| Author | Message | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 1 Registered: 7-2003 |
Hi I am a new member and this is my first post and my first Alembic. I got this bass a few days ago and I can't seem to find any information about it on the web site. I talked to Mica about it and she suggested that I post the pic here. Does anyone have any knowledge about this bass? I was told when I got it that this is a very old Alembic bass. It seems to be missing the switch on the front bottom horn. Also the two switches are both two position switches. Also I think the headstock has been repaired. Thanks for your help. David  | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 174 Registered: 6-2002 |
David - Wow. That is quite interesting. Does this bass have a serial number? It looks like an early one. The serial number should be located on the very tip edge of the headstock. It is stamped on both sides of the point, one side being the year, and the other side the actual number of the instrument. Those look like series 1 electronics and those 2 way switches are not original. I would bet they should be 3 way switches on that bass. Also, do you know the scale length of that instrument? Michael | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 2 Registered: 7-2003 |
Hi Michael, It has some numbers on the headstock edge. There seem to be two different types of stamps that were used to put the numbers on the headstock. On the left is a very clear 4 and Im not sure if there is a faint 7 before the 4. On the right side there are more numbers and it looks like two different stamps ere used. Looks like there were some numbers there that got restamped by a larger stamp. Hope that makes sense. The numbers that are the same size as the left side numbers are either 64 or 164. Stamped over those number are bigger numbers that are stamped more deeply into the wood. Those are 106 and then the stamp was turned perpindicular to the other numbers and a 4 was stamped. More details: under the neck plate is the trussrod and under the middle plate is the battery. Can you send a link to an explanation of the electronics? Im still trying to figure them out. Also the xlr does not seem to work. Should I be able to plug it straight into a mixing board? Im really trying to find out as much as I can about this bass before I finalize the trade. I need to make a decision by next Monday, August 4. Thanks for your help. David | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 175 Registered: 6-2002 |
David - If the bass were a 1974, the serial number would be in the 64 range. BUT, by serial number 64 the batteries were moved to the back of the instrument and not under the front plate of the bass. This bass could be older, or not. They were experimenting back then. If the bass were a 1974, then the pickups were definately changed. The pickups used back then only had one screw hole per side and not two. Also the Alembic embossing did not show up on the pickups until MUCH later. But I guess without a clear serial number, than it would be hard to tell what this bass started life as. With a good serial number Mica can usually tell all. As far as the XLR is concerned, that cannot plug directly into a mixing board. The XLR connector on that bass should be a 5-pin and not a 3-pin connector. The 5-pin connector is used with an external power supply. The power supply of course supplies power to the on board electronics and splits the signal for stereo operation. Is there any way you can get pictures of the inside of the instrument? From what you are describing, the bass may not have series electronics at all. If the positions on the toggle switches are only 2 way, you may have a bass that was fitted with signature electronics. Without holding that bass in my hands, that is about as far as I can go. Anyone else? Michael | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 176 Registered: 6-2002 |
One more thing, (I feel like Colombo)you mention that under the front brass plate is the battery. Did you mean batteries? The series electronics are an 18 volt set up. It would require 2 9 volt batteries. If there is only one battery, you may have signature electronics installed. That would explain why the XLR does not work! | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 3 Registered: 7-2003 |
Michael, thank you so much for all your insight. I wonder if this is a fake Alembic? Or perhaps an old one that got a lot of work done on it. When I talked to Mica she stated that they have always sold the parts that make up their basses. Seems like a lot of trouble to make a neck-through copy of an Alembic though. It does have the embossing on both pickups as well as two screw holes per side. Also the XLR is 3-pin. Plus somebody removed the switch on the horn, so maybe the electronics were changed at that time? Btw what does that switch on the horn do? Is it a pickup selector? I can't seem to find a good explanation of the electronics on the web. I can take a pic of the inside of the control cavity if you think that would help. thanks, David | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 177 Registered: 6-2002 |
A pic of the inside of the bass would definately help. That picture could tell what electronics are in the bass. By the way if it is a real Alembic, then the inside of the control cavity should be painted with a silver shielding paint. Also, it is hard to tell from the pictures, but it seems that there is no logo on the headstock. Or is it just badly tarnished? The pickups on the bass are definately later ones with 2 screw holes on each side. On those pickups there is a screw mounted on the inside of the pickup cavity for height adjustment, and another on the outside to hold it in place. Great design! While you have the camera out, take some additional detail pictures too. Headstock repair?? The bridge on the bass is also bit different than the others I have seen. The switch on the horn is supposed to be a pickup selector switch. It provides an off or standby position, and neck/both/bridge pickup settings. | ||
| davehouck
Member Username: davehouck Post Number: 98 Registered: 5-2002 |
It is a very interesting looking bass. I especially like the pattern of the top wood. David you are right, the switch on the horn was the pickup selector. Michael, the plates on the front look unusual to me. It might also be helpful to see the wood card for 74-64. My guess, the series electronics and pickups were replaced at some point with signature electronics and new pickups. In addition to the XLR, it would also explain why the pickup selector switch was removed. David, if they are signature electronics, then looking at the picture, the top left knob is volume, below it is the pan. The top right is the neck pickup filter and below it the bridge pickup filter. The switches are the Q switches for each filter. For an excellent description of how signature electronics work, see Mica's post at http://alembic.com/club/messages/393/1067.html. | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 4 Registered: 7-2003 |
Okay here are some more pics. No shielding paint in the control cavity.  | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 5 Registered: 7-2003 |
Wierd serial number. You can see the faint 6 on the left of the 0 and the faint 4 to the right of the 0.  | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 6 Registered: 7-2003 |
Front of the bass  | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 7 Registered: 7-2003 |
Headstock. You can see the three dowels at the base where there was a repair. No logo.  | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 8 Registered: 7-2003 |
Thanks for the link davehouck. So the signature electronics dont have a pickup selector? Also it is a 34" scale bass. Im really wondering about the double stamped headstock serial number. Can't figure out why anyone would do that. Does Alembic ever restamp a serial number? Like after a major repair perhaps? If the headstock was repaired and the electronics changed then that is a pretty major change to the bass IMO. Thanks for all the help. I really appreciate it. David | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 178 Registered: 6-2002 |
David - This is an interesting mystery. With that type of electronics, a pan knob is used insted of a pickup selector. In looking at the control cavity, it seems that there are remnants of shielding paint along the edge. Am I looking at this wrong? Does it look silverish on the edge to you? As far as the inside, I think someone would have to go through a LOT of trouble to remove the rest of it. Or does it look painted over with something else? What about the back plate that covers the electronics? Are there any holes in it? Is it brass? The smaller serial numbers on that bass look Alembicish. The rest don't. I have not heard of them restamping an instrument, but I guess it could have happened. I have seen some wacky and strange serial numbers. I had a bass from 1975 that I think was number 229. It looked like it was stamped 226, and then they turned the 6 around to make a 9 by stamping it again. It also had some ornate brass pickup rings similar to the bass you are showing us! I also own a 1973 Alembic that is stamped as a 1978. I have personally seen two basses with the same serial number, and so on. I guess back then there was some numbering confusion. I was also confused back then. Does it look like it ever had a logo? You may see 3 small holes that would have held the logo on to the face of the headstock. Perhaps the logo went away when it was repaired. It may have been reveneered and all traces of the logo taken away. | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 9 Registered: 7-2003 |
I didnt notice this before, but it does seem as if the control cavity was painted with a copper colored paint. Also there are 10 screw holes around the edge but the brass plate on the back only has 5 holes. It is a rather old looking plate. I see just one thing on the headstock that looks like a filled in screw hole. Im still undecided on the authenticity of this bass. Hopefully Mica or somebody from Alembic will offer an opinion. | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 179 Registered: 6-2002 |
I know it is hard to tell, but I am thinking it started out as an Alembic bass, but has had a hard and cruel life. | ||
| smichaels
Junior Username: smichaels Post Number: 14 Registered: 6-2002 |
could be an employee project...maybe? truss rod cover seems odd. | ||
| slam630
New Username: slam630 Post Number: 10 Registered: 7-2003 |
There are a lot of things about this bass that seem odd. Are there a lot of employee project Alembics out there? | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 180 Registered: 6-2002 |
Well, this bass shouldn't be serial number 74-64 since that is a short scale bass. Maybe it is 74-164? Michael | ||
| mica
Moderator Username: mica Post Number: 1054 Registered: 6-2000 |
The pickups and electronics are newer than the bass (part of the electronics are from 1985). It's hard to tell from the photo, but it looks like the swithcs are not our typical switches, and it doesn't look like Signature electronics to me since there is only one preamp in the bass. Is the large pot a master volume or a pan? I'll guess the two pots on the left side of the photo are volume for each pickup (note the pickup leads are plugged in there). The switches aren't for Q since these look like they aren't connected to the filter module (the one with the trimpot). Are these on/off for the pickups? The wiring in general also looks a bit messier than I'm used to seeing on our instruments. I'm also not aware of any instruments we made with a 3-pin output. The "switch" cover on the lower horn doesn't appear to have a hole under it. The nothes in the bridge are also unusual. The tailpiece is unlike any I've ever seen. Many things about the bass say Alembic, but there are things that don't quite add up, most notably the lack of a logo or its evidence and the weird serial number. If the guitar is an early 70's model Alembic, the electronics were absolutely replaced. Regarding the peghead repair, do those dowels on the front go all the way through to to back? Bone nut is not unheard of, but I'd call it rare as original equipment on an Alembic. There's an unknown number of employee project instruments out there. If this was an employee project, it looks like it was started in 1974 and finished in 1985. As I work on the great big database of Alembics, we may be able to track down and see if any records match what we see on this bass, but that query is many months away. About the serial number. I can't map the (6)10(4)6-4 to our serial number format. Are there any numbers stamped on the other side of the point on the peghead? It will be interesting to find out what the history behind this bass is. With Columbo (dela) on the case, and the rest of us Alembic hounds, if it's a solvable mystery, we'll figure it out. | ||
| slam630
Junior Username: slam630 Post Number: 11 Registered: 7-2003 |
The large pot is master volume. The switches are on/off for each pickup. The switch cover hole is there and connects to the control cavity. The dowels in the front go all the way through. What would the nut material typically be? IMHO it seems to be a replacement nut. There is a 4 on the other side of the headstock. There seems to be a very faint 7 in front of the 4 but I'm not sure. I just got back from my first time playing this bass with a band. Everyone loved it. Very nice thick tone. | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 181 Registered: 6-2002 |
As someone who used to work for Alembic once said : "Tone is trump." If you like the bass, plays and sounds great, then there you go. A few other things though - I once owned an Alembic that also had a bone nut, that is why I did not comment on it. It could be correct for that bass. I thought that there was a time that Alembic used bone nuts only on fretless basses. I notice that there are no inlays on that bass. Could it have one time been fretless? Hmm. If the bass is in fact a 1974 then the serial number could be 164. But number 164 should have been made in 1975. I would have had a hum cancellor mounted between the two pickups. I would bet that the battery cavity is the same size as the cavity for a hum canceller. But if that bass had a hum canceller installed inside the body, it would have been mounted in a cavity under the tailpiece. Is there a cavity visible under the tailpiece from inside the bass? Also is there another brass plate on the rear of the bass near the control cavity. The pictures don't show the full rear. On the basses with the hum canceller on the face of the instrument, the batteries were mounted on the rear. Also, if the bass had a serial number of 1064 as the larger numbers show, that would put the bass as being a 1978 instrument and not a 1974. | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 182 Registered: 6-2002 |
By the way I also have a 1974 Alembic that has a control cavity plate with 5 screws holding it in place. But there are 10 holes! | ||
| scrub
New Username: scrub Post Number: 1 Registered: 7-2003 |
Hi guys, new here in the forum, but I've played Alembics for a long time. May I just take the opportunity to say, "what is up with that tailpiece?" - it looks like it was hand hammered or something (the horn switch cover looks sort of similar too). It also reminds me of some of the rough "gold nugget" type of jewelry I've seen before, and actually, the more I look at it, the more I sort of like that textured effect. I've never seen brass develop pits like that, so I have to assume it was intentional. | ||
| elzie
Intermediate Member Username: elzie Post Number: 160 Registered: 8-2002 |
Welcome to the club scrub! HHmmm, that sounded kinda funny.... The tail piece looks as if it was peined to look like wrought iron. I also have to agree with dela. If it sounds good and feels good....... Paul TGO | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 183 Registered: 6-2002 |
Scrub - I think the hammered effect you are talking about on that tailpiece could be correct. I have some early Alembics from this era with the same hammered features. Hammered backplates, hammered battery plates, even that little brass plate that the selector switch mounts to - hammered. What strikes me as strange is the shape of the tailpiece. I have not seen another quite like it. I agree, I think it is a nice textured effect. I would say that it is definately intentional on this bass too. | ||
| dela217
Intermediate Member Username: dela217 Post Number: 184 Registered: 6-2002 |
Scrub - Check out this picture of the back of one of my basses.  | ||
| scrub
New Username: scrub Post Number: 3 Registered: 7-2003 |
elzie: Thanks for the welcome! Glad to be here! dela: Ya, that's definately some peen bashing there on that backplate. None of mine ever had anything like that, I've never seen it before. I know whatcha mean about the shape of that tailpiece. I think it sorta looks like a pre-historic Flintstones version of the current tailpiece design. | ||
| slam630
Junior Username: slam630 Post Number: 12 Registered: 7-2003 |
Close up of tailpiece  Switch plate also has hammer marks  | ||
| slam630
Junior Username: slam630 Post Number: 13 Registered: 7-2003 |
There is not an extra plate on the rear of the bass. I looked in the cavity for the hum canceller but didnt see it. I thought about the possibility of it being fretless at one point. From the looks of the fretwork I would not be surprised. The fret slots look a little funny. Almost like the slot extends deeper than the fret itself. |
