| Author | Message | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 389 Registered: 8-2002 |
Okay, this is a non-Alembic rant. I love to give business to my local music stores, but the total lack of Fenders and Gibsons/Epiphones is scary. I talk to the store owners and all I hear is that Fender and Gibson want sales of $60k and $90k respectively in order to be able to sell at the local stores. Are they crazy?? I know they do a good biz through musician's friend and all, but they are completely forgetting their core buyer! I will ALWAYS support a local biz before an online one. I also noticed that the prices of an American made Fender are absurd. It makes me glad I bought mine new back in '82 when they were actually affordable. On a side note: Mica, if you read this, Setu says hi. He is working at my local store(who used to sell Alembics way back in the 80's) and we mention you every time I go in, so if your ears are burning, it's my fault ;) Paul TGO | ||
| crgaston
Advanced Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 310 Registered: 11-2005 |
Hi Paul. I used to know a bass salesman and Alembic "pusher" named Seitu (I think that's how he spelled it??) who worked in Atlanta in the '90's. I wonder if it's the same guy. He sold me my F1-X and my Modulus. If it's him, say hi for me! Charles | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1051 Registered: 9-2002 |
Elzie, I'd say it's a re-alignment of the store/manufacturer brought on by the megastore/internet-EBay era. Here in Nashville, we have a huge Sam Ash and a Guitar Center as well. Several local stores have closed over the last five years, just could not keep up. Just like the way you always lose some local businesses when WalMart comes in. The surviving local stores are either specialty (bass, vintage, acoustic) or pro shops that cater to the large 'been there, done that' crowd of pros that only go to a GC for strings or cables, if at all. And for every graybeard like you and me that will support a local store, most people will mail order for $10 less (plus $50 S+H, never figured out how they ignore that part . . .). A friend of mine who runs a Mom and Pop store outside Nashville was quoted a $175,000 fee to maintain his Gibson/Epiphone franchise. Gibson was NOT willing to Epiphone-only, no custom shop-only, whatever, that would have allowed him to stay in the game. So that was that. Fender at this time seems to let you a bit more freedom and a lower buy-in, so he'll keep that, at least until they get completely unreasonable also. On the other hand, it's hard to imagine the Gibsons and Fenders turning down the mail order money waved under their nose by the dumpster-full. But they've gotten burned: MARS and the BrookMays crashes have left them and their floor plan financiers holding big losses. And once you're in bed with GC and some others, THEY tell YOU what you're gonna build and sell and how you're going to price it to them. Music retail/wholesale is just one more business in a different model than the one we grew up with. Like most things in life, change is better/change is worse/change is always. J o e y | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1691 Registered: 7-2004 |
The Universe has a way of punishing Gibson. They still have to deal with Ed Roman! nyuk, nyuk Bill, tgo | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 390 Registered: 8-2002 |
Yes Charles, it's the same guy  | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 391 Registered: 8-2002 |
Joey, I think you are right on with your assesment. I will add, though, that it is us graybeards that typically have the cashflow to spend on new equipment. The other point, which is very important to me, but apparently not to a lot of others is that I want to actually play and feel a bass that I'm thinking of purchasing before I drop the cash on it. Maybe it's just me, but I'm kind of kooky like that.... It is just a shame to walk into a store and not see the guitars that made rock and roll what it was. Most of us here have, or do have, Fender/Gibson/Epiphone etc.... Paul TGO | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 845 Registered: 10-2003 |
One of my bandmates runs a reasonably successful music store. He started out in the early '70s, starving and gigging to keep the rent paid. These days he is a dealership for several lines (not Fender, nor Gibson), but his bread and butter is the used market, which treats him well (because he really knows his stuff, in addition to being a shrewed negotiator). He's sold stuff to a who's who of guitarists and bassists, which would never happen if he were focusing his business on selling new Fenders or Gibsons. If you are looking for something old and cool (and American made for the most part), he's the guy to talk to. I think the net result of manufacturers' draconian inventory/cashflow policies are that new players (younguns') are not going to buy that first Strat or Les Paul and develop the brand loyalty us older folks tended to harbour. Like Joey says, change is always... John | ||
| elwoodblue
Member Username: elwoodblue Post Number: 90 Registered: 6-2002 |
John, Does your friend have a website? | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 847 Registered: 10-2003 |
Not one worth visiting. I'll post his number though when I find it. He's on my voice dial as "Beeson" and I don't have my cell or a phonebook handy at the moment. John | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1052 Registered: 9-2002 |
No you're not just kooky like that, Elzie. I prefer to hold the axe in my hand too, to see if the weight is OK and to check grain in the neck and fingerboard. Admittedly, I guess I could buy an 'off the rack' Tele, PBass, what have you over the 'net, but I REALLY don't understand buying serious vintage or custom axes sight-unseen. I would only trust ALEMBIC to buy from 'blind', as I know what's coming. I have fabulous friends and service from Corner Music and Will Gunn Guitars here in Nashville: I can call, ask them for anything, and it's DONE. You just can't beat that person-to-person relationship, or the knowledge and experience. Will KNOWS his Alembics, and Corner has been a huge help for everything else. J o e y | ||
| hankster
Member Username: hankster Post Number: 66 Registered: 6-2004 |
I agree - I find the "mail order instrument" market a bit wierd (although I bought my Alembic from a seller on Ebay). When I was a kid, music stores were full of all kinds of diabolically terrible guitars and basses that were virtually unplayable - but there were always one or two Gibsons or Fenders, or more affordable Hagstroms or Hofners, that you could actually touch, and get some idea what a decent instrument felt like. Small town music stores today, it seems, can't afford that. Rick | ||
| dannobasso
Advanced Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 382 Registered: 3-2004 |
Virtually all of the stores by me Ash, GC, Victors and O'DiBella have online as well as walk in. Mind you In Bergen County we have these plus a few smaller ones all within a 12 miles radius. Unless you develop a personal relationship with the managers and staff if really is a bother going in and asking for something. I was in GC in Totowa (don't really know anyone) looking at a SCBB where the slick salesman tried to tell me that the Alembic bolt ons are pretty good but not as good as what he had hanging up for $3400. I told him he wasn't quite accurate on that. He insisted he knew what he was talking about. I walked away. He didn't even try to take the Stanley down for me to try out. Ash can't carry new Gibsons anymore so they are always looking for used gear. Maybe after I get close to retirement, I'll open up a boutique shop and sell Alembics if the powers in Santa Rosa approve. I promise to beat the competition! That is if I don't keep buying them for myself. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 848 Registered: 10-2003 |
elwoodblue, John Beeson, 812-232-4095. He owns The Music Shoppe in Terre Haute, Indiana, and deals in vintage instruments... John | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 392 Registered: 8-2002 |
Rick, I have to admit that I bought both of my Alembics off of ebay. I paid $900 for each of them too! When I bought the first one years ago, I remember saying to myself "what can go wrong, it's an Alembic. If it has problems I can sell it for what I paid". Well, I was completely thrilled with both of them. I figured an abused Alembic would be better than any new bass. The Excel was perfect, the Epic had human and food goo in the oddest of places and needed an extended cleaning. I admit, I did buy an Epiphone EB-O from musician's friend because I couldn't find a local dealer who carried them. I had a Gibson EB-O in high school (yes, they were around waaaay back then) and the Epi version comes pretty close to the old Gibson I had. I would just rather give my money to a local business, or even far away business, if it were not a large corporation..... | ||
| richbass939
Senior Member Username: richbass939 Post Number: 741 Registered: 11-2004 |
I also admit that I bought both of my Alembics long distance from a description and picture only. As far as the business deal goes, I felt pretty good about not getting ripped off. One was from an established guitar shop that sold the bass on e-bay and took a credit card over the phone. The other was from a club member. I checked with people who I knew had done bass business with him. They all said he was a straight-up guy. As far as the instruments go, I bought them based on the Alembic reputation. I was so thrilled to find out that Alembics could be purchased second hand for such reasonable prices that I had to take the plunge. I have never before bought an instrument that I didn't spend an hour or so playing. My Epics (even though they are at the lower end of Alembic's line) are the finest basses I have owned. I'm glad that I got an Alembic even though I had to assume some risk. When a company has such an excellent reputation I think it is worth a little bit more of a risk. I live in the boonies. If I had to wait until I saw one in a shop I would probably still be waiting. Rich | ||
| hydrargyrum
Advanced Member Username: hydrargyrum Post Number: 224 Registered: 3-2004 |
Well, I certainly am not going to plant my flag on the side of the mega-stores, but there are the rare circumstances where they have their utility. I grew up in a fairly rural area, and there were primarily two music stores around, a Gibson and a Fender dealer(not counting the junk that turned up in pawn shops). Both of these shops knew they had a near monopoly, and as such, set their prices very near msrp, and didn't want to bargain. They made a great deal of money of people who didn't know any better (usually people just starting off). I can remember the first time seeing a musician's friend, and being amazed at how low the prices were in comparison. Pretty quickly both shops moved their prices into a much more competitive range. One of them failed, probably more due to bad customer service than anything else, and the other is still in business, probably because it is a front for some black market business, but that's another story. At any rate, they had to deal more honestly with their customers. All that being said, I have always chose to buy locally, whenever the product I was looking for was available. | ||
| groovelines
Advanced Member Username: groovelines Post Number: 391 Registered: 4-2003 |
If it's possible, here's a story where the overvalued prices of Fender basses worked to my advantage. In '98 I bought a used Fender Jazz for $300. Kept it for a few years until I was bitten by the Alembic bug. So, I did a little research about the used market with the desperate hope of scraping up enough cash . Turns out the Jazz was worth a cool grand at the time and that's exactly what the local guitar store offered me as the trade-in value. Nothing special about it - '96 American Jazz Delux, from Corona, CA. I loath the specualtive buying, own-a-piece-of-history-at-any-price mindset, but in this instance the run-away market made the purchase of my first Alembic possible. All Hail the Mom and Pop shops, but even the chains serve a purpose. BTW, the shop re-sold the Jazz within three weeks. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 787 Registered: 2-2006 |
Reading this thread I can't help but think of the Ford’s Edsel or Chevy's Corvair. Both highly sought after collectible cars, BUT that doesn't change the fact that they both were and still are very undependable. “Piece of History” or “Piece of (insert own expletive”) .....eye of the beholder I guess. | ||
| jbybj
Junior Username: jbybj Post Number: 14 Registered: 6-2006 |
Reading this thread I can't help but think of the Ford’s Edsel or Chevy's Corvair. Both highly sought after collectible cars, BUT that doesn't change the fact that they both were and still are very undependable. “Piece of History” or “Piece of (insert own expletive”) .....eye of the beholder I guess. Hey wait a minute there Mr. Oliver. my 69 Fender Jazz bass is a great instrument, worth every penny............ Oh yeah, I paid $220........ | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 217 Registered: 5-2004 |
In regard to Fender and Gibson having high buy in for small music stores, this has been going on forever. I remember back in the late 70s there were several small stores in the New England area (NH & MA) within 50 miles of each other and they "unofficially" banded together to stay in business. One bought into Fender, one bought into Gibson and so on then they all shared the equipment and the cost for it so they all had a fairly extensive line of equipment to sell. And if you brought your Fender amp to a store for repair who wasn't REALLY the Fender dealer they would send the amp to the actual Fender dealer, they would get it repaired, send it back to the store you bought it from and you wouldn't be the wiser ... or care! And this worked for them for over a decade that I know of. Eventually Daddy's Junky Music and The guitar Center put most of them out of business but it worked for them for quite a while. Stores that normally would try to steel business from one another had to ban together just so YOU and I could but a Fender Jazz Bass and they could stay alive! Amazing ... and this was in the 70's! So this crap about Fender and Gibson having a high buy in price is nothing new ... it's how it's always been. | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 394 Registered: 8-2002 |
"So this crap about Fender and Gibson having a high buy in price is nothing new ... it's how it's always been." Not according tto the owners of my local music stores, who used to carry Fender and Gibson. Call me crazy, but I'd tend to believe the owners of the stores. Especially when they get exasperated when you just mention the subject...... | ||
| hydrargyrum
Advanced Member Username: hydrargyrum Post Number: 225 Registered: 3-2004 |
I remember talking to a shop keeper once who was lamenting the fact that Gibson required them to buy a package of acoustic and electric guitars. They could sell the electrics easily, but the acoustics would tend to accumulate and were rarely sold. It seems like these companies would try to cater to their market a bit more than forcing these retailers to buy products they are going to have a hard time selling. | ||
| pace
Advanced Member Username: pace Post Number: 257 Registered: 4-2004 |
Kev, I guess it's a balancing act between catering to the market and the pressure to keep the acoustic, electric, American and Asian factories all operating at the status quo..... From the Execs down to the dealer reps, on down to the retailer it's a campaign to brainwash the consumer into buying the hype...... I believe it's true that several markets out there will never have a great demand for Gibson acoustics, but as a retailer there's a fine line between knowing your market, and not trying at all... As far as an $170K buy in, I totally believe it, but Im certain that isnt the buy in for the market where I live.... I'd question the franchise's ulterior motives~ I'm sure there's a sweetheart deal on the other side of that coin! FWIW, Two days ago I walked out of a local Daddy's w/ a SWEET deal on a used "bigredbass" (ironically Joey, it's a '96 Gibson LP stnd in Cherry)...... Either they didnt know what they had, or they didnt think there's much of a market around here for a Gibson bass!!!! I couldnt believe it.... It felt so good to put one over on "the man" | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 219 Registered: 5-2004 |
Well Elzie if you got 1st hand info from local store owners and I'm just words on a page I'd believe them 1st too. But trust me, this is what "I" was told years ago from a store owner who was working with three other store owners so they could all aford to carry the "big" manufacturer's lines. I didn't pull this information out of my butt! | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 792 Registered: 2-2006 |
Mr. Young, I too own a couple of Fenders, a 76 Jazz that I purchased new in 76, and a 72 Telecaster Bass That I bought used around 1980. And I agree, they are worth every penny, $400 and $250 respectively. | ||
| 57basstra
Senior Member Username: 57basstra Post Number: 436 Registered: 4-2005 |
Olie, I will give you $250 for your Telecaster bass. | ||
| elzie
Advanced Member Username: elzie Post Number: 395 Registered: 8-2002 |
"Well Elzie if you got 1st hand info from local store owners and I'm just words on a page I'd believe them 1st too. But trust me, this is what "I" was told years ago from a store owner who was working with three other store owners so they could all aford to carry the "big" manufacturer's lines. I didn't pull this information out of my butt!" I am not discounting what you said. I don't doubt that in your area, at that time that's how it worked. It's not like that in my area. So this "crap about Fender and Gibson having a high buy in price" IS relatively new in my area. So take a deep breath, relax and don't sweat the small stuff | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 220 Registered: 5-2004 |
Sorry Elzie ... No harm done. I've taken a few deep breaths! :-) BTW I think it's a shame that manufacturers force stores to buy expensive groupings of products to deal with them because it forces a lot of small store owners out of business. In my area of New England I can only think of 3 small music stores that still exist that aren't part of a big chain, and they all specialize in something to stay in business. For one it's giving beginner's lessons, one stays alive by selling strings and sheet music and the other is near a music college and sells a lot of horns and wood winds, something you don't always find at a place like the Guitar Center. But it is the way it's going in ALL retail and even most businesses unfortulately. The big guys buy up the small guys or put them out of business. Heck ... look at the small family owned farm! | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1337 Registered: 3-2004 |
Twenty years ago, the biggest problem a new/small dealer faced with regard to getting access to Fender or Gibson products was proximity. If there were already a dealer in the general area carrying the line, it would have been nearly impossible to get in. That was about the timeframe of my last direct experience, so I have no idea what may have changed since. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 851 Registered: 10-2003 |
Telecaster Bass = Worst. Bass. Ever. I had one of the early ones with the single coil pickup. The quintessential "fart bucket" bass sound. Swapping in a Seymore Duncan Quarter Pounder didn't do much for it either. I ultimately ended up parting it out, as the neck was fairly decent and the headstock was unusual. I believe I may have burned the body, which may have been too kind. John | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 793 Registered: 2-2006 |
Mighty tempting offer David, but I'll have to pass. I agree with John though, Tele basses are terrible. Dusty Hill may disagree with us though. | ||
| 57basstra
Senior Member Username: 57basstra Post Number: 437 Registered: 4-2005 |
Let me begin by saying this is a qualified response and/or comment having only to do with me as an individual and my experiences and opinions alone and is not intendedby me thorough conjecture, extrapolation or other means of inference or direct communication to refer or relate to anyone other than myself or any situation other than my own: I respectfully disagree -- at least in regards to my Tele bass and ones I have played over the years. I have a Tele bass (American) I bought out of a pawn shop in '81. I love the sound, action feel, look. It is not an Alembic, but it has its own vibe. With the risk of sounding sexist, I find musical instruments to be rather like women -- they all have their special ways. So, Olie: I'll up my offer on the Tele bass... David | ||
| 57basstra
Senior Member Username: 57basstra Post Number: 438 Registered: 4-2005 |
Oh, I like Edsels, too. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 794 Registered: 2-2006 |
David I like your analogy of women and basses. My “Tele” can’t cook but it does feel good in your hands. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 795 Registered: 2-2006 |
While I personaly don't like the sound of the Tele bass, the Jazz is a different story. I do like the sound and feel of my Jazz Bass. It is by no means (my opinion here) as good as my Alembics, feel or sound, but I still do like my old Jazz. You never forget your first love. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 852 Registered: 10-2003 |
David and everybody else (but mostly David), I meant no offense and recognize that we all like different things for different reasons. I *hated* that bass though... John | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1709 Registered: 7-2004 |
At least one big difference between basses and women. When you don't want your bass anymore, you don't have to buy it a house! Bill, tgo | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 853 Registered: 10-2003 |
;) | ||
| 57basstra
Senior Member Username: 57basstra Post Number: 439 Registered: 4-2005 |
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it." Voltaire (François-Marie Arouet) | ||
| groovelines
Advanced Member Username: groovelines Post Number: 394 Registered: 4-2003 |
Back to Elzie's original post. I'm not seeing the availability of Fenders drying up in the DFW area. The local indepenent shop I frequent carries a heavily weighted imbalance of Fenders with a smattering of Gibsons, Epi's, Ken Smiths and SGRs. Used to carry Alembic, Fodera, F-bass and Modulus, but not anymore. I'd prefer more variety, but it seems that those days are gone. The local GC's have as many Fenders as Ken Smiths and Ibenez. Are Fender, Gibson, et al "forgetting their core buyer"? That's a tough one to answer. The cynic in me would probably answer, Yes. Why should they worry about the stock after the dealer buys it, it's not their problem. They've already made the sale, right? But that sounds like market share suicide to me and I hope that's not part of anyone's business model. And maybe part of their impetus is to saturate the market with their brand. I think we all have experienced the "it's not what you know, it's what you recognize" sales phenomina. Mall-mentality: I can get it all and at a store I recognize. I think most people would gravitate to a GC than search out a local shop, thinking they'd get a better deal at a larger, established chain. Companies spend millions on branding, name recognition and demographic targetting campaigns. It's a savy, brutal world and they're going to get their share before the lights go out. Sad testament, that. Not to be gloomy and cast a general pall across free market enterprise, but sometimes it feels to me that there is a loss of contact with the Joes like me that can afford only to press our noses to the shop's window and forlornly gaze through the glass. Honestly, I really would like to have an old, paint-chipped Jazz with some miles on it, just for mojo's sake, but I can't afford one. Geez, I can't even afford a new Jazz. If they want to put their product out of my reach, then I'll just keep my money. As frustrating as it can be, it's not as if I need their stuff anyway. And for as much as some of those pieces go for, I can save up for a used Epic or Excel. Now that, I could need! Mike | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 854 Registered: 10-2003 |
Mike, Are the pawnshops on the square in Denton still full of nice fretless basses these days? Or do you ever get up that way? Back in the early 80's there were probably 150 *nice* fretless basses for sale on that one city block. You name it, there was at least one of them hanging in one of the half-dozen pawn shops, and the prices were reasonable too. I guess that was the one o'clock lab band's contribution to the local economy... ;) John | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 796 Registered: 2-2006 |
Our band (Ice) used to gig in Denton back in the 80's John. We were regulars at a club called Crossroads. Probably the only R& R club on the strip. Never checked out any of the pawn shops though. Wished I would have now. Back then all I played was a 79 Muscicman Sabre fretless. Still own that bass too. A very nice bass I might add. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 855 Registered: 10-2003 |
My first visit was a total shock. We had been playing a club in a small town somewhere North of there and a guy recognized the Alembic I was playing. He recommended I take a trip to Denton and hit the pawn shops, because they were full of basses. I thought he was full of 5h1T at the time. Took the trip a couple of days later and haven't seen as big of a selection of basses since. That was late '82 I think... I've liked every MusicMan bass I've ever played. John | ||
| groovelines
Advanced Member Username: groovelines Post Number: 395 Registered: 4-2003 |
John, Denton is a few miles from here, haven't been to any of the pawn shops. I can imagine that basses and guitars would be readily available there, the music school at UNT has a national reputation as a top notch program. It's never crossed my mind to go hunting up that way...hmmm. | ||
| trekster
Intermediate Member Username: trekster Post Number: 128 Registered: 7-2004 |
I've noticed a dry-up of Alemibics at my favorite used place... guess those college students have gotten wiser. The used place? Atomic Music in College Park, MD -- I always figured they existed on the premise that college students would sell off whatever instrument they had for beer money.. I've seen many an Alembic come and go there... they move stuff usally in 30-60 days or less, unless it is 80's metal guitar stuff (that stays on the the walls FOREVER)... --T | ||
| trekster
Intermediate Member Username: trekster Post Number: 129 Registered: 7-2004 |
I've noticed a dry-up of Alembics at my favorite used place... guess those college students have gotten wiser. The used place? Atomic Music in College Park, MD -- I always figured they existed on the premise that college students would sell off whatever instrument they had for beer money.. I've seen many an Alembic come and go there... they move stuff usally in 30-60 days or less, unless it is 80's metal guitar stuff (that stays on the the walls FOREVER)... --T | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 856 Registered: 10-2003 |
My Keyboard player and I were discussing old Fenders last night on break, and what it might take for me to acquire an old P-bass. He mentioned that he recently sold a really beat-up '61 P-bass for 15. I asked, "hundred?" He replied, "thousand." That's a new Series Alembic for you and me, or several used ones! Wow. John | ||
| smokin_dave
Advanced Member Username: smokin_dave Post Number: 288 Registered: 10-2002 |
I know a player who has a rough 62 strat,all original paint,hardware ect,who was offered 30K. for it. That's a couple of new series basses. | ||
| fc_spoiler
Advanced Member Username: fc_spoiler Post Number: 383 Registered: 5-2006 |
A friend of mine has a '59 strat. Same deal, also in the 20/30K range. I think those prices are ridiculous... I'd rather go for a 30K Alembic, much better price/quality ratio. | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1057 Registered: 9-2002 |
Telecaster (the original, small pickup Precision Bass type, or the 60s version with that big single humbucker) basses are NOT the worst sounding basses in the world. Not my cup of tea, but they are one of those axes you figure you can't do a thing with, only to hear a guy on a gig tomorrow night making one just talk . . . Utterly, absolutely, with no reservation I say the SG-shaped EB Gibson basses (PARTICULARLY the two pickup ones with the big and little humbuckers and VariTone) are utterly the worst-sounding basses EVER made. They should be rounded up and buried in a high-risk EPA dump so as to no further endanger the general populace. THAT's why you can get an LP Bass cheap, guilt by association. I saw this FIVE-string Epiphone sorta reissue monster in Sam Ash and thought it was a demonic torture aimed JUST at me! J o e y | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 1719 Registered: 7-2004 |
Rick Danko of The Band played a Gibson EB bass. He didn't sound too bad, IMHO. My bass player played a Gibson EB from 1976 until last year when he bought a Fender Jazz which he played until last month when I found a sweet Epic 5 which he now plays. They all sounded good, but the Alembic is by far the best sounding of the lot. Bill, tgo | ||
| jbybj
Junior Username: jbybj Post Number: 18 Registered: 6-2006 |
I beg to differ, I have heard all the basses being trashed in this thread, and none could possibly compare to the Teisco Del Rey that I learned on when I was 16. That bass brought a whole notha level to the term "fart bucket". (A term, btw, that I learned on this thread, and am so enthralled with that I use it at every possible opportunity) fart bucket.........fart bucket, fart bucket, fart bucket. | ||
| dadabass2001
Senior Member Username: dadabass2001 Post Number: 698 Registered: 6-2002 |
Okay, My first bass (1967) was a St. George (cheap brother to a Kingston "fender knockoff") 14 lb. piece of deadwood with big rocker switches for pickups on/off and a sound like... jb's fav phrase And to think I spent $74 for that thing. I moved up to an EB-O. Mike (Message edited by dadabass2001 on October 16, 2006) | ||
| keith_h
Senior Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 594 Registered: 2-2005 |
My first bass was a used Vox MkIV. Paid $75 as I recall. My second bass was a Hagstrom 8 that I paid $175 for. I still have both to this day. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 808 Registered: 2-2006 |
My first bass was a Kingston Jazz copy. Not a very good one either. And James I for one wasn't trying to trash the Tele bass, (I will admit that I did give that impression though), but voice my opinion that I personally don't care for the sound of it. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 857 Registered: 10-2003 |
First bass was a Hofner, mid-'60s. I wanted a Rickenbacker in the worst way, but didn't get one until 5 or 6 basses later. Wish I had the vision to hang onto them both... | ||
| richbass939
Senior Member Username: richbass939 Post Number: 746 Registered: 11-2004 |
My first bass was a $50 plank that nobody has ever heard of, I'll bet. Ever seen a genuine Velma Bruno? It had action so high I could probably put my wallet across the 20th fret and not touch the strings. But one thing I can say for Ms. Bruno is that she helped me discover bass playing. All the satisfaction I've gotten from it is immeasurable. About five years later I gave her to a 13 or 14 year old neighborhood kid named Kenny. He didn't know I played. One day he told me that he wanted to learn bass. I said, "Lemme show you something." I showed him my basses, including the Velma Bruno. I let him play it for awhile, then asked "So, what do you think?" He said, "This is pretty cool." I said, "Why don't you keep it then?" He jumped out of his skin. I don't know all of what happened in the next few months or years, but everytime I saw him playing it, it looked like he loved that bass. Rich | ||
| 57basstra
Senior Member Username: 57basstra Post Number: 447 Registered: 4-2005 |
I love hearing stories like that, Rich. That's what playing, and sharing the magic, is all about. You never know what is going to spark someone to greatness or simply touch them in ways they would never have known. David | ||
| jack
Member Username: jack Post Number: 99 Registered: 11-2005 |
I gave a kid my first Ibinez EX 404 when I 'graduated' and he gave it back! Hope I didn't turn him off to bass forever. Probably a DJ now. | ||
| 2400wattman
Advanced Member Username: 2400wattman Post Number: 252 Registered: 11-2005 |
Ibanez has that effect on some people. They have not produced anything great since the Affirma designed by Rolf Spurler. That was a killer bass and now very rare. I think Ed Roman has one that was signed by former President ahemm...Bill Clinton. OOOOO.K. moving on. | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 221 Registered: 5-2004 |
Actually I think Ibanez makes good basses if you consider the price point. Good beginner basses to be sure, better then Fender's low end basses. The company that's making VERY good production line basses for cheap money is Shecter. My son has a 5 string he paid about $550 for and I'd put it up against any bolt on neck bass under a grand. It's beautiful and has a nice wooden tone, like a Warwick. Fact is for me my Alembic is my pride and joy ... but so is my Modulus bass and Fender STYLE custom double neck bass/6 string guitar. I even really like a Yamaha bass I picked up recently for gigs I don't want to bring my expensive basses too. (The same series as the John Patatuchi signature Yamaha bass) You know ... roudy biker type bars. In regard to Tele basses, never played one, but I've always been a fan of the Fender Jazz bass ... my 1st REAL bass. ................ Funny how this post got hijacked! :-) | ||
| pace
Advanced Member Username: pace Post Number: 262 Registered: 4-2004 |
Joey, I wouldnt mind all the EB-0's & EB-3's going to the EPA dump.... cause I work there!!!! I understand your general disdain for Gibson stuff... But after seeing EB's go for 3-4xs as much, I dont think this was guilt by association! When I found my EB-0 it already had a Guild pup in it. So, as far as how the orginal ceramic sounded, I couldnt tell ya! The LP bass has Bartolini pups & pre... never been a fan of Barts.... The silver lining~ Alembic HG pups fit right in, so I'm thinking Signature electronics in the near future!!!!! | ||
| hankster
Member Username: hankster Post Number: 70 Registered: 6-2004 |
I've been interested in Tele basses ever since I started listening to Little Feat. Kenny Gradney plays one, and things seem to have worked out well for him. I had a chance to buy one in a music store in Thunder Bay, Ontario in 1981 for about $200.00, which I couldn't afford at the time. I've always kind of regretted not buying it. But then, I regret not buying most of the instruments I didn't buy. Rick | ||
| dadabass2001
Senior Member Username: dadabass2001 Post Number: 699 Registered: 6-2002 |
Rick, The last few times I've seen Kenny, he was playing a Kubicki Factor bass. Mike | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 819 Registered: 2-2006 |
I played Factor basses for about ten years. Right up till about a year ago when I got my first Alembic. Great basses. I still have a 3, Pink, Green and White. How's that for color selection. | ||
| hankster
Member Username: hankster Post Number: 71 Registered: 6-2004 |
Hey Mike, that's interesting. He stuck to the Tele for a long time without changing. I've never tried a Factor. Even in Toronto (where I live) there isn't enough of a market for anyone to stock very many high end basses. Rick | ||
| dadabass2001
Senior Member Username: dadabass2001 Post Number: 700 Registered: 6-2002 |
Rick, Check out the 2006 DVD release "Little Feat & Friends In Jamaica - Burgers & Paradise." I found it at Best Buy. Some cool guests as well as the standard band. Kenny sits in the pocket and grooves with Richie and Sam. A pretty cool grassroots marketing idea - the band stays at the Grand Lido in Negril and people fly in and hang during January. Mike Whoo Hoo! post #700 | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 409 Registered: 11-2003 |
Back to the original post .... All of my Alembics were bought via small, independent dealers. The Spyder came from Bass Central, the Europa through Superbass (no longer in business, but thanks Steve!), Dragon's Wing through Willie's American Guitars, Essence #1 through Conn-Signment Music in Raleigh, NC, and the Burkha King (Essence #2) through Good Guys Guitars via eBay. Basses I've bought at GC: 0. Basses I've bought at Sam Ash: 0. Amps I've bought at GC: 1, an Ampeg BA115 I still have. Amps from Sam Ash: 0. Bottom line is I'm a small store kind of guy. Others aren't, and if it works for them that's all that matters. I'll still have my '73 Jazz, BTW. Got it for $1350 off the bay ... wonder what it would go for now, that that I'm even remotely considering selling it ... Alan | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 410 Registered: 11-2003 |
Back to the original post .... All of my Alembics were bought via small, independent dealers. The Spyder came from Bass Central, the Europa through Superbass (no longer in business, but thanks Steve!), Dragon's Wing through Willie's American Guitars, Essence #1 through Conn-Signment Music in Raleigh, NC, and the Burkha King (Essence #2) through Good Guys Guitars via eBay. Basses I've bought at GC: 0. Basses I've bought at Sam Ash: 0. Amps I've bought at GC: 1, an Ampeg BA115 I still have. Amps from Sam Ash: 0. Bottom line is I'm a small store kind of guy. Others aren't, and if it works for them that's all that matters. I'll still have my '73 Jazz, BTW. Got it for $1350 off the bay ... wonder what it would go for now, that that I'm even remotely considering selling it ... Alan |
