| Author | Message | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3022 Registered: 6-2000 |
We received this bass at the very end of last year, and have been thinking of ways to repair it. This is bass 73-30, and it spent some time underwater after a hurricane. It is pretty badly damaged as you would expect.  Most obvious is the body laminations separating:  Kinda funky around the jacks:  Of course the bridge suffered some corrosion:  The plates need some help:   Peghead doesn't look bad from the front:  But on the back, the veneers are separating, though not really visible in this picture:  It's really hard to see how the neck shrunk in a picture, but here's a try:  So we've got several ideas on what to do here. I wish it never happened style: 1. replace the neck 2. saw the body apart, smooth gluing surfaces and add an accent laminate to make up the thickness 3. clean up the brass 4. refinish in oil 5. repair electronics I'm pretty sure we have a Maple/Purpleheart neck from 1976 that we could use on this project. We'd have to make a new neck to use the same woods as the original. Hurricane tribute style: 1. smooth the neck for playing 2. glue and clamp peghead joint 3. inject epoxy where the body lams are separating, but leave the separation as part of the history of the bass 4. clean up hardware to useable condition 5. repair electronics At least one person here wants to leave it alone, mount it like a trophy fish and leave it as a decoration. I personally vote for the first option, but you'll have to decide how aggressive you want us to be on the repair, Michael. It won't ever be the same, but we can make it a functioning part of your musical life again. | ||
| byoung
Intermediate Member Username: byoung Post Number: 189 Registered: 12-2004 |
My vote would be for the Hurricane tribute, provided it won't affect playability in any severe fashion. We all carry our scars, right? Brad | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 3079 Registered: 5-2002 |
Sigh ... | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 909 Registered: 7-2004 |
Michael: I saw you bass today while visiting at Alembic. What a trip! I thought it came through surprisingly well, considering the extended bath. If it were mine, I'd probably go the hurricane tribute route. It sort of reminds me of a number of years ago when I saw an ad for Mesa Boogie that depicted (I believe it was) Mac Davis' amp that survived the MGM Grand fire in Las Vegas, looked like hell, but still worked. Even with all the damage, it is still a very cool looking bass. I love the old ones. Bill, tgo | ||
| dela217
Senior Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 585 Registered: 6-2002 |
Of course I would like to see it perfect again, but I would hate for it to turn into George Washington's hatchet. I wish there was some way to resurrect it without replacing the neck. I know, that was an option in the tribute style. I just thought it could be sanded down and then the gaps glued and clamped around the body. I guess that would be tough though! I just was hoping the damage would not be visible. Oh well. Any more votes on the tribute style? Wish it never happened? Hindsight being 20/20, I know that this will not happen again! I have been through many hurricanes and have prepared better in the past. Next time ALL of the instruments are coming with us. | ||
| dela217
Senior Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 586 Registered: 6-2002 |
Hey! Just curious, do the electronics still work? I never tested it before I shipped it. Michael | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 637 Registered: 10-2003 |
My vote is for hurricane tribute style. Otherwise, you've pretty much replaced it with a new bass. Ultimately, if it's possible to saw it apart and do everything listed in the I Wish It Never Happened Style EXCEPT don't do a *new* neck and instead keep the old neck, then that would get my vote. Something of this sort was done on 811952 way back in the day (although they put a whole new body on my neck instead of reusing the unusable original body wood) and it worked out well. Regardless of what you ultimately decide, it's an incredible bass with an incredible history. I can only wish everyone else in your home town had fared so well. Glad you and it are still with us. John | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 978 Registered: 3-2004 |
Condolences seem to be flowing freely this month. Michael, I hope this was the worst of what you had to face. Good luck with the restoration! -Bob | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 979 Registered: 3-2004 |
Michael, I think the question has to come down to your intentions for the instrument. If it is a sentimental piece to be more cherished and displayed than played, I would lean toward keeping it as original as possible. If, on the other hand, you're planning on it being a serious player's instrument again, then I would take the advice of the Wickersham family in preserving as much as possible while returning it to top playing condition. I am afraid that would be the replacement neck route. If it were mine, I'd take the tribute route. If I wanted a playable bass, 70's vintage instruments come available regularly for less than it would likely cost to go the full restoration route. Just my opinion, follow your heart. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 639 Registered: 10-2003 |
Michael, It occurs to me that quite probably it will still be imminently playable if you do nothing more than fix the electronics, squirt some glue under the headstock lams and tweak the neck with some heat. That would make it truly a historical piece. Like Bob said, though, follow your heart. None of us can even remotely second-guess whatever you decide, especially given your well-documented commitment to these early instruments. It also occurs to me that if it were mine I'd really be tempted to play it out every chance I had, in as close of condition to it's present state as possible. A friend of mine has a huge (5/8th's) German upright that survived a couple of world wars, albeit with some significant burn marks. It is the absolute coolest bass I've ever touched, and it has been on fire. john (Message edited by 811952 on January 26, 2006) (Message edited by 811952 on January 26, 2006) | ||
| bigideas
Member Username: bigideas Post Number: 70 Registered: 1-2004 |
i vote tribute. to be honest, i love the way the finish on the bridge and tailpiece has changed. the green and gold of the tarnished brass look old and strong. (Message edited by bigideas on January 26, 2006) | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 981 Registered: 3-2004 |
Oh, I probably would break down and at least change the strings though... | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 640 Registered: 10-2003 |
 | ||
| jlpicard
Advanced Member Username: jlpicard Post Number: 330 Registered: 7-2002 |
Definitely Hurricane tribute. Replacing the neck to me makes it an different instrument. I wouldn't do it. So sorry Michael, I love the old ones too. | ||
| flaxattack
Senior Member Username: flaxattack Post Number: 923 Registered: 4-2004 |
flaxs 2 cents.... i would ebony fill the joints in - sand the neck, fix the back replace the rusty screws and remove just the rust off the bridge at the base- the saddles etc LEAVE - the bridge and tailpiece esp should stay as is,.,they're PATINATED PIECES- us stain glass guys kill for that color green- i think i might replace the plate in the center, but would leave the back- it has character- makes it looked very aged, replace the electrronics... all yours for $29.95....... | ||
| precarius
Junior Username: precarius Post Number: 45 Registered: 11-2005 |
I vote for Hurricane tribute also. I wouldn't care if they took it all apart and put it back together but using all the same pieces as much as possible. It would make a great story and a priceless heirloom. | ||
| precarius
Junior Username: precarius Post Number: 46 Registered: 11-2005 |
You could probably get a million dollars for it on E-Bay right now. | ||
| precarius
Junior Username: precarius Post Number: 49 Registered: 11-2005 |
I hate to ramble, but I just looked at the showcase and saw what this bass looked like to start with: http://alembic.com/club/messages/411/2435.html?1084807001 Wow. | ||
| palembic
Senior Member Username: palembic Post Number: 2247 Registered: 9-2002 |
Brother Michael ...good to hear from you. If you still have the samenumber: you will have me on the phone one of these days for a "homecoming" chat (btw: did the alligators in your backyard return too???) About this bass ...I'd like to share a story with you all. It will take some time so please sit back and relax if you want to read it. It has NOTHING to do with basses but my point will become clear soon enough (hehehehe ...I DO hope). This goes back to the period that I was a video producer. I was asked by the conservator Piet Chielens of the "In Flanders Field" Museum in Ieper (most Americans, Aussies and Great Commonwealth people will know it as 'Ypres') to make a documentary on "how to handle in an appropriate way the demolition or loss of a city". I was a little puzzled when he asked but he asked me on an evening to his place and over some whiskies he told me "A Tale of three ...four …five …whatever Cities". 1. The Ypres case: as you probably know the town of Ieper in the Western part of Flanders (near the French border there) was completely demolished after World War I. No stone was left upon the other and as was said " a horseman could oversee the total town from the back of his horse'. A lot of British gave their lives in that severe part of the this war and their was the strong claim of the British government to leave the town as it was ...in ruins. They asked to build a wall around it and keep it as a symbol for all the casualties fallen there and as an sign of honour for England (there was a young parliament member those days Winston Churchill -who fought the trenches of Ieper- who would liked it thatr way). The Belgian government couldn't live with such a symbol and they would give the town back to the people who lived there before and wipe the memory out. There was an architect asked to rebuild the town. Alas ...the architect was so full of ideas that he reconstructed a town that never has been in the past. He reconstructed he 'medieval look alike' town that has never been there. Ironically: historical research proved that just a FEW of the original people of Ieper came back to their town. The majority was fled to other towns in Flanders and started a new life during the war to forget what happened. Ieper became populated by adventurers and thos who had lost their live on other places. The Commonwealth War Grave Commission received pieces of land to organize war graves for the fallen soldies, the county of West Flanders is littered with wargraves and EACH of them is official BRITISH territory. Most known is the War Cemetry of Passendale. Please visit www.inflandersfields.be Today there is only ONE (just 1) trace of a shell impact visible in the town of Ieper, in a monastery wall behind the church. The town is rebuild to a copy of itself that never was or has been. 2. The Oradour-sur-Glane case Oradour is a small French town near Poitiers. As a revenge for being attacked by the French resistance, a batallion of SS-Tiger Tanks and SS troups entered the morning of 10 june 1944. All inhabitants were brought together in the church and slaughtered and the Tiger tanks raged through the town shooting and destroying. After these horrible happenings it seemed that NO ONE would touch the town anymore; nor Germans, nor French, nor resistance, nor Vichy-France, After the war the local authorities would love to start levelling the village and rebuild a new one. General Charles De Gaulle forbided personally to move one stone in that town. A wall was erected round Oradour and until today you can visit the town as a most macabre testimonial of the horrors of war.  3. The Coventry Case German air raids in WW II were also aimed at civil objectives: towns, cathedrals etc. The cathedral of Coventry was heavy bombed and demolished for a great part.  The British government decided to build a new cathedral but …functionally interweave the ruins of the old cathedral in the highly modern one that was to be build. Old is cherished in new, memories kept by moving on to something new but …with respect to the the functionality of the place: a house of God and forgiveness. Please see here http://www.know-britain.com/churches/coventry_cathedral_1.html I will stop here. My friend Piet told me that evening also about the fourth city Hiroshima where just the “Dome” left completely intact after the first atom bomb. And about a fifth city Rotterdam where the government decided to build a completely new city ready for the future. Until today Rotterdam is one of the most modern cities in the Netherlands. I can talk about Dresden in Germany and the firestorms after the bombing etc … You my brothers and sisters can talk about the horror-story on 9/11 in New York. We have difficulties to live with memories and make things work. Brother Michael …sorry for this looooooooooooo-oong typical Paul the bad one story. I felt like writing and sharing this morning. I leave it to your and Mica’s wisdom. Please remember one thing: the instrument is made to play upon. I know there are a lot of modern techniques but this bass will have a story to tell musically and just by being an object. With the skills of the Elfs at Alembic …it will turn out the right way …I just know that. Paul the bad one (Message edited by palembic on January 27, 2006) (Message edited by palembic on January 27, 2006) | ||
| jacko
Senior Member Username: jacko Post Number: 494 Registered: 10-2002 |
Micheal. I'd go for the Hurricane tribute - Just get the bass back to playing condition but leaving it with its battle scars. graeme | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 3081 Registered: 5-2002 |
Paul; nice post! Thanks! | ||
| dela217
Senior Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 588 Registered: 6-2002 |
My feeling is for the tribute style too. That is why I was comparing it to George Washington's hatchet. You know, the one he chopped down the cherry tree with. It is still in great condition, but over the years the handle has been replaced twice, and the blade has been replaced too. I am going to call the elves soon so we can talk it over. Michael (Message edited by dela217 on January 27, 2006) | ||
| tom_z
Advanced Member Username: tom_z Post Number: 274 Registered: 7-2004 |
Brother Paul, that was a splendid and most appropriate post. Michael, best of luck with your decisions regarding this wonderful instrument. I'll follow this thread with great interest. =) Tom | ||
| george_wright
Member Username: george_wright Post Number: 60 Registered: 3-2005 |
Tom said And so will I. The before and after contrast is stark! Michael, was this instrument insured? If so, does it look like the carrier will pay for repairs? | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3026 Registered: 6-2000 |
I thought the cherry tree was a myth - this bass really did suffer, but the comparison is valid. It's really hard to tell from the pictures, but the neck's stability is worrisome. I attempted to show the condition, but it's just at a difficult angle to capture the damage. In some places, there is close to a 1/8" difference in height between the Maple and Walnut laminates - it's extreme. Perhaps we could approach the project in stages, first more cleaning with oil, doing some restorative work on the body, and repairing the existing neck and hoping for the best. Only considering replacement if it actually fails in service. We can always repair it more in the future. Thanks for all your thoughts on this project. It's a labor of love, we were moved to assist in its restoration to help our old friend who lost so much. | ||
| 811952
Senior Member Username: 811952 Post Number: 641 Registered: 10-2003 |
I think leaving it to sit and dry out for a year before doing anything to it wouldn't be a bad idea. As the woods reach a point of moisture-content stability, I would guess that they would somewhat shrink and return to their pre-bath size and fit. John | ||
| keith_h
Advanced Member Username: keith_h Post Number: 320 Registered: 2-2005 |
I'm sorry about the loss. I noticed white deposits like I would expect to see from salt water. If it is then I would suggest a conservator be contacted to discuss leaching the salts out of the wood (such as soaking in distilled water?). If salts have leached into the wood they will continue to leach out and/or eat at the wood whenever it exposed to moisture. I'm by no means knowledgeable in this area but have read about similar situations. Keith | ||
| valvil
Moderator Username: valvil Post Number: 837 Registered: 7-2002 |
I've already told Michael over the phone, but I figured the rest of you would be intrigued by the fact that the electronics do work, somewhat. The bridge pickup is not working and there's consistent hum when you dial it in on the selector switch, but the neck pickup sounds great! Valentino | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 3100 Registered: 5-2002 |
Thanks Val! | ||
| lbpesq
Senior Member Username: lbpesq Post Number: 919 Registered: 7-2004 |
Alembic: Takes a licking and keeps on ticking! Where is John Cameron Swayze when you need him? Bill, tgo |
