| Author | Message | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1554 Registered: 2-2006 |
Kevin, First off, it’s “Olie” (rhymes with HOLY) NOT OLLIE (rhymes with HOLLIE) and I myself have 2 beautiful daughters. My wife and kids are the most important possessions on this Earth. Your statement “I respect your right to live the way you have chosen. Please see that others have chosen differently”, insinuates that I do not value my children as much as I do my material things. You know nothing about me or my values so to set the record straight, my order of importance is as follows; Jesus Christ Wife Children Church Work Family Friends It was a JOKE and only a joke. Life is too short to be offended at every little thing. Olie (OH-LEE) | ||
| goatfoot
Member Username: goatfoot Post Number: 79 Registered: 12-2003 |
Olie, First off, I'm sorry for getting your name wrong. Second, I wasn't implying anything about your value system. I know it was a joke. It's a joke that those of us with large families hear all of the time. Q: "Don't you know what causes that?" A: "Yes, and I like it." I'm use to people staring at us when we go out in public. I'm not use to being made uncomfortable here. Your priorities, as you have listed them, would agree with mine. My comment was meant to say you COULD (not that you have) put bass at #1 with children last. That's fine, if that is how you have chosen to live. I choose differently, that's all. I'm not looking to start a heated discussion. You titled your message "Didn't see that coming." I guess I was simply trying to help you see that some of us don't think it is a "little thing" when someone ridicules our decision to have large families. I wish you the best. Grace and peace, Kevin | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 2598 Registered: 7-2004 |
Olie: I have no idea what this thread is about (I suspect a post has been removed), but aren't you forgetting the Mavericks on your list? LOL We have people out here who would put the Raiders right at the top. We call them drunks! hehehehe Bill, tgo | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1556 Registered: 2-2006 |
No heat here Kevin and no ridicule intended. I know what it's like to come from a large family, 7 brothers and 1 sister. Which is probably why I chose a small family and also where I got my sense of humor. With that many kids in one house you either learn to laugh or stay mad all the time. Nothing but peace and love intended for all. Olie PS. Bill, the Mav's are on my list but somewhere below music, root beer and PIZZA | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 126 Registered: 11-2006 |
olieoliver, when you said that your order of importance is as follows: Jesus Christ Wife Children Church Work Family Friends Are you serious ???? many american people have these values in this order ? It's an earthquake thread !! ;o) | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1557 Registered: 2-2006 |
Pierre-Yves, I can only speak for myself and not the majority of Americans. It's a very simple phylosophy LOVE. 6 in that list I love them to the fullest, as for work................ I love 5 o'clock! Olie (Not sure I understand the earthquake analogy)??? | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 128 Registered: 11-2006 |
earthquake analogy = heat thread !! Because I haven't same value, all my friends and my family in Europe haven't same value ...children and wife (wich one ? ;o)) and friends ok ... but Jesus Christ, Church and work ... maybe Alembic, if the tailpieces are correctly centered one day ?? I'm smiling...but.... | ||
| the_8_string_king
Senior Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 733 Registered: 9-2005 |
Wow, this is one of the most disturbing things I've read recently. I love comic books, superheroes, Star Trek, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and a number of other fantasies of a non-pretentious nature... but they all rank a distant second to my beloved and my friends -as well they should. If I were to rate any of these things ahead of her and my friends, I'm sure they'd want nothing to do with me -as well they ought in such a case. I also wouldn't frankly want a lover or friends that would be content to be second place... I wouldn't find anyone attractive who'd settle for being second. I find your proclaimation shocking, alien, and profoundly disturbing; but I support your right to say it, of course. And it's interesting. I can only assume there must be others who see things the same way... but it just boggles my mind. Pierre, as far as your question goes, my experience, unfortunately, is that MOST Americans seem to be stupid, and getting stupider and stupider. But almost every day I encounter some that are surprisingly intelligent. From what I can tell, the superstitious Americans are actually a minority, and the majority of those who proclaim themselves to be religious/superstitious just do so because they want the approval of others and find it easier to "fit in." I don't believe the majority of Americans really believe this stuff any more. They're just afraid to say so -due to oppression and the fear of oppression. It's really like the story of "the Emperor Wears No Clothes"... but most people are afraid to point out the obvious. (Message edited by the 8 string king on August 31, 2007) | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 130 Registered: 11-2006 |
Lol the_8_string_king !!! Your "president" put the order as follow: petrol... Jesus Christ ... Ok, I go out !!! ;o)) Just a question I asked some days ago (to become sweet this hot thread): what is your job to have so many time to write here ? ;o) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 552 Registered: 11-2003 |
(Message edited by ajdover on September 01, 2007) | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1558 Registered: 2-2006 |
Mark, it's hard to explain but my "order of importance" doesn't put my wife or kids in second place. It actually puts them first. BUT this is not the place and I apologize for bringing it up. Olie (A Stupid American?) | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 132 Registered: 11-2006 |
Alan, I have no time to read all your post my "friend" ... we haven't the same culture .. Im not an History encyclopedy and I'm from Switzerland, we never see our presidents, we don't have, fortunatly, you and me, the same culture and the same values. Here, in Europe, we have the liberty to speak how and about who we need or we have some pleasure. If I want to critic Bush, God, Alan, I do, even you don't agree, if I want to critic Alembic I do, even you don't agree. It's my liberty, it's THE liberty ... you know what is expression liberty ? I hope you have a woman as president, soon.... American army is THE best army, and you are a GOOD soldier ... Bush is a great man and a great President, of course, the entire world know that. Bye Alan, God and Mr Bush save your soul. Olieolive, I prefer your choice !! (Message edited by pierreyves on August 31, 2007) (Message edited by pierreyves on August 31, 2007) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 553 Registered: 11-2003 |
(Message edited by ajdover on September 01, 2007) | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 134 Registered: 11-2006 |
Alan, you are THE ****** american. I don't understand all your words, but I dont like your mentality. Your are the tipically picture of american guy we have in Europe. thank's to confirm it, sorry for other americans. Bye, my job is ready, I'm wan't to go to sleep. (Message edited by pierreyves on September 01, 2007) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 554 Registered: 11-2003 |
(Message edited by ajdover on September 01, 2007) | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Intermediate Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 188 Registered: 10-2006 |
Well, this is getting WAY too political, but since you brought it up, Alan - Bush was most certainly NOT duly elected. In '00 the right-wing activist Supreme Court injected their politcal debts into the electoral process to overrride the will of the people - Al Gore won - including, in the final count, having the most votes in Florida. One Justice (I think Scalia, but maybe Thomas) actually said the official counting should stop because if people knew who got the most votes, it might undermine their confidence in the Court's decision! In '04 it was a case of massive fraud. In the Ukraine they had to hold a new election because the variance between exit polls and recorded votes was something like 9%, which was accepted as statistical proof of a rigged election. In Ohio, for one, the '04 variance was in the neighborhood of 12%. There were cases of computor voting machines (built, programmed, and operated by Diebold, a huge Bush contributor whose CEO said he would do anything to keep Bush in office) registering NEGATVE vote counts - up (or, rather, down) to -16,000 for Kerry. Question Bush's legitimacy? I laugh at the very concept. Give him quotation marks, asterisks and a lengthy prison term! Peter | ||
| the_8_string_king
Senior Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 737 Registered: 9-2005 |
I imagine it is hard to explain how they are "first" when you listed them second and third, Olie. But I don't see you having anything to apoligize about -at least to me. I do respectfully submit, that unless you actually do consider yourself a "stupid American", you shouldn't call yourself one. But of course, that is your right. Major, as far as your comments go... it is true that France has had a pretty lame international history in a lot of ways since World War II. No doubt about it. The numerous examples you cited are valid, to be sure. Of course, for whatever it is (or isn't) worth, we Americans should be grateful for the assistance the French gave us back in the days of the Revolutionary war... without that assistance, we likely wouldn't have won the war for independence, and wouldn't have been able to return the favor, and "save their butts." Just a thought. I have to agree with most of your points regarding France. (No offense intended, Pierre.) On the other hand, I don't consider Bush a leader or "our" President. I don't believe he was "elected by citizens of our country." There is considerable evidence that that HISTORICALLY CLOSE election was rigged; or that the results of Bush "winning" was rigged. I don't know that, of course... but it's NOT something that can be rationally dismissed. There IS evidence for it. I believe it is very likely that he and his cronies TOOK the "Presidency". (And don't misconstrue me as being a Gore fan, I'm not. They're flip sides of the same diseased coin. They're in bed together... the "Republicans" and "Democrats"... together, they have sucessfully circumvented genuine "democracy", so we don't have any real choice, and haven't had any for decades. Every election, we get to choose between heads or tails of the same corrupt party... but that's a separate important issue.) And I consider it self-evident that he is a traitor, and a disgrace to this nation. He swore an oath to defend and uphold the Constitution. He has argueably done more damage to it than any American in the history of this country. His many monumentally serious crimes and blunders are as obvious as the sun in the sky. I don't believe what he does rationally qualifies as "leadership". No, this simply wouldn't be an honest, accurate discription. What he does is something VERY, VERY, different from leadership. And it is certainly also very different from DEFENDING the Constitution. What he does is clearly the opposite. This is plain fact, like the sun in the sky. And while there are many deluded people who are either too clueless to see it and/or who have a vested interest in denying it, one can not rationally condemn someone for pointing out this obvious fact, whether they say it explicitly, or merely allude to it. He is not a man worthy of respect; he simply hasn't earned it. He HAS earned the contempt of rational and patriotic people by virtue of his extremely serious crimes against this country, and against other countries. Of course, while I disagree with you, I respect your right to your opinion, your right to express it civilly as you have, and your efforts fighting to defend our right to do such. If only our "President" has such devotion. Take care, folks, I'm not going to say anything else on this subject. P.S. Pierre, thanks for expressing your opinion honestly. I appreciate it. I happen to appreciate your sense of humor, and your intelligence. I know that there are some here who are hostile to such thoughts, but know that there are others who are appreciative as well. Major, I'm disapointed to see some of the obviously uncivil remarks you made (after I previously complimented you on your civility, but after seeing your additional comments prior to logging THIS post). That last comment about the Swiss laundering money for the Nazis is obviously an uncivil and deliberately malicious comment meant as an attack, and I submit you should consider editing it out. This is NOT the way to have a civil discussion, and THIS is WHY forums often are afraid of having such discussions... because some people simply are not willing to remain civil. These kinds of comments do a disservice to Americans, and are precisely why so much of the rest of the world thinks of us as "stupid Americans". We're not all like this, Pierre. | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 555 Registered: 11-2003 |
(Message edited by ajdover on September 01, 2007) | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 556 Registered: 11-2003 |
(Message edited by ajdover on September 01, 2007) | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1762 Registered: 3-2004 |
I thought the thread on New Orleans had gotten out of hand. That was nothing compared to where this one has gone. It always seems to start with someone making a little dig. Then either someone tries to defend or someone else starts piling on. If Dave doesn't step in and shut things down, we get a mess like this one. I'm no fan of censorship, but thread deletion might not be a bad idea in this case. -bob | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 557 Registered: 11-2003 |
I'll stop from here on out. Anyone wishing to continue the discussion can contact me privately. Alan | ||
| darkstar01
Member Username: darkstar01 Post Number: 75 Registered: 6-2005 |
this has to be the most ridiculous thread i've seen on this forum. i'm sorry, but i don't see where any of this fits in with what SHOULD be discussed here. religion? whatever, do what you want, and keep it to yourself. politics? i think we've already been over the pub discussion theory. but name calling? seriously. if there's going to be name calling let's keep it confined to guitar players! (JOKE, CALM DOWN) i know i'm not a moderator, and namely not the ever-coolheaded Dave, but this is a forum about our beloved instruments. And to go even further, about MUSIC. for me, music is all important, be it secondary to whomever you love, and it is why we are here. i dont say much here, but this is getting out of hand. austin | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 135 Registered: 11-2006 |
I know you are not all the same, Clarkee, I hope, is a good example .. Alan is an'extremist in his conviction, patriotism, fidelity to Mister President...who is like a god for Alan. Bye | ||
| pace
Advanced Member Username: pace Post Number: 340 Registered: 4-2004 |
I don't come here to share my love for my family, friends, God, work, politics, country, president, etc etc etc.... I'm here because I am a fan of all things Alembic. PERIOD. That said, I was cruising drudgereport this morning and found an interesting article..... http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070901/D8RCI31O0.html Remember... I don't care where you live, what language you speak, or what your socio-political tendencies are. We are all on this planet together, and we can all benefit from knowing OUR history. | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 136 Registered: 11-2006 |
In all countries you have extremist people, in Switzerland they not live at this place long time, as in France. This thread was spoken about what...your values ? I just said a little critic about Bush, very little, not like your foot balloon droped in Afghanistan... And the colonel Alan begin his crusade ... very funny. For me it's close, thanx. | ||
| rraymond
Advanced Member Username: rraymond Post Number: 306 Registered: 6-2002 |
Moder Dave, clean up on isle 9... | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1764 Registered: 3-2004 |
Everyone has an opinion. Some people should learn to keep them to themselves. Pierre, you clearly bear responsibility for escalating this thread with your "little critic about Bush". It may not be sole responsibility, but it also wasn't nothing. You just can't push the buttons and walk away from the car wreck they create. You have to admit that this was a marginal thread about philosophy/religion until your comment, after which it turned into a political debate. | ||
| flaxattack
Senior Member Username: flaxattack Post Number: 1655 Registered: 4-2004 |
i dont know where this all started nor do i care but one thing for sure. we are all entitled to our beliefs. no one but no one can or should cast dispersions or disrespect anyone for them. i can see by the edited posts that comments were removed. probably for a good reason. i dont necessarily believe in god per se. but i believe there are forces out there beyond our sight and touch. i do believe in a higher power who helped save me from myself several years ago. my friends bill and mica know my story. i respect olie and i like olie though we have never met. every country has its issues including france. we address ours every year via elections. we cherish that right. its not a perfect world. but its the only one we have. someday there may actually be peace and harmony on the planet. probably not until someone or something comes down out of the sky and says SHUT UP AND SIT THE F--K DOWN..before we finish it for you... lol | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 2602 Registered: 7-2004 |
I just saw all this after Alan had apparently deleted his postings, so I really don't know what all the hubbub is about, but I can speculate. Without taking any position or side, I only want to comment that it is significant and a telling symptom of the current state of affairs when a citizen of another country needs to explain Liberty to Americans. In my experience, the citizens of this nation prefer to talk about loving liberty and freedom, but, in practice, would much rather give them up for a sense of security, false or not. Thanks, Pierre. Bill, tgo | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1559 Registered: 2-2006 |
MInd if I HI-Jack this thread, I did start it. I am curious how many guys here are; full-time musicians, part-time (have a day gig but still play profesionaly) and how many are hobbyist? I fall into the part-time list. I did the full time thing YEARS ago but just couldn't make pay the bills. Now I am more hobbyist but still do play occasionally a "paying gig". Peace, Olie | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1765 Registered: 3-2004 |
I mind, Olie... The last thing I think we need is to try to give this thread new life. | ||
| olieoliver
Senior Member Username: olieoliver Post Number: 1560 Registered: 2-2006 |
You are probably right Bob. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 5463 Registered: 5-2002 |
Hi! Sorry I'm late. As a reminder, please feel free to email me when you see a thread that's getting out of hand. This is my busy season with work, and I'm away from the board for longer periods than usual. My apologies. This is the first time I've seen this thread. One of the posters has deleted several of his messages, so I have no idea what was in them. And it's a long thread, so I've kinda skimmed through it. This thread has been made all the more interesting by some language barrier hurdles. A little story. Let's say that I invite several friends over to my house for a relaxing evening of listening to music, eating good food, etc. While these are all people that know me, they don't all know each other. Now let's say that I happen to know that these people hold widely varying and quite passionate political and religious beliefs. But I also know they all love music, good food, etc. and they are all really nice people. Well since these are people I like, and since I want them to enjoy the evening and each other's company, my plan is to not start talking about stem cell research. I am a very political person. Many of you have already figured that out. I am actively involved on a daily basis. I sign petitions and letters to my Representatives in Congress, the President, the Interior Department, the Forest Service, government officials in China and India, the United Nations, etc.; I call my Representative's office often and I visit his local office often with my political group; I write letters to the editor; I help organize and attend meetings, rallies, vigils, etc. I spend lots of time every day reading about the issues, educating myself, separating facts from opinions, etc. And of course I would really love it if all of you would suddenly passionately embrace all the positions that I passionately embrace. If this forum were a political blog, I would have a lot to say. But it's not. Getting back to the little story I started. No matter what my position on stem cell research, some of my friends are just not going to want to come back to my house for another such evening if they know that I'm going to bring up stem cell research again. That's not what they wanted to come to my house for. They came because they thought that the evening was going to be about music, good food, etc. When I get together with my bandmates to do a gig, I don't discuss politics because I know that it's a subject that my guitar player isn't interested in. Our thing is music, and we communicate on that level. It's a wonderful experience. That's why I love playing music with him. This forum is also a wonderful experience, when we are all sharing, when we are treating each other like friends. This forum is not a political blog. I frequent political blogs, daily. Recently one of the blogs I frequent, and of which I count myself as a member, was verbally attacked on air by a cable tv show host. He called our group names that were very hurtful. I suppose he is as passionate about his politics as I am about mine. But the thing about being passionate about politics is that some people tend to say very hurtful things about other human beings. This forum is not a political blog. There are a lot of people who come here as to a friend's home. There are people that come here to be among friends and to enjoy each other's company. We do not come here to have people say things about us, either directly or indirectly, that are hurtful. We get enough of that elsewhere in the world. There are thousands and thousands of political blogs. If you really want people to know your opinions about politics, start posting in political blogs. If you want the people in this forum to know your opinions about politics, put a link in your profile to some other site where they can read your views. Each of us can only be where we are right now. Each of us holds opinions that have been shaped by our own unique personal histories. You guys are my friends. Many of us have been talking with each other on a regular basis now for years. We are all different; each of us unique. But here, we can treat each other with respect, with compassion, with friendship. There are members here from all over the world; but through a common interest, we have built a community of friendship that transcends the boundaries of political and religious divisions. So, it is my view, in my role as moderator, and given where I happen to be at this point in time on my path through life, and given what experiences I have to draw from, that in this forum it is generally a good idea to refrain from discussions about politics and religion. And, it is my view that it is never really helpful to say hurtful and negative things to other club members. We have no idea where others are in life. We don't know what suffering they are experiencing in their work lives, their family matters, their economic situations, their health situations. When club members come to this forum, what they do not need is to have fellow club members add to all the other negative stuff in life that they are having to deal with. This place should be a place of refuge. I come here expecting to see friends; my guess is that others come here for that reason as well. When the overall feel of a forum starts to change in a way that no longer feels comfortable, some people will leave. This place should be a welcoming place. After all, we're musicians and music lovers and we have an appreciation for high quality craftsmanship. That's what brought us all here to begin with. In my role as moderator I try to help in ways that I think will be most beneficial to the health of our club, our community, to all of us, the members, and to our hosts, the Wickershams. I believe that the modest guidelines that I suggest here are true to that cause. Thanks, David | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1766 Registered: 3-2004 |
Bravo! Cut this post out and stick it in the must reads so that maybe we won't have to "ask" for so many encores. | ||
| ajdover
Senior Member Username: ajdover Post Number: 558 Registered: 11-2003 |
Simply put, I've emailed several individuals privately, to inlude Pierre. Anyone else wishing to continue the discussion can reach me at dover@infionline.net. Alan | ||
| pierreyves
Intermediate Member Username: pierreyves Post Number: 137 Registered: 11-2006 |
certainly not, for what to do ? You have deleted your very interresting opinion here ... Not Pierre, Pierre-Yves ok ? Smile my colonel. | ||
| eligilam
Member Username: eligilam Post Number: 57 Registered: 2-2006 |
Some folks watch this posting site for threads like this one the same way other people watch hockey for the fights and NASCAR for the crashes. Not me, of course. | ||
| the_8_string_king
Senior Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 747 Registered: 9-2005 |
Pierre-Yves, I apologize for getting your name wrong; no disrespect, just ignorance on my part.  | ||
| terryc
Advanced Member Username: terryc Post Number: 256 Registered: 11-2004 |
This thread is far to heavy for my poor little brain, even far too detailed for the pub-put -the-world-to-right scene. I have read only the relative parts, each to their own I say but keep it in mind with our mutual interest, playing music, listening to music and Alembic instruments My penny's worth(mind you I really like davehoucks stories - I can relate a lot to them even though I am from the UK)and as he says we are all friends at this forum | ||
| keavin
Senior Member Username: keavin Post Number: 1276 Registered: 12-2002 |
Lets stick to the bassline guys! |
