A question of ethics. Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Alembic Club » Miscellaneous » Archive through March 11, 2011 » A question of ethics. « Previous Next »

Author Message
svlilioukalani
Member
Username: svlilioukalani

Post Number: 83
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:06 am:   Edit Post

I was in a reputable vintage guitar shop last week. While talking to the owner, he told me about a Alembic bass the he acquired over 10 years ago. He explained after he checked with Alembic, 10 years ago, he discovered it was a stolen bass. He said that, the nice people at alembic informed him he bought a hot bass. It was stolen from a famous bass man we all know. And I checked the serial number and it is stolen.

The bass is a full sized series 2 with an omega cut out. The DS5 power supply no longer exists. So, I was never able to hear it. It looks and plays like a dream.

I donít know if it use batteries or not. I never looked at the guts.

The owner said he can legally sell the ďhot bassĒ because the state statute of limitations is up. The bass is currently not for sale; however, he sort of trying to sell it to me.

It breaks my heart to see a bass like this just sitting. Yet I donít want the bad Karma of owning as hot bass.

So I am wondering what the opinion of this forumís members on this subject.
hg30904
Member
Username: hg30904

Post Number: 88
Registered: 6-2003
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:27 am:   Edit Post

I may be biased as I have been the victim of theft before, but it seems like the owner of this shop totally has no ethics. It appears that he could have facilitated the return 10 years ago, but he hid the item (not selling it) and deprived someone of their rightful property.

Lawyers can chime in here, but it seems like the owner is no friend of musicians.

Expose the shop so we will all know who not to do business with!

(just my opinion...subject to editing by moderators)
keith_h
Senior Member
Username: keith_h

Post Number: 1672
Registered: 2-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:28 am:   Edit Post

He doesn't sound very reputable to me by sitting on a known stolen bass waiting for the statute of limitations to run out.

Is the original owner aware of where the bass is? How about the insurance company that might have covered the instrument? I would think they get first crack at recovering it.

Keith
pas
Advanced Member
Username: pas

Post Number: 254
Registered: 3-2003
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:57 am:   Edit Post

Without hesitation...the guy is a CROOK...report him. The bass needs to be returned to it's legal and rightful owner. Where is the ambiguity in doing the right thing...?
chuck
Advanced Member
Username: chuck

Post Number: 249
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 6:11 am:   Edit Post

This person has knowingly been in possesion of stolen goods for 10 years.I doubt that the statue has run out since he has been commiting a crime every day it is in his possesion.

Chuck.
svlilioukalani
Member
Username: svlilioukalani

Post Number: 85
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 6:25 am:   Edit Post

Not to defend this shop owner, but he did contact Alembic. And as I understand it I was not possable to contact the owner of the bass as he is a big time pro. The shop owner said he hope to sell it back to the origional owner. He only showed me the bass cause he know how I feel about alembic bass.
lbpesq
Senior Member
Username: lbpesq

Post Number: 4732
Registered: 7-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 7:03 am:   Edit Post

1. While I am not a Washington attorney and don't know the specifics of Washington law. I would assume that the statute of limitations on the theft of the bass may have run, However, this guy didn't steal it, he's in possession of the bass. Knowing possession of stolen property is a crime in California and likely so in Washington. Of that offense he is currently guilty.

2. The legal owner of the instrument is a big time famous bass player, but it is IMPOSSIBLE to get in touch for the purpose of returning the bass? I just don't find such an excuse credible.

I might consider contacting the "famous bassist", giving him a head's up on the location of his lost bass, and then let nature take its course. And I would never again refer to the store as "a reputable vintage guitar shop".

Bill, tgo
sonicus
Senior Member
Username: sonicus

Post Number: 1583
Registered: 5-2009
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 7:29 am:   Edit Post

Yes , I agree with Bill . Personally I would be in favor to reunite the Bass with the rightful owner as well.
smokinbear
Intermediate Member
Username: smokinbear

Post Number: 114
Registered: 11-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:01 am:   Edit Post

Whats the serial #? Can it be discretely located and then posted here for all to see? What kind of douchebag music store owner could do this??? I hope karma gets him. What is the name of the store so we can all harass it!!!! Just kidding, the universe will fix things eventually. People get hit by busses, grand pianos fall on them or maybe a big Acme safe like in bugs bunny etc. I just find this so wrong to hear about theivery like this.....End Rant Bear
speicky
Senior Member
Username: speicky

Post Number: 429
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:07 am:   Edit Post

I once bought a bass that was stolen from his rightful owner. Some thief broke into his van, removed the bass and sold it on ebay. I "purchased" it, not knowing of the theft, and picked it up in person.

When I tried to turn it over about six months later, the owner spotted the auction and accused me for being the helping hand of the thief. Boy, was I in trouble in the first place, till I could explain to the police that I was a victim.

The point I am trying to make: Gary, please contact the police and tell them about this bass. Since you know the salesman and the story, you could else be in serious legal trouble also, now that it is all public, for everybody to read.

I keep my fingers crossed for you,
all the best, Christian

(Message edited by Speicky on February 02, 2011)
cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member
Username: cozmik_cowboy

Post Number: 869
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:39 am:   Edit Post

Just to reiterate:
"Reputable"? By no stretch of the imagination. Identify this scumbag, to us, to the rightful owner, and to the authorities.

"A question of ethics"? The only question is do you have them, because this festering pus-bag doesn't. There is only one proper course of action here, and it is self-evident. See above.

"Can't contact him because he's well-known"? Excuse me, but wouldn't that make him easier to find? Do it.

This needle-d*cked bug-f*cker and his ilk are, at least as much as the actual thief (which he might well be), the reason no one's instrument is safe. You have the power to put a stop to it. Are you one of the good guys, or no different than him? Man up.

Peter
811952
Senior Member
Username: 811952

Post Number: 1903
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:48 am:   Edit Post

This guy is a thief. Period. You've let the cat out of the bag already, so you might as well tell us (and, more importantly, the police) what's going on.

He's hoping to sell the bass back to the original owner from which it was stolen? Complete and utter scumbag.

John
chuck
Advanced Member
Username: chuck

Post Number: 250
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:49 am:   Edit Post

From talk bass forum posted 3/29/04,
series ll and other gear stolen from Frank Kern in Bellingham Wa.

Chuck

Evil will triump when good people do nothing.
chuck
Advanced Member
Username: chuck

Post Number: 251
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 9:02 am:   Edit Post

Also the second bass listed on this website in the stolen basses section,
Does it look like the one.

Chuck.
lbpesq
Senior Member
Username: lbpesq

Post Number: 4734
Registered: 7-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 9:07 am:   Edit Post

Gary:

I doubt that you yourself are in any legal jeopardy merely based on your knowledge. If anything were to come up, or you have any questions relevant to Washington law, contact me and I can put you in touch with some great defense lawyers in Seattle, one of whom is also a guitar player.

Bill, tgo
lembic76450
Advanced Member
Username: lembic76450

Post Number: 270
Registered: 5-2002
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 9:28 am:   Edit Post

Guys, Franks bass is not an Omega as stated in the original post. Gary, do the right thing here. Imagine if it were yours. The owner of the store is no friend of yours or any musician. Bad Karma stains all those around it.

(Message edited by lembic76450 on February 02, 2011)
pauldo
Senior Member
Username: pauldo

Post Number: 557
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:15 am:   Edit Post

Hear Hear - to the above posts!
Maybe the store owner or you can not get in touch with the 'star' - but I am sure Mica can.

Give up the ghost and tell us the store - peer pressure can often convince bad people to do the right thing. And isn't that what we need more of in today's world - people doing the right thing?
terryc
Senior Member
Username: terryc

Post Number: 1489
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:27 am:   Edit Post

I thought that is why all our Alembics have serial numbers registered to us the owners..to stop this happening..for a dealer to do hold onto a registered stolen instrument is really misuse of trust and puts his reputation in jeopardy.
He really needs a wake up call on this.
I wonder who the anonymous 'famous bass player' is..certainly has my interest??
benson_murrensun
Senior Member
Username: benson_murrensun

Post Number: 409
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:28 am:   Edit Post

More than I am a bass player I am a motorcycle rider. My very first bike was stolen from me, way back in 1977. It still stings. I still want it back. There is no statute of limitations, as far as I am concerned.
briant
Senior Member
Username: briant

Post Number: 531
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:31 am:   Edit Post

"I was in a reputable vintage guitar shop last week."

Emerald City Guitars

One of the only reputable ones in Seattle that the owner is fairly consistently there that I can think of.

Whoever this person is he is a worthless scumbag and I want to know the shop so I never go there again. I refuse to support anyone who has no ethics.
lembic76450
Advanced Member
Username: lembic76450

Post Number: 271
Registered: 5-2002
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:43 am:   Edit Post

You know, I sure hope that it isn't Jimmy Johnson's 1st 5 string. The man has some of the best Karma on the internet. Fess up lad.
jazzyvee
Senior Member
Username: jazzyvee

Post Number: 2316
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 11:57 am:   Edit Post

I bought a fretless guitar from a shop in the UK called Cash Converters about 8 years ago and soon after that I contacted the manufacturer of the guitar with the serial number to get some history on it. I got a brisk email back telling me that the guitar belonged to the company and that it was had been "lent" to a guitarist in a very big international rock band here in the UK and that I must send it back to him.

I contacted the police about this and was told that since I bought it legitimately and paid a good price for it as a used instrument, I should advise the manufacturer that if they felt it was theirs then they should take steps to persue it through the legal process.

I wrote back and never heard any more from the company, and I still have the guitar.

Jazzyvee
bsee
Senior Member
Username: bsee

Post Number: 2525
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 12:58 pm:   Edit Post

Alembic's stolen instrument list only has two SII instruments. JJ's fiver and 89-5429. There may be others, but I would think they would be listed if they were known to Alembic as stolen.

I don't know what the legalities are with regard to ownership once an instrument is stolen. If an insurance company pays off, do they become the rightful owners? If the statute has run out, that may eliminate the law's interest in the person as a criminal, but does it mean that he can now keep the instrument?

Of course, if the story is accurate, the ethics are clear. I doubt anyone can speak highly of someone who would receive stolen property and conceal it until it was safe to move. Isn't that the definition of a "fence"?

On the other hand, the ethical alternative isn't exactly fair. If he bought the bass at a fair price in good faith, he shouldn't have to eat that entire cost and hand it over. One would hope someone's insurance policy would provide relief. If, however, he bought the bass at a super low price and should have known something was fishy, then that just adds to the condemnation of the proprietor's ethics.

The hardest thing to believe in this whole story is that he told Alembic he had the bass ten years ago and he still has it today. I would have expected Alembic to jump all over such a report and inform the rightful owner. It's not out of the question that this happened and the rightful owner preferred the insurance payout to chasing down the instrument. Another ethical question there as well...

-bob
hydrargyrum
Senior Member
Username: hydrargyrum

Post Number: 914
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 2:53 pm:   Edit Post

I know that if my guitar was stolen I would never forget it, and I would never stop considering to be my guitar. I also feel sorry for anyone who innocently purchases a stolen instrument, as they are the ultimate victim of the thief's lack of integrity, if the owner is found. I would hope that a business could write of such an expense as a loss, but I don't know if it is the case.
chuck
Advanced Member
Username: chuck

Post Number: 252
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 2:58 pm:   Edit Post

If the insurance co. has paid out it is the property of the insurance co.
If there was no insurance it remains the owners property.

Chuck.
afrobeat_fool
Advanced Member
Username: afrobeat_fool

Post Number: 290
Registered: 7-2009
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 3:32 pm:   Edit Post

I see in another post you were at guitarville. If this is the place that has the SII than tell us and we will do something about it.
elwoodblue
Senior Member
Username: elwoodblue

Post Number: 1181
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 3:40 pm:   Edit Post

That's what I was thinking. I stopped shopping there years ago.
mica
Moderator
Username: mica

Post Number: 7205
Registered: 6-2000
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 4:13 pm:   Edit Post

Gary - please email me the serial number/name of the store so I can get the bass in the right hands.

Stolen instrument recovery is truly one of the best parts of my job. I love reuniting a bass with its long lost owner. Sometimes, it does get tricky, especially after a long time has passed.

I've had to start thinking about what we need to do on our stolen instrument roster. What happens after the statute of limitations is over? Should it still be considered stolen? Well, of course I consider it stolen until it's returned to its rightful owner, but the police don't always see it that way.

I also have empathy for those innocents that wind up buying something and then discover it was stolen. What a horrible, awful feeling that must be. It's hard to have pity for someone that waits out a legal statute knowingly. The story in the original post doesn't ring a bell.

Recently, the location of a stolen bass was reported to me, but the owner's phone number does not accept incoming calls. I sent a letter to the address we had - he no longer lives there and there is no forwarding. He's changed jobs, so I've asked his former co-workers to try and reach him on my behalf. The police are trying to assist, and I have a good and dedicated detective working to help, but it seems it was never reported stolen to the police, so there is only so much she can do (but she's trying to locate the owner (there are bass players everywhere, even police detectives)). This is very frustrating! This is not the bass referred to in the original post.

I'm thinking to add the date stolen to the roster, and write about how even if an instrument can legally be traded after a certain period of time after it was stolen, it's still a part of that instrument's history, and the owner it was stolen from probably still wants it back. Good deeds are rewarded!
pace
Senior Member
Username: pace

Post Number: 669
Registered: 4-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:10 pm:   Edit Post

"He explained after he checked with Alembic, 10 years ago, he discovered it was a stolen bass. He said that, the nice people at alembic informed him he bought a hot bass."

I have a feeling the above "story" is complete BS....

Put yourself in the victim's shoes, Gary. First, I wouldn't have posted the details.... I'd have contacted Mica via phone right away. Second, I'd have tried to put a cash deposit on the instrument if honestly "however, he sort of trying to sell it to me. " Just so that it doesn't "disappear" into the netherworld again....

If I was in the original owner's shoes, I'd hope that the members of this wonderful community would do the same for me....

PS: Lembic76-450 said "I sure hope that it isn't Jimmy Johnson's 1st 5 string." I actually hope that it IS JJ's bass! That would be one of the greatest reunions that the f-clef has ever seen!!!!!

(Message edited by pace on February 02, 2011)
crobbins
Senior Member
Username: crobbins

Post Number: 782
Registered: 6-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:14 pm:   Edit Post

There must be some effort to return this bass to it's rightful owner.
svlilioukalani
Member
Username: svlilioukalani

Post Number: 86
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:19 pm:   Edit Post

You have all jumped to a dangerous conclusion. As I understand this; the police notified the store owner he bought a hot bass.

In the state of Washington, pawn shops and guitar shops must register the serial number of the items they purchase. The item then can not be sold for 3 months. So it was the police that notified the store owner he was ripped off. The police were never able to contact the person who reported the bass stolen.

So, as I understand this, the store owner was as much a victim, as the man who was originally ripped off. The shop owner was stuck with a bass he can not sell. He was forced to eat the loss and warehoused the bass.

He moved the shop recently and found the bass hidden back in a corner, it has sat there for 10 years.

The store owner who has never been to the Alembic Web site did call and talk to, as he said, "a very nice young lady". Who informed him who the bass originally belonged to.

So.... As I get this, this bass is sitting in limbo.

I have contacted Mica.
crobbins
Senior Member
Username: crobbins

Post Number: 783
Registered: 6-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:25 pm:   Edit Post

If a person believes in karma, there is only one thing a person can do.
pace
Senior Member
Username: pace

Post Number: 670
Registered: 4-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 5:33 pm:   Edit Post

"So it was the police that notified the store owner he was ripped off."

Are you certain of this????

"guitar shops must register the serial number of the items they purchase. The item then can not be sold for 3 months."

REALLY???? hmmmm...... I don't believe this is true for instrument retailers. Pawn shops, 30 days out here on the east coast.

"The police were never able to contact the person who reported the bass stolen."

OK, I'll bite and say MAYBE..... yet you say that the police "notified the store owner that HE was ripped off"

"He moved the shop recently and found the bass hidden back in a corner, "

Gee.... "HIDDEN"... I wonder why?!?!?!????

"I have contacted Mica."

Finally, common sense prevails.
mica
Moderator
Username: mica

Post Number: 7206
Registered: 6-2000
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 6:34 pm:   Edit Post

I have contact details for everyone involved and you know I will be contacting them all, so please just stay tuned for updates if you're interested.

I am explicitly requesting that nobody try and "help" me by contacting a shopkeeper about this matter. I really appreciate it!
3rd_ray
Advanced Member
Username: 3rd_ray

Post Number: 233
Registered: 2-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 6:48 pm:   Edit Post

Good luck Mica! And right on Gary - you did the right thing.
thumbsup
Advanced Member
Username: thumbsup

Post Number: 203
Registered: 7-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 8:44 pm:   Edit Post

"So it was the police that notified the store owner he was ripped off. The police were never able to contact the person who reported the bass stolen."
That wasn't mentioned in the 1st post.
So am I to understand since the police could'nt contact the person that reported the theft, the police could not conficate the stolen property. Very Cconvienent!
Smells A Little!
Not sure about how police conduct thefts there....but most eveywhere the item would have been confiscated from pawn shop/store as evidence etc...
quote "As I understand this the police notified the store owner he bought a hot bass."
As for pawns the ticket holder usually has 90 days to pay the pawn amount and reeem the item and after 90 days the item can be sold! . .. .......
"guitar shops must register the serial number of the items they purchase. The item then can not be sold for 3 months." ......
I believe that only applies to pawn shops ..a little more BS. (ok I could be wrong here,but it dont make sence) I've bought many guitars taken on trade within days.
Its a bass guitar, not a fire arm! If he contacted Alembic and was told it was stolen just futher goes to show his true caracter and his lame excuse "could'nt locate owner"
Smells a lot fishy now! In any part ...if the store owner knew even after the fact....
I just don't buy that he stored it aways for ten years and forgot about it and mysteriously found it ten years later! As was previously stated..this "famous" picker could have easlily been located...The story stinks....
Joey, thanks for doing the right thing! Won't it feel great to have helped reunite the original owner with his child
Vintage shops are notorious for huge mark up!
This shop owner may be the victim of his own greed.
just my thoughts
Steve

(Message edited by thumbsup on February 02, 2011)

(Message edited by thumbsup on February 02, 2011)
thumbsup
Advanced Member
Username: thumbsup

Post Number: 204
Registered: 7-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2011 - 9:55 pm:   Edit Post

Mike (Joey not:-)) thanks for doing the right thing and reporting to Mica!
And Gary for bringing this to attention.
I'm sure it will feel great to have helped reunite the original owner with his child.
Imagine how he will feel!
Being the victim of a stolen bass I can not help but be bias.
I do believe the board has spoken.
A snake in the grass is hard to see til you get bit!
Vintage shops are notorious for huge mark up!
Not that there's anything wrong with that...it'a a business!
This shop owner may have become the victim of his own greed....
or could there possibly be a sliver of truth to the story..who knows....sometimes its easy to jump on the band wagon or get rail roaded!
The most important thing is the reunite!
just my thoughts
Steve

(Message edited by thumbsup on February 02, 2011)
glocke
Senior Member
Username: glocke

Post Number: 825
Registered: 9-2002
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2011 - 2:46 am:   Edit Post

Hopefully when all is said and done we will know who got their bass back, and which bass shop to not purchase from ?

As far as I am concerned, if the shop owner checked with Alembic ten years ago and had the bass identified as stolen and did nothing, than he is just as guilty as the original thief.

Hang him by his thumbs I say!
funkyjazzjunky
Senior Member
Username: funkyjazzjunky

Post Number: 673
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2011 - 1:42 pm:   Edit Post

It seems funny to me. Does it make sense that the police had a record of the bass being reported stolen, but no idea how to contact the person that reported it stolen?

That store owner does not seem to be a victim as much as an accomplice after the fact.

VMG

(Message edited by FunkyJazzJunky on February 03, 2011)
mica
Moderator
Username: mica

Post Number: 7209
Registered: 6-2000
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2011 - 4:02 pm:   Edit Post

I'm working on this - talking to everyone involved. There's lots to it, and at this point from my interactions I don't think there is any intentional wrongdoing here. Maybe I'll have it all figured out in the next couple of days and I hope to report a happy ending for everyone.
peoplechipper
Advanced Member
Username: peoplechipper

Post Number: 238
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, February 09, 2011 - 1:52 am:   Edit Post

I work in a pawnshop, and we have hoops to jump through, which is fine and appropriate...thankfully we don't have to deal with the cops very often, but it is amazing how different departments don't talk to each other, or different cities don't coordinate...I know that if they can't find the owner here of stolen stuff, it ends up in the police auction, so I guess it's a bonus if the owner/victim has moved...and things get lost/forgotten in pawnshops; not usually 10 years, but it would depend on the size and age, and # of staff at the shop...if it's been around forever, stuff gets forgotten in corners...like any warehouse...
I'm not trying to whitewash here, just pointing out how it could be...Tony.
bsee
Senior Member
Username: bsee

Post Number: 2530
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 09, 2011 - 6:06 am:   Edit Post

Many places make you do an annual inventory and pay taxes on whatever you're holding at the first of the year. One would think an instrument that should be on the books for a couple thousand at least would have a hard time slipping through the cracks. It would have to be one very large and casually operated business for an item of that value to go missing without notice.

If the deal was above-board, it would also be one of the most valuable instruments in the store, and possibly one of the most unusual and attractive. Wouldn't it be an item to be shown off? An item that a shop owner would want customers to see? An item to be moved to recover all that capital and make a fair profit? If I had a shop, that bass wouldn't spend a minute longer in a back room than required by any local holding laws.

-bob
thumbsup
Advanced Member
Username: thumbsup

Post Number: 234
Registered: 7-2008
Posted on Wednesday, February 09, 2011 - 8:21 pm:   Edit Post

Hum.....Is ten years a local holding law?
Looks like a duck, Quacks like a duck.....
bsee
Senior Member
Username: bsee

Post Number: 2542
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Thursday, February 17, 2011 - 10:32 am:   Edit Post

I was hoping we'd have a resolution by now...
phylo
Intermediate Member
Username: phylo

Post Number: 145
Registered: 10-2005
Posted on Friday, February 18, 2011 - 10:35 am:   Edit Post

as in a hanging?

Sounds like this guy has already been tried and convicted.
bsee
Senior Member
Username: bsee

Post Number: 2543
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Friday, February 18, 2011 - 2:28 pm:   Edit Post

No- more like some good news that an owner was reconnected with a stolen instrument after 10+ years. Don't really care much one way or the other about a dealer 3000 miles away. Hang or reward him as you see fit. I figured that Mica getting involved two weeks ago should have had things moved well along by now. Maybe not.
hydrargyrum
Senior Member
Username: hydrargyrum

Post Number: 916
Registered: 3-2004
Posted on Friday, February 18, 2011 - 2:41 pm:   Edit Post

Personally I don't see what all the fuss is here. If Mica says she's got things under control, I'm sure that everything is being done that is possible. I'd like to see this guy get his bass back also, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, and after ten years a few days (or even a few weeks) aren't really going to make that much difference. Patience is the only course of action here until Mica decides to share more information.
dfung60
Senior Member
Username: dfung60

Post Number: 481
Registered: 5-2002
Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 8:51 pm:   Edit Post

On a totally random note, I've been cleaning out a big pile of old guitar magazines this week and happened to see an old Gibson ad with a bunch of sunburst Les Pauls (it was the collection of Gary Richrath who used to play in REO Speedwagon, so you can get a sense of how old the pile I'm digging in is). This got me reminiscing on Google about famous Les Pauls, and eventually I looked up the famous Peter Green/Gary Moore "unburst" which is a cherry sunburst that's faded to amber.

And, on Google that led to this link, which I had never seen before:

http://guitarcollecting.co.uk/2009/05/20/ronnie-monrose-sues-gary-moore-over-theft-of-59-les-paul/

I mean no disrespect for the late Gary Moore, but it's interesting to see that a similar situation has popped up here with two famous guitarists.

The reason I mention it on this thread is the quote in the middle from the (famously unethical) Ed Roman, which sure seems closely tied to this thread. I'm sure it's random, but reflective of a dealer mentality that time makes these problems go away.

David Fung
lbpesq
Senior Member
Username: lbpesq

Post Number: 4761
Registered: 7-2004
Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 9:01 pm:   Edit Post

Wow, I didn't know Ed was a legal expert too! The man never ceases to amaze me! How did his store ever go out of business?

And as for Montrose, according to the story he drills a hole in every one of his guitars! The man almost deserves to lose it! And PLEASE, don't anyone sell him an Alembic for his next excavation project.

Bill, tgo
cozmik_cowboy
Senior Member
Username: cozmik_cowboy

Post Number: 891
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2011 - 5:15 am:   Edit Post

And a third famous guitartist, David. One of the players you mention (I'm not familiar with libel law, so I won't say which) received his first & most famous '59 LP from the teacher of a freind of mine just before his first national tour, with the promise of payment after. 10 years later he had not paid, and was denying the deal existed.

Peter
tubeperson
Intermediate Member
Username: tubeperson

Post Number: 145
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2011 - 8:46 am:   Edit Post

Perhaps Mr. Roman's store went out of business because he sold it to people to similar to him. You know, birds of a feather. There is an old salesman(person) joke is that a salesman(person) loves to sell to another saleman(person). I will say that I have had some decent dealings with Ed, although I felt compelled to buy the Alembic Triple Omega as I sensed he was no longer selling new Alembics. Sure enough, not only did he stop selling new ones, but he sort of bashed them in comparison to Dingwalls. What really happened was he made more money from selling Dingwalls. I contacted Mica about Ed's decision to stop repping Alembic new instrumens, and she did not know abot it at that time. Oh well!
billostech
Member
Username: billostech

Post Number: 81
Registered: 1-2011
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2011 - 9:12 am:   Edit Post

Ed states as much:
http://www.edroman.com/guitars/alembic.htm
thumbsup
Advanced Member
Username: thumbsup

Post Number: 259
Registered: 7-2008
Posted on Sunday, February 27, 2011 - 6:12 pm:   Edit Post

hum......It appears after reading some of Eds rant he didn't actualy knock Alembics but more of Alembics marketing which by the way is similar to how I market in my construction business! I always give the customer many options with a published cost. I think Alembics marketing monthly specials are unique and it apparently works for them quite well! If you have to wait a spell because of backlog orders why cahnge if it works.

I wonder whats up with the original story of this post? Any comments?

Topics | Last Day | Last Week | Tree View | Search | Help/Instructions | Program Credits Administration