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funkyjazzjunky
Senior Member
Username: funkyjazzjunky

Post Number: 794
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Wednesday, July 25, 2012 - 12:09 pm:   Edit Post

Why do so many young bass players think they have to slap, pop, and/snap the strings on every note? A young man with a fine Fodera bass which had an excellent warm tone when I fooled around with it. Then he just pounded it during his band's set, to the point that it was annoying. I slap for effect but I want people to hear the tone of my bass (Whether anyone wants to hear me play bass is another question).

Vann-Di

(Message edited by FunkyJazzJunky on July 25, 2012)
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 324
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Wednesday, July 25, 2012 - 12:17 pm:   Edit Post

It is a matter of "Taste" versus "Sport Plucking" (disguised pun intentional) "Young" can mean age or lack of experience. Perhaps some insecurity on the "young" player drives them to pound away. On another thread, it was raised that "newbies" always seem to feel they can bash an Alembic, if a player offers to let the newbie sample their goods. This is why unless I get a $2,000 deposit, no one other than a guitar tech well known to me touches any of my Alembics. This seems to protect my investment in my instruments quite well.
jazzyvee
Senior Member
Username: jazzyvee

Post Number: 3061
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 12:04 am:   Edit Post

Are there any problems that can materialise in a bass that has been used excessively for slapping and popping?

The only things I've seen on basses that I presume have been used for that technique a lot is excessive wear on the finish around G string area where the said action is taking place the base of the neck and excessive wear on the last fret. But that's just my guess as to the cause of wear.


BTW: On this side of the pond, the word "slapper" , that we would refer to here on the forum as someone who hits bass strings with the thumb, has a whole different meaning.

Jazzyvee
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1921
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 3:51 am:   Edit Post

Back in the 80's I wore a hole in the pick up cover on an Aria bass on the G string side. I was doing the whole Mark King thing but he uses light strings(90 on the E) whereas I was using a 105 gauge(on the E) which are a damn site heavier.
I once switched to 90's as an experiment and suddenly I was as fast as him!
I agree jazzy LOL!!
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 325
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 5:04 am:   Edit Post

Victor Wooten's original 1983 Fodera has wear near the "thumb" anchor position. It's kinda like is trademark at this point. I think the location of wear marks on a bass depend on the player of the bass, including their slap technique, and anchoring, as well as the "G-String" issues stated above (although I can think of other G-Strigs I'd rather be dealing with, and not mine you perverts!).
jazzyvee
Senior Member
Username: jazzyvee

Post Number: 3064
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 5:28 am:   Edit Post

Terry are you going to reveal the UK meaning of the word since you are more adept at the bass playing version of the word.
LOL

Jazzyvee
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1922
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 9:24 am:   Edit Post

Jazzy...I may get a reprimand from the moderators!! And how very dare you! LOL
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1923
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 9:26 am:   Edit Post

Oh for the hell of it

UK definition of 'slapper'
A women who offers sex to almost anyone but no payment required, usually when the said woman has had too much alcohol.
pauldo
Senior Member
Username: pauldo

Post Number: 850
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 9:40 am:   Edit Post

:-D
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 327
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 9:43 am:   Edit Post

Why contact the moderators? College "men" routinely pray for this type of woman when trolling in bars and at parties. Not saying its right, but often it happens. Besides, when I saw slap happy, I thought perhaps it meant "Wanker" (Moderator Alert).
stout71
Member
Username: stout71

Post Number: 69
Registered: 7-2011
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 9:47 am:   Edit Post

In the past, the neck pickups on my basses had very obvious wear (you can even make out the roundwound string wraps)caused by the E-string always banging into it. My technique has improved quite a bit and I'm able to get the same quality of sound with a much lighter touch, but it still happens when I slap the E sometimes. Geddy Lee and Flea are my two biggest influences and they play really hard, so go figure. I used to break E's and A's all the time, to the point where I was putting new strings on every other gig.
adriaan
Moderator
Username: adriaan

Post Number: 2955
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:12 am:   Edit Post

I'd be careful around the word "neck".
stout71
Member
Username: stout71

Post Number: 70
Registered: 7-2011
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:25 am:   Edit Post

Sorry. Is that a blasphemous term around here?
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 329
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:35 am:   Edit Post

Neck? What's next, foot? But "bootie" (Not Booty as in Buckaroo Bonzai Big John Booty) is OK? Where have you gone Joe Dimaggio?
adriaan
Moderator
Username: adriaan

Post Number: 2956
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:36 am:   Edit Post

Just pointing out that it's also a verb. ;-)
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 330
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:43 am:   Edit Post

So Adriaan you mean pet(ting)? Really!!! For shame, for shame!!! How's that for verb persecution?
cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member
Username: cozmik_cowboy

Post Number: 1250
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 12:04 pm:   Edit Post

Terry, might I suggest that the phrase you were looking for is "...the right amount of alcohol"?

Steve, I thought I was the only one who saw that piece of bizarreness!

Peter
funkyjazzjunky
Senior Member
Username: funkyjazzjunky

Post Number: 797
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 1:04 pm:   Edit Post

What in the world are your guys talking about?
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 332
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 2:49 pm:   Edit Post

Cosmic Cowboy, remember this - "Wherever you go, there you are" from the movie? Or, when Penny Pretty is revived and the alien says "Big deal, so what". Seems so much like "Further Adventures of Nick Danger by Firesign Theater - Remember, "you can sit here in the waiting room or wait here in the sitting room". Or - "Where's the fire? .... In your eyes Lt. Bradshaw".

Jazzy, you would need to watch all Cheech and Chong movies several times over, them smoke the April Fool's surprize perpetrated by Mica, then watch Buckaroo Banzai (with a great cast and a very hot Ellen Barkin). Trust me it will be time well spent. Just have a lot of munchies on hand (and a diet follow up plan afterwards).
jon_jackson
Intermediate Member
Username: jon_jackson

Post Number: 143
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 7:21 am:   Edit Post

The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across The Eighth Dimension.

Highly recommended.
briant
Senior Member
Username: briant

Post Number: 623
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 9:40 am:   Edit Post

Why is there a watermelon in that vice?
cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member
Username: cozmik_cowboy

Post Number: 1251
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 1:07 pm:   Edit Post

Don't crush that dwarf, hand me the pliers!

Peter
glocke
Senior Member
Username: glocke

Post Number: 928
Registered: 9-2002
Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 2:26 pm:   Edit Post

add me to the list of people who do not slap (at least not much), or really enjoy listening to the sound of a slapped bass. that type of playing, and the tone resulting from it never appealed to me as much as other types of playing..

yep...means i am not a big fan of most of the bass players who people regard as good, this includes Stanley...
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 335
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 3:01 am:   Edit Post

It is too bad they never made the next Buckaroo Banzai movie. What madness would have come from that!

I completely understand glocke's personal choice regarding a dislike for slap style bass playing. The slap happy craze does at times seem overused, as any trendy playing style or technique does. Anthony Jackson, a terrific player, expressed his avoidance of the this technique, and he is considered a monster player by most. Still, when tastefully done, it is another "weapon" in the battle for the soul of us bass players. I do think there is a benefit to learn styles and techniques that one does not like, if only to avoid their use, or more positively, turn them into something that can be useful to one's own playing style. That is the essence of variety, developing your own style, and even innovation. Jaco hated the thought of the work needed to play the Big Dog (acoustic bass) for "such little amount of sound" as he put it, but his fretless playing technique, as well as his use of exopy on the fretboard has influenced the "millions, and millions" (WWE The Rock's chant). The same could be said about the use of tapping, or harmonics, or G-d forbid Tablature (Jeff Berlin, where are you when we need you). I know my musical tastes have expanded from when I was a kid who "knew it all". I did not care for Opera way back when, but every time I hear Andrea Bocelli, I find it moves me emotionally, even though I do not understand Italian ut I do understand The Sopranos").

This forum has such a variety of players and playing styles, it just makes it so enjoyable to take it all in, even in matters that I do not like or even disagree wtih. The different approaches presented really can expand one's creativity and playing approach. Plus, I get in some jabs, when the mood strikes me (and yes I get plenty back, it is part of the deal.)

Sorry ya all, just coming down from the natural high of seeing my son reach new heights in his chosen sport. But don't tell him that, I want him to maintain his focus, so he can expand his own universe. Too bad he does not play guitar or bass, (you can't inherit what you don't use,) but he knows what he likes, and he likes what he knows (OK, bad Phil Colllins "Fake" Genesis reference). It's 5:30 AM, no Olympic repeats on, and we drive home to lots of traffic later. Still a great time to reflect, and soon I am to be reunited with my Alembics. Much to my wife's chagrin, heh, heh, heh!!
cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member
Username: cozmik_cowboy

Post Number: 1253
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 7:36 pm:   Edit Post

Therre was a link on another thread recently of our own Jimmy J demonstrating the absolute definition of funk - and not a thumb involved. 'Nuff said.

Just a slight expansion for those unfamiliar with the movie: Buckaroo Bonzai (Peter "Robocop" Weller), the son of a Japanese father & American mother, is a world-famous neurosurgeon/physicist/inventor/racecar driver/crimefighter/rock star. Again, 'nuff said.

Peter
jacko
Senior Member
Username: jacko

Post Number: 3224
Registered: 10-2002
Posted on Monday, July 30, 2012 - 4:19 am:   Edit Post

Looks like a great movie with a stellar cast. one to find on DVD methinks.

Graeme

edit: 4.55 on Amazon with free delivery seemed to good a deal to pass up :-)

(Message edited by jacko on July 30, 2012)
funkyjazzjunky
Senior Member
Username: funkyjazzjunky

Post Number: 800
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Tuesday, July 31, 2012 - 7:16 am:   Edit Post

Can we start another thread on obscure but hilarious movies?

I love Anthony Jackson, Charnett Moffett, Avery Sharp, John Pattitucci, Eddie Gomez, Charles Fambrough, Tyrone Brown, Ketter Betts and many others that rely on tone & technique as opposed to incessant popping/snapping/slapping.

VMG
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 336
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Tuesday, July 31, 2012 - 8:14 am:   Edit Post

And "FJJ", what is really great is that they all have their own unique sound. Add Eddie Gomez on upright, who sounds very different than most other upright players. As I stated earlier, sometimes techniques get so overused, they become cliches. How many Jaco and Eddie Van Halen clones are out there, making playing an Olympic sport instead of emotion inducing tone. It is one thing to imitate and analysis a player's style to develop your own sound such as Pat Metheny, Alan Holdsworth, Brian Bromberg etc. ad nauseum. But just to clone someone is good for tribute and type bands.
piotr_c
Junior
Username: piotr_c

Post Number: 21
Registered: 7-2012
Posted on Wednesday, August 01, 2012 - 4:59 pm:   Edit Post

I'm one of these "slap-e-de-bess-man" fans (as Paul Rudd was saying in a recent romantic comedy), but I agree that most important is tone and knowing how to play... Slap is like hitting a drive in golf... Whever it impresses or not, it feels good when you get it right. No question for me that it is much harder to play like Gary Willis than slapping the same pattern on every measure. At the end of the day, slap is the beginner bassist's placebo until he can reach something else. With Miller and Wooten, there's no place for more in this field anyway...! (hope i'm not intruding in your thread...!)
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 343
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 6:36 am:   Edit Post

I like the golf driving analogy. Not that I golf well (quite the contrary, but there's always one or two shots that bring you back for more), but for someone who could not master golf, it was almost always a great 3.5 - 4 hours of life allocated. Same as slapping, before the more focused bass playing, (including slapping in a musical and tasteful manner) sets in. Now if you really spent all the time slapping, you could assume the throne from Victor, Mark King, Marcus, and all the others. They have to retire some day. Where will the new Bass playing Olympians come from? Each person must create their style for their needs (and hopefully lots of their fans).
byoung
Senior Member
Username: byoung

Post Number: 1383
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 9:46 am:   Edit Post

I like slap bass, I just don't care for the 4x10 with a poorly designed crossover, horn tweet that sounds like an icepick being forcibly inserted into your brainstem, bass lacking, giant "I'M LOUD IN THE MUSIC STORE" midbass hump sort of sound.

Like I could see rocking straight up 15s for a rolled off high end if that's your thing, but if you're aiming for a full range sound, that SWR design* is about as dated as the mullet.

Bradley
* I had a mullet in the 80s. I've moved on, but those cabs haven't-- they were a step in the right direction, but why not take several more steps?
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1929
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 1:17 pm:   Edit Post

On the 80's note, the reason Trace Elliot came on the scene was that they were a PA company
and bass players were hiring/buying there stuff because 70's bass gear was absolute crap - guitar amps with the treble rolled off, no mid and 4 x 12 cabs.
Although old hat now it was a god send as the 12 band graphic on the AH series tailored for bass players.
The 4x10's produced that mid to top end sound that at that time sounded so modern,
You could hear the bass as opposed to some 'thud' which was prominent in the 70's.
Although I ain't a rock fan, thank God for Chris Squire's treble Ricky.
I believe it has moved on but maybe some players haven't and prefer the 'sound of 80's' bass slapped and popped.
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1930
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 1:27 pm:   Edit Post

Anyway what is wrong with this???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yioVmqlt2Fk
byoung
Senior Member
Username: byoung

Post Number: 1384
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 2:06 pm:   Edit Post

Chris Squire pretty much runs Ampeg 8x10s according to the internets. I have heard tell that when he wants more top end, he actually runs a *guitar* rig in addition.

Not arguing against treble-y bass-- just "less than" cabs and the sound they produce.
piotr_c
Junior
Username: piotr_c

Post Number: 27
Registered: 7-2012
Posted on Friday, August 03, 2012 - 3:36 am:   Edit Post

Hi terryc, Nothing is wrong with this.... I love it...! But have to admit that in the "constant slapped pieces" i've developed a taste for Alain Caron (slam the clown, Donna Lee,....). You guys know him? I just don't know how well he's known in the US (him being Canadian and all ;-)).
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1933
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, August 03, 2012 - 11:50 am:   Edit Post

Oh yes Alains version of 'Donna Lee' is just amazing, bad enought trying to play it fingerstyle let alone slapped, just as bloody hard as Marcus Miller's slapped version of 'Teen Town'
My fav of Alain's is 'Slam The Clown' incredible unison sax and bass with that solo as well.
piotr_c
Junior
Username: piotr_c

Post Number: 28
Registered: 7-2012
Posted on Friday, August 03, 2012 - 2:41 pm:   Edit Post

I saw him once in concert in the Fribourg Jazz Festival (when jazz "stars" didn't yet know it was a crappy festival). We were 8 people listening ( no joke...!) and the guy played 2 full hours for us... That's exactly what i like about the approach of life of bassists in particular...!
funkyjazzjunky
Senior Member
Username: funkyjazzjunky

Post Number: 803
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 10:03 am:   Edit Post

Let me clarify, I am not against popping the strings and I love a good bass solo. But do you have to pop every note on every song?
tubeperson
Advanced Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 350
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 10:21 am:   Edit Post

Same thing applies to the overuse of harmonics.
piotr_c
Junior
Username: piotr_c

Post Number: 31
Registered: 7-2012
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 11:30 am:   Edit Post

For me, case closed, I agree with both of you...!
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1937
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 12:39 pm:   Edit Post

Jaco didn't slap and he was the king of grooves, incidentally I was at the last night of a local music festival(Stockton Weekender - now been running for over 20 years) and I left the girlfriend watching James who was headlining and watched a band called 'The Funk Regulators', they did Tower of Power covers and yes the bassist played like Rocco, I ain't joking, he pulsed those notes like no tomorrow and he was only in his early 20's but not just him, the whole band were right in the pocket. 'What is Hip', 'Don't Change Horses', 'So I Got To Groove' and a nice rendition of 'Mrs Jones' A damn sight better than watching that guy from James dancing like he's having a fit

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