| Author | Message | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3922 Registered: 6-2000 |
I understand from your last email you want the neck pickup moved .75cm farther away from the fingerboard compared to this bass. Please confirm that I understand your request correctly. | ||
| shim
New Username: shim Post Number: 5 Registered: 12-2006 |
Yes, Right~ Mica. :D | ||
| shim
New Username: shim Post Number: 8 Registered: 12-2006 |
And, someday, I hope to change my electronics to Series 2. Can you make the hole preparation for exchanging the electronics someday?? I think a fake nobs are necessary for this. Should I pay any additional fee?? | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 12 Registered: 12-2006 |
Mica, Happy new year :D Please confirm my answer about the specs of my bass. Thanx. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 13 Registered: 12-2006 |
And if I want to set bass and treble switch(flat/boost/cut) in my electronics, how much should I pay for that? There is not enough time to meet our appointment. Did you start making my bass?? | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3940 Registered: 6-2000 |
Prepping the bass for future Series II electronics is $1300 additional. This includes making the body thicker to actually hold the electronics, mounting the humcanceller pickup, making and mouting the two additional backplates, shielding the upper body half, mounting the 5-pin housing. We don't drill for all the future holes, just leave room so they can be drilled. Also, the bass will have to come back to the factory to have the electronics installed. While the prepping for the future electronics makes the job easier (and possible), there is still calibration work once everything is installed that must be done here. Take this into consideration when making your decision. This decision will have to be made quickly, since a neck made for your original specifications will not be thick enough for the Series II body thickness. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 14 Registered: 12-2006 |
Ok... It is too expensive to me. :D I don't have enough money.... So... I want to know the additional fee for treable and bass cut/flat/boost switch. I'll go to Signature electronics so you can start making my bass. Thanx Mica. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 15 Registered: 12-2006 |
And I want to know the additional fee for installing Fat boy. One Fatboy for the bridge, and onotehr AXYs for Neck. Please answer it. :D After knowing additional fee, I can decide the Pick-up for my bass. | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3941 Registered: 6-2000 |
Adding one set of switches is $400. This will control the bass cut/flat/boost and treble cut/flat/boost for the overall sound. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 16 Registered: 12-2006 |
So if I want to bass and treble switch in my bass, I should pay $800 , shouldn't I? | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3943 Registered: 6-2000 |
Only if you want 4 switches. With 4 switches, you have 2 switches for each pickup. The $400 quote is for adding 2 switches that control the overall sound. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 18 Registered: 12-2006 |
And, please answer the additional fee about installing FatBoy. :D We discussed about the AXYs and Fatboy, they told me the price of them might be same. Am I wrong? | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 21 Registered: 12-2006 |
Okay, Mica. Can I consider if I could pay for the additional switches? If I can afford to them, I want to have additional two switches which can control the overall sound. | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3959 Registered: 6-2000 |
From the tummy contour thread, I understand that you want to add: bass cut/flat/boost treble cut/flat/boost to affect the overall sound of the bass. These switches will be partially paid for by change from abalone inlays to mother of pearl. I'll add the FatBoy pickup and the switches to the order, adjusting for the inlays, and send the new details to Beaver in the morning. Thanks for taking care of all these issues, Shim. Now we can get the work started on your bass. Soon I'll be posting pictures in the build record area. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 30 Registered: 12-2006 |
. (Message edited by Shim on January 04, 2007) | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 31 Registered: 12-2006 |
Mica~ Thanx your help to make my bass. :D And I hope to say, Please choose the best top wood for my bass, like RagingBass. If you can, My all efforts to my dream bass, can be over~!!!!! | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 32 Registered: 12-2006 |
And, I wonder if you can install my additional switches, not 3 way toggle switch, but 3 way nobe like pick-up select nobe. I think the nobe would be more suitable in my bass. Can you install the nobes for me?? | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3963 Registered: 6-2000 |
Sorry, but 3-position rotary switches are not available from stock. Custom switches usually take 6-8 months to arrive from the manufacturer. The pickup selector switch is 4-position. Iy's a much more complicated (and expensive) wiring to use these rotary switches instead of the normal toggle switches for this operation. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 37 Registered: 12-2006 |
Oh... so is there any other choice to install my switch to nobe?? | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3964 Registered: 6-2000 |
You can have the function on a potentiometer rather than a switch, like the bass and treble controls on the Epic/Orion/Excel basses. Then you will have the funtion available by knob. The idea of the toggle switches is to have quick and repeatable changes available. When you change this to a pot, you'll gain all the settings in between, but you lose the quick access. It's just a question if you want quick changes or more available settings. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 38 Registered: 12-2006 |
is their cost more or same? If the cost of knob is more than switch (as I quess), I'lll go to the normal toggle switch. And If you say their costs are same, I'll think about them. It's just a small option about my bass and electronics will be installed after caving the bass, so you can make my bass in time. Please answer about my question, Mica~ | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 3965 Registered: 6-2000 |
It's a small amount extra for the knob style, $500 instead of $400. Your bass was started today. I prefer you make your decision within another week about the electronics so there isn't any delay when it comes time to route the electronics. We will place all the controls slightly differently depending on if you have standard Signature electronics, if you add the switches or it you add the knobs. | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 795 Registered: 11-2002 |
You should really think about whether you want "quick changes", or more possible settings. If you like the look of knobs better, and you do not really need to quickly choose one of three possible settings with the control, then I think you would be better off with the potentiometers (knobs with no fixed settings). With the three position toggle, you might find that you only use two of the positions, and wish you had more choices in between. If you need to be able to just flick a switch for a different sound, for a solo or something, then the toggles might be a good choice. But otherwise, I think it would be worth a small amount of extra cost to have a more flexible control. Just my opinion. Good luck. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 39 Registered: 12-2006 |
Thanx your opinion, bob~ I have a question. Is there difference in control range between knob and toggle? What I mean... If I install the toggle, how much dB could I add or cut? and... If I install the knob, how much dB could I control? is there difference?? | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 797 Registered: 11-2002 |
I am sorry, I don't know the exact values off hand. You may be able to find them in the FAQ section, or by searching, but you never know exactly what Alembic is doing these days. My guess is that the cut and boost on the toggle, would be pretty close to the extremes of the range with a standard knob. I think it is safe to say that a knob will get you at least as far as the two (non-flat) positions with the toggle; it may go a little further, but I don't know. Hopefully Mica will clarify this, but I believe that the knob will give you at least as much range, in both directions, as the toggle. The difference will be that the knob allows you to pick positions in between the extremes, and offer you more flexibility - if you are willing to twiddle the knob to find the right place. Again, my thinking is that the extremes are often less interesting than the positions in between. A toggle is nice if you need to make a fast change, in exactly the same way, but it can also limit your options. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 42 Registered: 12-2006 |
bob~ Mica posted about this discussion in the page "Alembic bass". check it. :D | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 46 Registered: 12-2006 |
So.... Mica, I decide about my electronics. I want to install the potentiometers (knobs with no fixed settings). And, Please advice about the lay-out of my electronics. My electronics will be one toggle for side LED, two Q toggles for each pick-up, two Q-control knobs for each pick-up, one volume knob, one Pan knob, and the additional treble and bass knob. Wow, so many controllers;;;; I have no idea about their positions, and you may have many experience in it, so if you suggest the outline of electronics in my bass, it will be very helpful. Thanx for your help, Mica and bob & bsee. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 48 Registered: 12-2006 |
And, about the type of additional knobs, I prefer Pointer knobs in your shop. | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 327 Registered: 9-2005 |
Hey Shim, I don't know if you're getting these or not, but I'd recommend 3-position Q switches. A 3-position Q (that goes either 0/4/8 or 0/3/6 or 0/6/9 dbs) is a VERY useful upgrade that is MUCH more versatile than the standard 2-position 0/8 db Q switches that are standard on the Signature, Europa, and Rogue basses. I'd recommend thinking about this. | ||
| shim
Junior Username: shim Post Number: 49 Registered: 12-2006 |
Hi, Mark~ Thanx for your suggestion. I know the 3-position Q switch is more versatile, but I should consider about the money which I can use in building my bass. Anyway, I will consider your suggestion. Thanx, Mark. (Message edited by Shim on January 07, 2007) | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 335 Registered: 9-2005 |
Hey, Shim, by all means, get what is right for YOU. I have experience with both the bass & treble toggles and the 2-position Q switch on my old Elan with Europa electronics; and my Custom Europa has the knobs/"potentiometers", and a "Q" that goes 0/4/8/12 dbs. In my opinion, Alembic's bass & treble knobs are not substantially more versatile than the switches (the 3-position toggles). The knobs only boost to 6 dbs -like the toggles- and -in my opinion- the cut isn't useful past -6dbs. It would be different if the boost range were higher; if we were comparing knobs with a +/- range of 12 or 15 dbs to toggles with a +/- 6 db range, that would be one thing. But since the knobs only boost up to 6 dbs, which is only a moderate boost, the "in-betweens" don't amount to much. And I've never used my knobs to cut past 6 dbs... it just doesn't sound good... there's no point. On the other hand, if you were to take that $100 for the price jump to the knobs, and put it into a 3-position Q, with an extra "in-between" position... THAT adds a LOT of VERY NOTICEABLE versatility. The standard "jump" of the Q from 0 to 8 dbs is a big jump, and the "Q on" and "Q off" sounds have a pretty big and stark gulf/contrast between them. I use my 4db Q setting a lot, and being able to vary it is very useful and satisfying. (I believe the price for the upgrade is or was $125 per switch, but confirm that with Beaver and/or Alembic -if you're interested.) Anyway, get what you want, and I don't want to complicate anything for you. It's just my opinion, and maybe being able to vary the nuances of the bass and treble is more important to YOU. It's just my opinion, and one thing's for sure... it'll sound GREAT either way you do it, and all that matters is that it's what YOU want! I'll look forward to watching them build your bass! | ||
| shim
Member Username: shim Post Number: 51 Registered: 12-2006 |
Thanx your explaination for building my bass, Mark~ :D So, in summary you recommend me, not the knobs of bass and treble, but 3-way Q switches, right? I do hardly understand your kind explaination, sorry. ( As I mentioned, I am poor at understanding English.... ) Or, do you recommand more wide range bass and treble knob with 3-position Q switches??? Or... 4-position Q switches?? .... I'm sorry, Mark~ I might not be able to understand what you mean. T-T Could you summary your opinion to me? If you can, it will be very helpful to build my custom. | ||
| bob
Senior Member Username: bob Post Number: 802 Registered: 11-2002 |
First, I suggest you forget about the 4-position Q switches, these are not standard and would probably take extra time and money. Mark says that for about the same price, you could get: a) toggle switches for bass/treble, and 3-position Q switches, or b) knobs for bass/treble, and 2-position Qs If you could spend more money, the best choice might be: c) knobs for bass/treble, and 3-position Qs If you cannot afford (c), then Mark would choose (a). He does not find a use for the extra cut you get with the bass/treble knobs. He also feels it is more important to have one extra Q setting. 3-position Q is much better than 2-position. The standard 2-position Q is 0/8dB. 8dB is a lot. If you really like Q, and want a switch that makes a big change in sound, this is fine. But some people find that 8dB of Q is too much, and would almost never use it (a wasted toggle). Instead, they choose a 3-position toggle, with values of 0/3/6dB (or maybe 0/4/8). Like the tone controls, it depends on whether you want to make lots of small changes, or just a couple of big ones. I agree with Mark that 3-position Q, with small range like 0/3/6, is much better than the standard 2-position Q. I do not agree that I would give up bass/treble knobs. The "in-between" settings with bass/treble knobs are much more important to me, personally, and I sometimes do use the extra cut. If I could not have (c), I would choose (b) - but change the values on the 2-position Qs to something like 0/4. (Really, I would just borrow some extra money and get 3-position.) My taste is different. I don't think I would ever use 8 dB of Q, but many people like this. Many people are also happy with toggles for bass/treble. I was glad to see that you decided to get the bass/treble knobs, I think you will like them. If you can afford to spend a little more, 3-position Qs would be worth it. I think again the choice is whether you like small changes, or big changes. I hope that helps. -Bob | ||
| the_8_string_king
Advanced Member Username: the_8_string_king Post Number: 336 Registered: 9-2005 |
Thanks, Bob, you did a great job of impartially summarizing my position. Shim, Bob pretty much summed it up. Ideally, if money ($) were not an issue, you'd get BOTH the (bass&treble) knobs AND 3-position Q switches (or just Series II with the CVQs). But, to the degree that money is an issue... IF YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE EITHER one or the other, then you might want to CONSIDER sacrificing the KNOBS for the 3-position Q. Really, Bob went and said it all. It's just a judgement/preference issue. And it's NO BIG DEAL. You WILL be very happy with whatever you get. It's just a minor suggestion, nothing to worry about. I found with the 2-position Q switch that is was almost "harsh" when you turn on the Q. It's a big "jump", going from 0 Q to 8 dbs of Q. I've seen a couple club members comment on this. Alembic electronics are so clean and crisp, that when you add the 8 dbs of Q (the standard setting for the 2 position switches) it's almost overpowering. I think having a SOFTER/LESSER setting is VERY useful. This is why several club members have ordered their Alembics with 3-position Q switches that go 0/3/6 dbs. But another option you could consider would be to ask them for a "lesser/lighter" Q setting. If you decide you don't want to give up your knobs, and can't afford a 3-position Q, you might consider asking them to make your (2-position) Q switch a 0/6 db switch instead of 0/8. Or a 0/5 or 0/4 switch like Bob said. Regardless, Shim, it's no big deal. You will be happy either way. I know Alembics are expensive... I recently ordered my 3rd. But I would recommend getting the 3-position Q. After dealer discount, we're only talking about 1 or 2 hundred dollars (depending on if you get 1 or 2 (3-position) Q switches). That's NOT really very much money; but the versatility you'll get from a 3-position Q (either 0/3/6 or 0/4/8) is MUCH GREATER than the standard 2-position (0/8 db) Q switch. Hope this helps, Shim. Mark | ||
| shim
Member Username: shim Post Number: 52 Registered: 12-2006 |
OK, Thanx at all, Mark and Bob. Your advice is so helpful in my decision. Actually, I want to get the Fodera bass, but once I heard the Alembic sound, I love it a lot. So I want to get the Alembic with their all versatility and their craftsmanship. But the price is already over my deposit. So, I would ask to Mica about the price of the additional 3 way Q toggle electronics. I hope get the last bass in my life, so it would be worthy to pay for. Thanx for your kind explainations~~ Mark and Bob. I would memory your help. Thanx. | ||
| bsee
Senior Member Username: bsee Post Number: 1444 Registered: 3-2004 |
Shim- The upgrade from 2-pos to 3-pos Q switches was $150 per switch two price increases ago when I ordered mine. It should be somewhere between $150 and $200 today. Personally, I can hear a difference between the extra settings, but don't find them significant enough to matter for live use. If you're planning on recording, they may help, but you should then also have access to more EQ options in the signal chain, making them less necessary. I do warn you that you need to get simple and come to a decision. Adding anything that is custom beyond Alembic's regular available components will add significant cost and time to your project. I don't believe that they just solder in a different resistor or cap to change values on switches with some testing and measurement. If you want maximum flexibility under your fingertips when you play, go for the bass/treble knobs and the 3-way Q switches. By the way, the standard 3-pos is 0/+6/+9. I would probably go for the bass/treble knobs over toggles in either case if I were planning to add that function. The 0 and +6 positions are just as repeatable as with the toggles and you do get a bit more flexibility. I find the +6 setting on the bass control to be a bit strong and believe that you would benefit from the flexibility there in particular. I would also say that control is great, but so is an attractive bass with great top wood. The more switches and knobs, the more I personally feel it impacts the natural beauty of the instrument. I don't know how you plan to use the instrument, so I don't feel comfortable making a hard recommendation for you. For me, I would start simple. My first add would be the bass/treble knobs and then, if finances allowed, I would go to the 3-pos Q switches. I would also consider some custom wooden or shell-capped knobs if I were adding that many controls to the instrument. | ||
| adriaan
Senior Member Username: adriaan Post Number: 1205 Registered: 6-2002 |
I like the subtlety of the 0/3/6 dB switch. The original 8 dB boost is very prominent, it adds a strong accent on top of each note that is too strong for my ears. The 6 dB boost adds a somewhat weaker accent, but still an accent. The 3 dB boost adds a nice sparkle when the filter is fully open, and else just a gentle 'bump'. I think I could live with just a 0/3 dB switch. | ||
| bassjigga
Member Username: bassjigga Post Number: 100 Registered: 8-2005 |
My custom is going to have a 3 position Q at 0/3/6. The upgrade is $150 retail. Like others have said, 8db is a big amount and to me the Alembics already sound so good flat, that I only do subtle EQing so smaller changes was the way to go for me. | ||
| davehouck
Moderator Username: davehouck Post Number: 4699 Registered: 5-2002 |
It would be my guess that the effect from the amount of db boost of the Q switch probably varies with how you have your rig set up (and probably with other factors such as the wood combinations in your bass) (and of course with personal taste). For instance, I can remember that before I got my first S1, the 8db boost on my Spoiler seemed like a lot. However, now on my two main basses, the bridge Q switch stays on 9db; I never back them off. I imagine it has a lot to do with how my SF-2 is set up; but I'm sure part of it is personal taste as well. | ||
| shim
Member Username: shim Post Number: 53 Registered: 12-2006 |
Mica, could you make my bass in time with additional bass and treble knobs and 3 way Q toggles?? It's important to make a decision. | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 4009 Registered: 6-2000 |
Yes, we will be able to accomplish both requests with the time available. Tony can make these modifications without having to book time on my dad's workbench. I will make a control layout for you to review in about a week. |
