within vermillion; and to either side, a maple laminate sandwiched within purpleheart. It should look AND sound awesome. I hope you go for it, and if so, I'll look forward to watching it's progress. Have you considered scale length? If you're certain about the EADGC, and that you'll not ever switch it to BEADG, you should consider a medium or even short scale... they're famous for it, and it would certainly be easier to play. Are you going for totally fretless, or "ghost frets" or sidelines? Go for it, bassjigga! | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 72 Registered: 8-2005 |
8 string king, I'm tryin... it's going to be pretty expensive. Granted probably not as much as yours, but there are a few more features than I listed such as bookmatch to center, wood truss rod cover, chrome plating. Those all add a lot too. I only listed the specs that influence the sound since that's what I needed the feedback on. Yeah I think the Q will certainly either be 0/3/6 or 0/4/8. Since it's one of the last things that go in I have a little time to decide that. I also want to have one installed in my Essence so if I get that in soon I can experiment and make a little more educated decision. My only concern on the scale is that all my other basses are 34" and I don't know if I want to transition between different lengths - especially with a fretless. If it were fretted it wouldn't be as big of a deal. The board will be blank, and I've asked Susan for sort of a custom sidelines/dots thing on the side. I want to have the dots in the right spot (on the note as if it were totally unlined) cause I know having dots off position will mess up my head. Then in between the dots I want to do the sidelines. So it'd be like sidelines, except everywhere there is a dot, the dot would take the place of the line. I haven't heard back on this one yet but I don't think it should be too hard to do. Yeah I see your neck has just about everything! Should be cool. Just a thought from the aesthetic point of view... did you consider separating the mahogany/purpleheart and purpleheart/vermillion with a maple pinstripe? Might be a nice touch since those woods are close in color. Dave | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 75 Registered: 8-2005 |
It's gettin dangerously close... Here's where it's at: Europa 5 (EADGC) 34" 1 ebony neck lam (center) and 2 vermillion neck lams Fretless ebony board with side dots at the normal 3/5/7/9/12 with sidelines in between. Silver side dots Orion 3 + 2 head Macassar ebony top Bookmatch to center Silver logo Wood truss rod cover Chrome plated hardware 3 position Q - 0/3/6. dave | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 765 Registered: 11-2002 |
String spacing? | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 242 Registered: 9-2005 |
Hi bassjigga! Thanks for your idea/suggestion about the maple pinstripe laminates -but it's not what I have in mind. As far as your bass goes, I'm glad to hear you're close to deciding. What monthly special would you be locked into, last months, or this months? I ask because I see you've spec'd a silver logo -and this months special is the inlaid logo & 1/2 off on side LEDs. I assume you'd want to take advantage of this (at least, the inlaid logo). Also -just out of curiousity- what's the point of the silver side dots instead of the aluminum? It's a lot more money... and the dot's on my non-LED Alembic were so small that I probably couldn't tell the difference... Nervous? I know I was (and still am -since it'll take me some time to pay off)! | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 76 Registered: 8-2005 |
Comfort/wide spacing. I thought the silver dots might be a little easier to see. I also asked about making them slightly larger cause you're right - they are very small on my essence. I haven't heard back on that though. I'll be using free plating special. Definitely nervous... a lot of money. | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 78 Registered: 8-2005 |
Change to Aluminum side dots. They will also be a larger wire. Also changed the accent laminate in the body to vermillion framed by maple pinstripes to correlate with the neck. | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 82 Registered: 8-2005 |
The deposit is in! Woo hoo! | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 260 Registered: 9-2005 |
Congrats, bassjigga, that's awesome! I'll really look forward to seeing your bass in the FTC threads. Ebony is one of my favorite woods for a top, visually. Have you seen club member Rami's Ebony Alembics? Awesome would be an understatement. "Rio" in the custom archives is another fine one. I'll look forward to seeing what yours looks like. I'm also a big fan of BTC -my custom's gonna have the front&rear Coco Bolo BTC -which'll maximize the Coco Bolo sound. I'm really looking forward to the Vermillion and Mahogany in the neck. By all accounts, it'll add tremendous warmth, richness and depth to the sound -and really work well with and enhance the Coco Bolo laminates, and the Ebony and Maple laminates in the neck. And (as you know) they say Vermillion works really well with fretless. You'll love the Ebony in the neck... I can tell you that from experience! I'm a little curious to hear the affect of just one laminate. Mica told me that just one will provide 60-80% of... well, actually she didn't specify, but I assume the reference would be alternating Maple/Ebony laminates. We're gonna have us a pair of pretty bitchin' basses! Woo Hoo!!! (Message edited by the 8 string king on December 21, 2006) | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 86 Registered: 8-2005 |
8sk, Yeah I'm lookin forward to checkin yours out on the FTC too. It's going to be pretty interesting. My top is going to be killer. Perhaps the only thing which will calm the wait is knowing I have to finish paying for it when it's done! haha Dave | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 261 Registered: 9-2005 |
I hear ya! Frankly, it's killing me. But there's never a good time... but there are WORSE times. I waited for the right special, and put in my quote when the "pick a special" special came along -initially thinking to use it for free Coco Bolo. But Valentino was good enough to point out that'd I'd save even more with the "15% off standard price before custom features". Then, with the maximum dealer discount of 25%, I ended up paying 60% of retail -50% of what the retail would be if I waited til next month to order! | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 87 Registered: 8-2005 |
Yeah mine would definitely cost a good bit more in 2007. Besides the baseline increase, certain other options like bookmatch to center (which affects us both) are going up too. I also though - who knows if the special I would want would have come up in like January or February and then I wouldn't really have saved any time and just paid more. Another advantage to using just 1 ebony lam (besides the cost) is it keeps the weight down. Can't wait to hit the FTC. | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 262 Registered: 9-2005 |
Yeah, I can't wait for the FTC either. When I placed the order on December 1st, I asked about it, telling Valentino I assumed it would be a month or two before they start; he said it COULD start as early as a month... but I'm figuring they probably won't start until Jan or Feb at the earliest. I'm guessing that our necks will be the first thing we see, since they're unique/custom, and since that's where they begin anyway. One of these days... of of these days we'll see our names on the FTC threads! I can't wait. Have you seen the beveled pegheads? If you go to FTC and check out "Rory's Balance K", you'll see an example. Boy, does this look sharp -and it only costs an additional $250 retail. I might add this to my specs -depending on how I'm doing paying it off as/when they begin construction. I look forward to seeing your BTC Ebony Europa beauty! |
