| Author | Message | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 365 Registered: 9-2008 |
i was just wondering if anyone can point out a difference in sound if the head was exactly the same with same settings, this just in general, not necessarily about brand ~Taylor | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 941 Registered: 5-2009 |
I have noticed that when I use all 10's in general I get more precision articulation if I am playing staccato 16th notes for example. In my fleet of speaker enclosures I have 2x10's / 4x10's & 8x10's Both my 4x10 & 2x10 units are loaded with with EV's and the 8x10 is stock AMPEG loaded with CTS . | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 366 Registered: 9-2008 |
do you notice a big loss of the low end when using 8x10 as opposed to the 4x10 and 1x15, or an increase in mids or treble? ~Taylor | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 546 Registered: 1-2008 |
I never used a tone that was particularly pronounced in the low end, but I always favored 15" speakers (I had an Acoustic 408 w/4x15 and a homemade deal w/2x15). I played out of a SVT 8x10 on several occasions, but I was never able to get "my sound" with that cabinet. The 15's seemed to produce the mid-range "punch" that I preferred better than the smaller speakers. I'm not sure how much thought went into the design of those cabinets, but after getting my El Whappo Jr. I can now appreciate the influence of cabinet design. The El Whappo Jr is a 4 way "cabinet in a cabinet" with a 12" Sub Woofer, 12" Mid Woofer, 6" Mid, a 2 Tweeters. This thing will sound like whatever you dial in (including a ridiculous amount of low end if you're so inclined). I know that didn't answer the question, but I think it's more complicated that just speaker size. | ||
| dannobasso
Senior Member Username: dannobasso Post Number: 1259 Registered: 3-2004 |
I started out back in the day with 215 acoustic and a 610 sears cab. Blew them up because I didn't know about watts ohms etc. Started using a 410 and 15 in 82-83. Compressors, eq's and all that goes with it plus deltalab efx etc. After going through Sunn 412, 18 w bin, 210, 410 of various brands I now settled on 212 cabs, I have a 610 as well but never take it out. The 410s were good, tight , focused and punchy. The 15 worked well because I also played synth pedals through it and the sub waves were handled. I know quite a few guys who are sold on svt 810's (but they don't have to move them) I never felt that the pronounced lows were there but the mids were in your face. The best over all to my ear right now is 212's. Plenty of lows but very good articulation. My cabs have tweets so the sizzle is there if I need it though I generally dial it down. It took me way too long to realize that my rig was really just my stage monitor and the FOH guy will do what he wills to my sound. To answer your question about the heads sound with diff. cabs. Absolutely. My 610 sounds better with the Thunderfunk than the Epifani, but the 212's sound better with the Epi. | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 942 Registered: 5-2009 |
When I used the 8x10 enclosure last it was at fairly High SPL levels in a "power trio". I would say that at the time that I did not suffer an unfavourable loss of low end that I could not adjust for with EQ. I did get a well defined Low end and perhaps a bit more low mid range growl and extended highs. I would say that when I combine a 15" or an 18" in the combination with 10's the low end response is indeed different in perception and the way that I fit in the mix in terms of getting a blanket of moving air and the perception of the actual "sonicimpact" of my Bass playing. I would say that the ideal fit is when I can hear definition in MY notes and clarity in respect the the other players and not over power them but can feel as well as hear the Bass. I approach every new combination of players with and individual and new approach. I tend not to have" written in stone" personal rules on what is needed to do the job. I search and listen carefully to find that . | ||
| tmoney61092
Advanced Member Username: tmoney61092 Post Number: 367 Registered: 9-2008 |
well i was just wondering because i am going to get an Acoustic B600H head to hook up to my Ampeg SVT-1540he and was just curious, from what i've played it looks like that head will be able to do anything i need it to but wanted to know how much influence the cabinets had on the sound. i played it through an Acoustic with 8x10, not a big fan of a lot of low end but loooove my mid range punch thanks for the help guys! ~Taylor | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 943 Registered: 5-2009 |
Taylor , I like that punch too! | ||
| peoplechipper
Advanced Member Username: peoplechipper Post Number: 213 Registered: 2-2009 |
I play through an Acoustic 370 with a 4x10 and a 1x15 cab and it sounds fantastic; sometimes it's almost like two basses at once; makes me sound better than I really am! tony | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 547 Registered: 1-2008 |
I tried out the B600H hooked-up to the matching 1x15 and 4x10 cabinets... it sounded REALLY good (almost bought it). The whole stack is relatively inexpensive; however, be advised that the 600W is at 2 ohms. | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 385 Registered: 5-2004 |
I'm currently running a Peavey Tour TNT 115 combo with a 15" and tweater horn and have a 2X10 extension cab with a tweater horn. I find the 15 to be more round and deep but a bit mushy. Adding the 2X10 not only runs the amp at it's full wattage but adds missing punch and definition to the low end. BTW this is the brand new model Tour TNT 115 and Peavey advertises it as 600 WTS which is misleading by design. It 600 WTS PEAK which makes it 300 WTS RMS and to get the full 300 WTS you need an 8 OHM extension cab to bring it down to a 4 OHM load. I HATE it when companies use LEGAL but purposely misleading tactics to sell stuff. I actually pointed out this misleading tactic on a review of the amp sent into the Guitar Center and they POSTED IT so thumbs up to them for trying to be honest to their customers. OH except for the misleading wattage rating I still think the amp is a great deal and a great sounding CHEAP amp so my review wasn't a total slam. i just made sure people could read that the rating of 600 WTS is totally misleading and the amp is really only half that wattage in RMS at 4 ohms. | ||
| crobbins
Senior Member Username: crobbins Post Number: 615 Registered: 6-2004 |
I use a MarkBass 500 watts 4x10 cab with the reggae band. That rig sets off the alarm at Caltech.  | ||
| terryc
Senior Member Username: terryc Post Number: 1201 Registered: 11-2004 |
For the technical minded(Sonicus, DFung et al), there was a great deal of research done by two acoustic engineers Thiele & Small. They both provided equations which can give the specific dimensions for all types of driver. In other words it is not just the size of the speaker but the cabinet it is housed in which is then tuned to the speaker. I have an old Celestion enclosure contructors book and some of the folded horns are extremely complicated in contruction but the response graphs are impressive. A 12" bass driver in one folded horn can go down to 30Hz which you just wouldn't expect(taking in to consideration Db ratio of course!) Sometimes power isn't everything but the way it is used | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 955 Registered: 5-2009 |
Hello terryc , Yes ! I have seen & heard cabinets that were built to Thiele& Small specifications and liked the sound . Such folded horn designs used to be quite popular. I used to play Bass through a dual throat folded horn cabinet that enclosed a single 18 '" JBL , it's design gained the moniker "Earthquake"; it projected an astounding amount of air with so much force that it would make the glass's and liqueur bottles rattle in the tavern that I was playing at . That thing is still in my basement .I have held on to it thinking I might use it again some day in an out side gig somewhere ,although last time that I played a gig through it was in 1988 at the Civic Center in San Francisco . I also still have 2 old Alembic A12 cabinets that are loaded with GAUSS 12's that the previous owner tuned to the drivers by adding ports in the front ,those are now of part of my playback system as an auxiliary low end system. I have a Crown VFX2A active cross over that I use with them . I love those speakers ! they are powered by an old Yamaha P2200 They can add low end supplement to my JBL 4411 's; those are also tuned port enclosures ! Terry , I believe we are similar in age and thus have the benefit of having experienced the same trends in High end and Pro audio design. Engineering trends in this field have gone through some interesting changes, some of which I like and some not as much. Currently infinite baffle designs with multiple small Bass drivers are the trend that require "Mass Quantities" of wattage are trendy. Do you remember the Altec Lansing A7 ? Now you know I am really a Dinosaur _____________ with G.A.S. _______ LOL Thanks for mentioning Theile& Small and thanks for helping me recollect and Digress _______ Sonic Regards _______ | ||
| benson_murrensun
Advanced Member Username: benson_murrensun Post Number: 276 Registered: 5-2007 |
Danno said, "To answer your question about the heads sound with diff. cabs. Absolutely." I agree as well. I used to have an Ampeg SVT 8 X 10 cab with the SVT head. I tried the cab with an Eden 400 watt head and it sound WAY different. And not in a good way, I might add... | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 956 Registered: 5-2009 |
When I used the SVT 8X10 I used it with a GK 800 RB . I did NOT like the way that it sounded with the SVT 400T. Of all of my Enclosures that have multiple 10's I like My MESA 4/10 Road Ready loaded with the EV 10's the best! | ||
| benson_murrensun
Advanced Member Username: benson_murrensun Post Number: 277 Registered: 5-2007 |
I like my Acmes for 10" speakers. | ||
| paulman
Senior Member Username: paulman Post Number: 433 Registered: 2-2005 |
My bass player uses 1 2x15 sealed cabinet (JBL's) with 4 1x18 folded horn subs (Black Widow's). Powered by a Peavy Firebass 700 and a Crown K2, respectively. It gets mighty loooooowwww  | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 708 Registered: 10-2006 |
"...it's design gained the moniker "Earthquake"; it projected an astounding amount of air with so much force...." So named because they were originally designed for installation in theaters for the first run of the movie Earthquake, the idea being to make the sound track actually shake the seats; oh yeah, they do move some air! Haven't seen/heard one in decades; hang on to that puppy (or e-mail me for my shipping address.... ). Peter | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 960 Registered: 5-2009 |
Peter___ are you really interested in that Speaker enclosure? shipping would be High $. That Dual throat folded horn( earthquake) has quite a bit of history. Before I owned it it belonged to Tom Coster while he was playing keyboards with Santana.It went on their World Tour. Around 1981 I was at S.I.R. (studio instrument rentals) and I came across a list of equipment for sale , on it along with a multitude of many other items( including a pair of 8X10 SVT cabs) were 2 of these speaker enclosures , the catch was that you HAD to buy both of them. One of them had The 18"Cerwin-Vega Driver and the other the 18"JBL. I quickly made a call and sold the one with the Cerwin -Vega to a friend and I bought the one with the JBL. One of these days I am going to rent a big hall and have and have a JAM . I will hook up the SVT 8X10 ,Mesa 4x10 and the Earth Quake up to the same Bass rig. May be TrI amped maybe Bi amped maybe Full range . I may even hook up some old ALEMBIC A15's & an A18 ! we could mix and match and experiment ! We could REALLY move some air !!!!!!! LOL !!!!!!!!!!! Rumble Fest !!!!!!!! | ||
| elwoodblue
Senior Member Username: elwoodblue Post Number: 1054 Registered: 6-2002 |
Sensurround! | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 962 Registered: 5-2009 |
Elwoodblue _ Thanks for that link_ now you have REALLY have me going down memory lane. I may now even hook up that enclosure to my bench test oscillator and an amplifier and do subsonic frequency sweeps below and around 16 HZ . _ "There will be a whole lotta shakin going on "______ I love it _____ LOL ! | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 709 Registered: 10-2006 |
I'd love to get an Earthquake, Wolf, but my current less-than-optimal employment situation dictates caution (thoguh donations are welcome....) And to make it even more fun, the Mrs. gets consolodated out of her gig end of June. She's a top-notch call-center manager, if anybody knows anybody looking for same. So - for now just hang on to it; when the climate changes, who knows? Peter | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 963 Registered: 5-2009 |
Peter , I can did it ____ I hope that your financial scene will brighten up soon . I take it that that you are feeling better health wise as well . | ||
| cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member Username: cozmik_cowboy Post Number: 711 Registered: 10-2006 |
Yes, thanks, Wolf - after much testing it was determined to have been a "false heart attack", of which my cardio says "It happens - we can't explain it." I've never heard of it, but I'll take it; the heart & arteries show absolutely no signs of belonging to a 54-y-o ex-smoker with a passion for sausage & cheese, nor have there been further episodes. Peter | ||
| sonicus
Senior Member Username: sonicus Post Number: 965 Registered: 5-2009 |
That's Good news Peter ! 54 ? __so you were born in 1956 ? Me too ! Cheers !!! | ||
| terryc
Senior Member Username: terryc Post Number: 1203 Registered: 11-2004 |
Sonicus, Lansing!!! Now you are going back a bit! Those folded horns are incredibly good but a right pain to contruct, I made one for a friend, it tested my patience to the limit get each piece to fit and be air tight | ||
| terryc
Senior Member Username: terryc Post Number: 1204 Registered: 11-2004 |
Sonicus, Lansing!!! Now you are going back a bit! Those folded horns are incredibly good but a right pain to construct, I made one for a friend, it tested my patience to the limit get each piece to fit and be air tight | ||
| glocke
Senior Member Username: glocke Post Number: 727 Registered: 9-2002 |
Last weekend I played through someone elses rig, that consisted of a bergantino 2x10 and an SWR 1x15. Normally I use a 1x15, 2x15, or 2x12 depending on the gig. I found it really, really hard to get a well rounded tone with the 10's present. Everything I tried tended to sound way kind of harsh and nothing had the sort of smoothness Ive come to expect from 15's or a 2x12. Since this wasnt my first experience with 10's Ive really come to find that I have a hard time getting a good tone from them. They might work for others, but they sure dont work for me. | ||
| 88persuader
Advanced Member Username: 88persuader Post Number: 386 Registered: 5-2004 |
Played through a new Peavey TNT Tour 115 today with a rock band. 1X15 plus a horn at around 220WTs. HATED the sound! The 15 was mushy and the horn was brittle. I played the same amp with a 2X10 extension cab so it's 2X10 and 1X15 (plus 2 horns) at 300 WTS RMS. MUCH better than the single 15 and horn and because the 2X10s adds mid punch I'm able to cut the treble and reduce the horns. (I could shut them off but lowering the top end does the trick) So MY best sound experienced so far are from 1X15 plus 2X10 OR 4X10 like I use to run with an Ampeg SVT half stack. (Of course that was 4 ohms and bridged to push 1350WTS ... that's a LOT of head room!) | ||
| 2400wattman
Senior Member Username: 2400wattman Post Number: 801 Registered: 11-2005 |
I've moved on to Bag End cabs but I still like these. Get down!!!  | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 9326 Registered: 5-2002 |
Nice shirt! |
