| Author | Message | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 633 Registered: 1-2008 |
I'm starting to play with a few guys here in Knoxville in a "Blues, Motown, Light Jazz, etc" project. The other players are WAY better than me and are able to do things like transpose keys without giving it a second thought. I'm going to be struggling to keep-up while I get used to the music (I've NEVER played this kind of stuff before) and the need to be able to play in any key has me intimidated. I'm thinking of trying BEAD tuning on my Orion (34") with the thought that I can play higher on the neck and avoid open strings... that way I can just move the patterns up and down the neck. My question: What's the lightest gauge "B" string that any of you have (successfully) used? | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1475 Registered: 9-2002 |
Mike, I play only five-strings, but the lightest I've used was a .125". However, get in touch with our friend Will Gunn (our erstwhile Alembic dealer in sunny Iowa): Will is an encyclopedia of all things Alembic and has recently returned to four-strings tuned BEAD. I'm sure he'll have lots of insight into this process. On my fives, first position easily morphs into playing the same thing in second position (that is, the stuff at the nut revolving around open E and A easily moves up the neck playing in the same keys from E on the B-string). Plus the occasional things in E-flat, D, require no tuning-down, at which I'm useless. Also, from a Nashville perspective, making your charts in the number system breaks you of thinking in keys. . . . if that's comfortable for you. J o e y | ||
| jazzyvee
Senior Member Username: jazzyvee Post Number: 2090 Registered: 6-2002 |
What is the numbers system Joey? I've never heard of it. Jazzyvee | ||
| jet_powers
Senior Member Username: jet_powers Post Number: 505 Registered: 2-2003 |
As our old friend Paul the Bad one used to say.... I-V I-V I-V I-V | ||
| bigredbass
Senior Member Username: bigredbass Post Number: 1476 Registered: 9-2002 |
Jazzy, it's a notation system developed in Nashville by the players that based the chord changes on the scale steps from the key the tune is performed in. Say you've got a basic tune in E Major, the usual E-A-B change would be expressed as I-IV-V. It gets as complicated as you want to make it, but that's the basic concept. You then approach tunes the same way you learned scales, arpeggios, etc.: You play the same 'shapes' in your fingering starting from whatever key you're playing in. Then you think of it that way as opposed to a certain key, position on the neck, etc. Admittedly, it works best with easier idoms, country, blues, etc. Might not be the best thing for complicated jazz, though I know guys that do it quite well. This always worked for me, as with guitar/bass necks everything fingers the same way, unless you're at the nut or the high end of the fingerboard; you just shift up or down the neck to be in the right key. I came from a keyboard background, where the difference in say, C Major versus C# Major is a HUGE dfference technique-wise because it's virtually no black keys (C) versus almost all black keys (C#). Amazingly it was hard to not still think that way on a guitar, for me. If you do a web search for 'Nashville Number System', you'll find several sites that explain it better than I can. J o e y (Message edited by bigredbass on August 20, 2010) | ||
| afrobeat_fool
Advanced Member Username: afrobeat_fool Post Number: 233 Registered: 7-2009 |
It is also much easier on the bandstand to yell "go to the 5" instead of saying "go to Eb7" or "D major 7 raised 11", or " G 13 flat 5" etc.... Nick | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 610 Registered: 11-2005 |
We use this extensively onstage. My singer is fond of springing tunes we've never played on us in the middle of a set, but he also is really good at throwing up hand signals for the various numbers so I can follow the changes. | ||
| pace
Senior Member Username: pace Post Number: 596 Registered: 4-2004 |
Also, when transposing on the fly, knowing the circle of 5ths/4ths & key sigs comes in handy.... if the bandleader gives you a thumb-up followed by 3 fingers, you know it's in A (up in the circle, 3sharps). If it's a thumb-down followed by 3 fingers, you know it's in Eb (down in the circle, C,F,Bb,Eb).... | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 634 Registered: 1-2008 |
I just tried a set of .110s... no way that's going to work. I'm guessing a .125 will be the lightest "B" that will generate an actual discernible note. | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 612 Registered: 11-2005 |
Whoops...double tap (Message edited by crgaston on August 21, 2010) | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 613 Registered: 11-2005 |
Hi Mike. I like .128's or .130's on my 35" scale 5's. .125's feel too floppy and are thin sounding to my ears. If you like, send me your address (Email is in my profile) and I'll send you an old set so you can see what you think about the size. Switching to BEAD will probably be putting less tension on your neck than EADG, so you may want to consider slightly heavier strings for that tuning. I suspect any decent luthier could file a replacement for the removeable part of the nut out of brass so you could keep the original one standard. | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 635 Registered: 1-2008 |
Thanks for the offer Charles. I actually have some 130's for my 6 string. I was just hoping that I could use something smaller. I guess the way to handle this situation is to start trying to actually play my 6 string (but I hate the feel of the "B" on it too!!!). | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 616 Registered: 11-2005 |
Don't know what kind of 6 you have, but I've never met a 34" low B that I liked much. The extra inch helps a lot. And I also like to jack the b-string bridge saddle up a bit higher than normal so I don't have to tiptoe quite as much on it. I still can't dig in as hard as the rest of the strings, but it does help. I'm thinking we have very different styles, though, so my advice might not be worth a hill of beans to you. :-) Good luck. | ||
| mike1762
Senior Member Username: mike1762 Post Number: 636 Registered: 1-2008 |
It's a Carvin LB76. If I had it to do over, I would have gone with a 35" scale. | ||
| crgaston
Senior Member Username: crgaston Post Number: 617 Registered: 11-2005 |
Oh man ,how I drooled over those Carvin catalogs with my buddies back in the early '90's. We were all starving musicians back then and those instruments were SO out of reach. Sounds like you need a Modulus 5-string for this gig!  And don't worry about the keys. With a little practice you will be transposing with no problem. Maybe start by taking songs you know well and playing them in different keys? Your hands will know what to do. |
